To ask if Co-Ed is better than single sex..

@CHiSOCG I suggest you listen to this teacher

A local independent school uses a Diamond approach so co ed but English, Maths, PE and science are done separately. I think it's a great idea!

No but maybe without the girls to use to baby sit the boys at school the teachers might actually have to start dealing with the behaviour. It doesn't do the boys any favours does it. They aren't born this way. This behaviour is something the adults around them lead them into. The parents rely on the schools to guide them in their time there as they can only do what they can when they are at home and the schools outsource it to the girls.

What hope do they have.

Whatwouldscullydo I grew up in the Netherlands and there was none of that. I do think British lad culture as a whole has an awful lot to answer for, and having single sex schools as a break doesn't resolve that issue.

Also I don't think things are gonna change until people/parents stop getting defensive over their sons husbands and brothers and start realising there is actually a problem.

When you serve stag dos that have ordered a stripper to the pub, when even the police are getting hammered and have a bucket beside them incase their shot game makes them sick, when bar staff are called a fucking fat slag because you politely ask someone to drink up and leave because the 20 mins " drink up and fuck off" time is over...then you might realise what they get up to when you aren't around.

It starts in school. As much as no one wants to admit it..it starts in school.

I went to a co Ed. I hated it. It got so old and boring being called fridgid/gay/stag all the time just because you turned a boy down.

I was supposed to be at school to learn not be asked for blow jobs in art class.

The disruptive kids in my classes happened to be boys. They dominated and disrupted in any class the teacher was soft or inexperienced or ineffective.

I have no idea if I would have fitted in at a single sex either, but all I feel co Ed prepared me for Really was a.lifetime of being harassed, groped, treated like public property.

Try serving all your " nice boys " in a.pub. then see if you think they are so nice as they comnent on your underwear, pink your trousers/underwear. Comment on your arse etc

Its disturbing how easy it is to get tips out of them with nothing but a slightly low cut top...

No the world isn't single sex but sometimes the break is just nice. Otherwise u just have t wait til.your forty and finally invisible

I come from Germany where single-sex schools are utterly unknown in the state sector so the idea was bewildering for me.

DD is 15 and now goes to a all-girls school. We didn't really have a choice here and after nearly 5 years I think she absolutely thrives.

Hardly any bullying or bitchiness. In my opinion it has a lot to do with the school's leadership, it is absolutely not tolerated and stamped out as soon as possible. Jewellery and make-up are no-gos and will cause detention.

They do the same subjects as the boys next door, it's not a girly envrionment. They are actively encouraged to think beyond gender stereotypes and only take the sky as the limit. I like the fact that there isn't really any competition to impress the boys or dump themselves down to attract a boy (seen at friend's co-ed schools unfortunately).

Saying that, social interaction and learning to deal with boys is necessary. So we purposely sent her to Scouts and now she is an Explorer Scout and according to the leader she can tell whose in an all-girls school as most of them don't take any rubbish from the boys.

I think it depends on the child. Myself my older Dsis, my 2 DD and my DS all went to the local single sex comp schools.
I was fine, my Dsis hated it, we are totally different personalities.
My older DD was fine, 2nd DD hated it and really struggled with the dynamics. My DS was definitely best choice and was fine.

Also, I actually find the discourse around sexuality pretty old fashioned. There seems to be an idea that boys are all potential rapists with one thing on their minds, while girls are all potential victims who need to be tucked away chastely to preserve their innocence. I don't know about you, but I seem to rember having one thing on my mind too when I was 15! Girls need to learn to be powerful agents who control their own sex lives, choosing how much sex they want to have when and with whom, rather than pretending that it's boys who are interested in sex not girls, and that girls need to be removed to shield them in a sexless environment. That surely just perpetuates the idea that men are the desirers of sex and women are the gatekeepers - it's almost a throwback to the idea that boys who have a few sexual partners are studs while girls who do the same are sluts.

What proportion of the sexual assaults and sexual harrassment which occur in schools (and indeed in general) do you think are perpetrated by girls and women? The 'It's old-fashioned' line doesn't stand up very well to the evidence. Yes of course teenage girls have sex on their minds, but tbh I think it would be naïve to suggest that they seek to pursue it as relentlessly as many boys or that it is as present in their language, attitude and treatment of the opposite sex as it often is with boys.

