Entitled attitude: grandparents must provide childcare

This thread has attracted some complete nutters.

I don't really understand the "well I hope they don't expect looking after in their old age if they won't help with the grandchildren" argument. My parents never babysat for any of their grandchildren except in emergencies but it didn't stop me and my siblings caring for them in their last years. I never saw things in such transactional terms anyway, but if I had done, the care I was "repaying" was everything they did for me when I was growing up. I didn't expect them to have to gain extra credit by looking after my children too. They worked their socks off bringing up me and my siblings so if it's necessary to do something to deserve the support of your children in your old age, they'd more than done that before I even thought about children.

What?
How have grandparents created this?

Before I get to my point - I have two children and a partner and we work full time with no grandparent support - they are deceased.

Growing up my mum didn't work and as a family we coped on a single income that my mum managed. My dad who earned the income would have no idea about the family budget - she managed it all. Reading it back - it almost sounds like she was controlling but she was ensuring the bills were paid we were fed.

We ran one car and had one camping holiday a year. Very few new clothes and we didn't eat out much etc. she did all the decorating at home.

My point is - I often read that families need two wages - but is that due to a rising expectation of how we live? I am sure we spend more not just because prices have gone up but we consume more.

I agree.

I'm so sick of being told I didn't need to work in the 70s and 80s.

Another thing that baffles me about assumptions concerning women, is that if you don't need to work then it must follow on that you don't want to work.

I have a professional career. I love my work; it matters to me, and I like to think it offers a significant contribution to my specific field. No matter how much money my family had I would still keep on with my job.

No. They chose to have a child, and in doing so, chose to care for that child. I care for DD without any expectation that she will care for me in my old age. What you’re saying is a bit like walking your neighbour’s dogs without telling them because you love dogs, then announcing afterwards that they owe you in return.

The fact she used her own mother for the same?

@Thomasina79 Agree. We're in our 50s, work FT and we help out with our grandkids with sleepovers etc. quite frequently but it's honestly knackering and tbh I can't imaging what it would be like if we were 67, even if retired. We're both pretty fit but I don't think either of us would have the energy.

We do it through choice because a) they're adorable and b) we want to help our kids so they can work but I do think we'd actually resent it if it was actually expected of us and I would urge parents to try and take this aspect into consideration - kids are really, really hard work when your older and not quite as nimble as you used to be!

WTH?!

My DGM isn’t responsible for me choosing to have a child, neither is my DM.

@EveningOverRooftops

its the least she could do is it? Really? What makes you say that exactly?

And that's absolutely fine! Who is saying it's not?

That’s really sad, I would look after a neighbours child while they gave birth if I didn’t work/have work that day so I would definitely do it for a family member. That’s not entitled of you at all to be upset they wouldn’t do that for you.

Are you a " Submissive"?

"Grandparents that don’t want to provide childcare (which is their right) can’t really demand/ want/ expect care in old age, not because it’s a tit for tat but it’s reciprocity."

Really hate this school of thought - it is not reciprocity to expect grandparents to bring up their own children AND provide childcare to their children's children in order to be cared for in their old age. You care for your parents in their old age because they cared for YOU when you were a child - that's the reciprocity!!

Title says grandparents but lets face it, it means grandmothers.
As I said on another thread, it's a toxic blend of sexism and ageism that assumes older/post-menopausal women have little inherent value, and are therefore intrinsically selfish if they don't sacrifice their own best interests.

Jesus do people not understand the difference between general trends and personal anecdotes.

The baby boomer generation IN GENERAL had it easier in terms of stable jobs, university grants, lower house prices, free NHS care, final salary pensions etc. Their kids are not so lucky IN GENERAL and are going to have to struggle more, work longer and earn less in less stable jobs. Study after study has shown this.

Jumping up with an anecdote that is different to the general trend doesn’t disprove the trend!! Aka “well that wasn’t the case for me. I’m a boomer and we had it tough. We used to have to get up out of the shoebox at twelve o'clock at night, and LICK the road clean with our tongues. We had half a handful of freezing cold gravel, worked twenty-four hours a day at the mill for fourpence every six years, and when we got home, our Dad would slice us in two with a bread knife.”

Of course not everybody in the boomer generation had it easier and not everybody in the current generation has it tougher, but that is the general trend and it is generally harder to look after a family, pay childcare, work and own a property these days than it used to be. That doesn’t mean grandparents have to help of course, (my parents don’t and I don’t begrudge them it, they are old and not especially well and even if they were young and vigorous it would be their choice, albeit a choice I’d find a bit hurtful). But if grandparents can help a little and would like to, I expect it would be very gratefully received by most of their kids. Especially those that are struggling that but harder

Seems to be a conflation of issues.

Expecting regular free childcare = arguably entitled

Having zero help/enthusiam from family = fucking hard and it hurts. Why would GP not want to be involved at all?

Dotjones · Today 14:30
Everything a child does, even when they reach adulthood, is ultimately the responsibility of their parents and grandparents. Therefore it's right that grandparents should be expected to provide free childcare for their grandchildren; if they didn't want to do this, they shouldn't have had children of their own in the first place, that way the grandchildren could never have existed.

Crikey, a new level of crazy even for MN, surely?

Presumably she brought your husband up. Not that I'm keen on relying on children for care in old age but if she spent years caring for your husband I don't really see why she then has to do years caring for his son in order to qualify for care in her old age. Maybe she thinks you husband will want to protect his "inheritance" rather than repay her for care.

I don't want my kids to be caring for me, nice if they visit but if I'm in a decent home I'll be fine.

I don't understand this. How can grandparents have created the need for both parentsto work?

oh, I can absolutely acknowledge that people don’t, and to that extent I understand, but at the same time it is hard to understand the motivation behind some decisions people make when the negative consequences are both significant and obvious. Incidentally, something being understandable does not make it any less a bad decision, and one that someone could refrain from making. They may not like refraining from making it, but that doesn’t change the fact they have the ability to.

For what it’s worth I do have a car, travel a fair but, and have more than four outfits. All of which are beneficial to my life and I can comfortably afford without negatively impacting myself. I don’t have gas fired appliances, credit cards, or children. I don’t eat red meat and I limit my intake of sugar. I also don’t drink alcohol.

As I have written on a similar thread recently not all grandparents have the stamina to look after young children. I am 67 and recently retired and found it difficult to keep up with my beloved three year old grandaughter! I certainly did not expect my mum to step in back in the day.she was in her 70s! She had my two daughters when they were primary age one day in the holidays, but I didn’t expect it of her.

Heaven help that a woman in her late 50s/ early 60s, who's probably been in paid employment much of her life and has to work until she's 66 or 67 or 68 before the state pension kicks in, and who's looking after the elderly members of the family should say no to also looking after grandchildren.

It's always grandmothers, isn't it? Always the women expected to do the elder care and the childcare. It's horrible seeing the sexism promoted here.

@Faciadipasta exactly. I’ve been a carer for both my parents, but I won’t be lifting a finger to help my inlaws or encouraging dp to provide any care when or if they need it. Unfortunately selfish people will reap their rewards.