Suggesting that it's actively a good thing to put girls as young as 11 in a position to have to navigate this to 'train' them is worrying. It's boys who need training - not to behave this way. I say that as a te a teacher of over 25 years' standing (in mixed and single sex schools of both sexes) and mother of a teenage boy and a teenage girl. It's no wonder we see so many teenage girls trying to identify out of being girls. I wonder how the figures for that compare in single sex vs co-ed.

No one is saying all boys are bad 🙄. Sadly there is a strain of misogyny in our society and you can get a core of dominant boys who behave like that towards the girls there’s not much the nice boys can do about it. See the “Everyone’s Invited” evidence.

There’s no right or wrong mine are thriving at an all girls educationally as my older one is quite quiet and I know she would have retreated in class with boys around. That said some friends girls would have been happier in a mixed school.

It's not just this school. He has had 3 different female helpers? personal assistants? across three different primary schools and now has someone similar at secondary school. It's a common primary school thing to pair boys with attention/behaviour issues with calm (bossy) girls to take some load off the staff. I did it when I was younger for praise and because I was socialised that it was right to help. I'm guessing that still works.

Adding to this not all young boys are sexual predators, waiting to pounce on your daughters, most are good lads like mine who is into Pokémon at 11yrs old, playing with his friends, loves maths and IT etc and also wants to learn

As a mother of boys I find this thread too much about female children and the pros for them, most anecdotes about girls etc

Please can we hear more balanced accounts from mothers of sons in single sex schools, less distractions from girls who have all been painted here as vulnerable, studious types who have finally been allowed to get on with their work without the 'distraction from boys',

but what about the quiet, academic boys who develop deeper friendships with their peers, feel less pressure to attract girls at school, try traditionally female subjects such as cooking, textiles, English or coding etc rather than constantly told that sport is the way to go

My DS will be going to a religious single sex school which is also very academic, and many leave the school going to Oxford and Cambridge, so surely it can't be that without a co Ed environment boys will not thrive at all

Off topic but I’m a teacher in a mainstream coed secondary. I’m going to do some research into how many girls identify as trans or non binary in single sex compared to coed schools. I think it will be very interesting.

Wow. That would be very interesting to see the results!

my DD went to a single sex grammar, and it’s mixed at 6th form where she is now. It’s been brilliant. No school is perfect of course, but 100% single sex for girls all the way. Let’s them develop their personality and strengths, allows a redress of the inherent sexism in society between the school walls and leaves them confident and articulate in my experience. Of course they see boys outside of school, so it’s hardly segregation like a OP suggested.

I made the further maths / drama point based on looking around secondary schools for my dd this year, and asking questions about numbers in A level classes. At the mixed ones, no girls did further maths and no boys did drama.

So locally, it’s quite clear that co-Ed schools in effect have single sex classes in some subjects at A level, based on stereotypes about girly and boyish subjects. May not be true everywhere, I wouldn’t know where to find that data. And I agree that exceptionally tough and determined DC can buck that trend. But I don’t want my dds to have to be exceptionally tough and determined, but to feel all subjects are equally available to them.

Wtf? That sounds like a school problem not a coed problem. Have you told the school that it is not appropriate for them to 'allocate' your son a girl to look after him, and you are opting out of this particular arrangement?

Single sex is better for academic girls from personal experience. In co-ed they take the conscientious girls and use them as pacifiers for the more feral boys.

I was the conscientious girl for years and my son in year 7 has been allocated one as well. She is lovely and reminds him when he has an exam, gives him stationery as he's always losing his and tells me what he's up to on parents evening as he has no idea. He does not consider her his friend and she has never visited our house.
All great for the boys but straight away socialises the girls to not think of themselves first.

This resonated with me. I went to a single sex school. Whilst I loved it, I did have an unhealthy attitude to men and sex at university and for a while afterwards. In addition I now think growing up with teenage boys may have helped me deal with some of the men I have been unlucky enough to work with.

However, just like this PP, I've visited the co-ed comps and the single sex grammar near us and the grammar blew me away. The aspiration, the choices far exceeded the comp. I know that's a grammar vs comp thing, but the choice aligns with this debate.

Interestingly, DD who is in Year 5 said last night that even if she gets a place at the grammar, she may go to the comp because of having boys there.

It's such a hard choice and we'll never know how the other option would have turned out.

I just don't see how the answer to the #metoo problem is for girls and women to withdraw into a single sex environment. Look at the other spheres in which women are harassed - do we tell women who are catcalled on the street that they should walk down special women only streets instead, or actors who are coerced into sex by bullying directors that they should make women only movies? There would be an outcry. Surely the answer to sexism in schools has to be to refuse to tolerate it, not run away from it?

Also, I actually find the discourse around sexuality pretty old fashioned. There seems to be an idea that boys are all potential rapists with one thing on their minds, while girls are all potential victims who need to be tucked away chastely to preserve their innocence. I don't know about you, but I seem to rember having one thing on my mind too when I was 15! Girls need to learn to be powerful agents who control their own sex lives, choosing how much sex they want to have when and with whom, rather than pretending that it's boys who are interested in sex not girls, and that girls need to be removed to shield them in a sexless environment. That surely just perpetuates the idea that men are the desirers of sex and women are the gatekeepers - it's almost a throwback to the idea that boys who have a few sexual partners are studs while girls who do the same are sluts.

On a separate note, if the current trends around gender fluidity continue rather than being a blip, then I don't think SS schools will be sustainable as a concept anyway. Schools (and local authorities) are already struggling with how to approach issues around admissions policies, uniforms, toilets, subject choices, segregated boarding houses etc. If this continues, then I suspect the only feasible answer wil be to make schools as gender neutral as possible,.

We couldn't get our only child into a co-ed so had to scramble for a place at the remaining single-sex schools.

DD's school promotes a feminist ethos. It's a STEM school, and encourages girls to pursue careers in areas not traditionally populated by women. The school pushes the girls very hard to achieve. Obviously boys aren't distracting my DD's learning. The sports programme is wide and varied. If she stays onto sixth form, then it's mixed with the boys from the nearby boys school. But Y7-11 is girls only.

So her friendship group is only girls. Her experience of boys has only been in primary school and the occasional friends' boyfriend who tags along to social occasions (and of whom my daughter has labelled "very disappointing" with their attitude towards girls). She hasn't got any male friends and of the boys she does meet outside school she says "they only want one thing". I wonder if she had gone to a co-ed she might have made at least one male friend and had a different take but I will never know.

Op, get your husband to look up how many girls are raped or sexually assaulted in co-ed schools, how many girls have been filmed/photographed without their knowledge, and then look up how many boys are expelled and/or jailed for committing sexual assault. I'm guessing he doesn't know just how badly girls are being let down by mixed sex schooling, and with unisex toilets and changing facilities the problem is just getting worse.

Totally depends on the school (and specifically the HT) and the child imo.

Round here I wouldn’t send my girls single sex if you paid me. Single sex is statistically better for girls, but that one has a HT who states that bullying “never” happens in her school. Yet it’s reputation for bitchiness, bullying and the likes is rife. The school roll (and Ofsted grading) is dropping bit by bit.

The co-Ed has a HT who ruffled a lot of feathers when she arrived. Particularly with her zero tolerance approach to low-level sexual assault or comments. The number of boys who were put in isolation in her first month were sky high. It’s had a very positive effect on the school overall though - she’s doing a great job.

Single sex was the worst thing for me. The bitchiness was insane, girls are vile to each other, even more so when there are no boys around. Bullying was far more rife than at co-eds that family members at the time went to. I also don't think it is a good idea to spend so many of your formative years away from the opposite sex. I was lucky, outside of school my friends were mainly male so I didn't go crazy like most of the girls in my year did when they met boys!
The competitiveness at the school was off the scale, about everything, not just academically or sport related, but appearance, clothing (despite uniform), hairstyles, literally everything. It was a hideously toxic environment and needless to say my DC went co-ed!

My dd goes to a single sex comp. She really likes it and enjoys the freedom to speak up more in class, and the fact that nothing is seen as “for girls” or “for boys” as everything is for everyone.

She goes to a youth club with lots of boys (mainly from her primary) and has another hobby that’s mixed and very social. So not missing out on male company.

Will probably send ds co Ed if possible. He has lots of female friends and I don’t think would thrive in an all male school.