To send my eldest to grammar school knowing it’ll be a squeeze?

In the case of Manchester Grammar it used to be a state grammar school with a very high reputation so they hung onto the name after becoming independent because it was so well known.

My son went to an 'independent grammar school', his dad had gone there when it was a state grammar. They dropped the 'grammar' from the title after a while and it just became '....School'.

In the past many independent schools had grammar school places, which we called 'free' places. I went to a GPDST (now GDST), school on a free place, along with many others. It was referred to as a grammar school. That stopped quite a while back; then there were 'assisted' places but they have also ended. Now it's just fee paying with some scholarships and bursaries for pupils who qualify.

@surreygirl1987 no I wasn't suggesting that

I'm simply musing that that Manchester Grammar School and Porstmouth Grammar School are not grammar schools despite their titles and they are private schools that are also public schools.

I know in Manchester it all causes a huge amount of confusion for newcomers as you have Manchester Grammar (independent/private/public) but also several state grammars. Then in Birmingham you have several King Edward schools, some are grammars without grammar in the title, some are grammars with grammar in the title, some are independent/private/public, and some are comprehensives

@drivelpants @Howshouldibehave but some have 'grammar' in the title and are members of the HMC which means these private schools are actually public schools.... illustrating both the confusion on this thread and the absurdities of our language confused Examples are Manchester Grammar and Portsmouth Grammar.

Maybe I missed this when writing my thesis about them, but can you please explain to me why you think 'grammar' needs to be in the definition of 'public school' (if that is, indeed, what you were suggesting)?

@Howshouldibehave but some have 'grammar' in the title and are members of the HMC which means these private schools are actually public schools.... illustrating both the confusion on this thread and the absurdities of our language Examples are Manchester Grammar and Portsmouth Grammar.

OP has obviously already decided she will send her daughter to private school! Which isn't good or bad - it's her family's decision, but always slightly irritating when people post with a question they have already answered for themselves.

What happens if your old car/phone/washing machine/boiler breaks and needs replacing?

Exactly this. OP's finances are finely balanced. Without private school fees/extras absorbing any modest surplus small financial bumps in the road could be handled. With school fees/extras, which at my local private school have to be paid on the dot for bursary students (it is specifically mentioned in bursary t&cs), the risk of upsetting the balance is huge.

There are independent grammar schools.

And the people claiming to be confused about OP’s use of ‘grammar school’ - the entire premise of the post is about whether she can afford the fees, so surely it was pretty obvious it’s a fee-paying school, presumably with ‘grammar’ in its name, not sure OP needed to be berated quite so much for this, a tiny bit of common sense or a polite clarifying question would do!!

I would prioritise sending DD to this school if you possibly can. It sounds like a brilliant opportunity and it doesn’t sound like you’re saying you’ll be on the breadline if you do.

You're clearly very proud of your DD and well done to her! She's obviously very bright, doing so well without tutoring. I think you'll regret not letting her go. You've said you have good prospects and you have the skills to do private work so go for it. Your DD will be forever grateful.

@Abraxan the point is that anyone working in education should know that the standard meaning of “grammar school” is “academically selective, free state school”. The school OP is referring to may well have “grammar” in its name but her dilemma is all about how to afford the fees. Therefore, when posting here, she needed to explain in clear terms that the school was a “grammar” in name only, but that fees were payable.
Yes, exactly this. However, the OP did eventually clarify that she actually meant an independent school rather than a grammar school.

@Abraxan
Like many private schools use the title High school units name. Locally people will refer to those schools as 'the grammar school or 'the high school' in my experience (from being in a non grammar area) so I can totally see why the OP may well have dine this - something which they then clarified in one of their later posts, for those not used to seeing non state selective using the title.

That's really odd. Having spent my career working in independent schools, including one named something 'High School' and one named something 'Grammar School' (in fact, my husband works in a different something 'Grammar School' at the moment), I have literally never come across this, and would find it really odd if someone started saying 'the High School' or 'the Grammar School'. People use the actual school names. So I can fully understand why many people were confused by the OP - including myself (and I have written a doctoral thesis on grammar and independent schools!).

Parties were exactly the same sort as those of DD's friends in state schools.
Trips were of the same ilk, with the more local or shorter ones being included within fees. It was only the residential type ones we paid for and they were the same price as local state schools.

I'm sure there are some private schools like that but my experience definitely wasn't.

[quote HaveringWavering]@Abraxan the point is that anyone working in education should know that the standard meaning of “grammar school” is “academically selective, free state school”. The school OP is referring to may well have “grammar” in its name but her dilemma is all about how to afford the fees. Therefore, when posting here, she needed to explain in clear terms that the school was a “grammar” in name only, but that fees were payable.

Let me explain this for you.

My dog is called Kitty. If I post on here and say “Can anyone advise me the best food to feed my pet Kitty?” I am going to get 100 recommendations for cat food because people automatically go with the standard meaning unless told otherwise, and I should know that it has to be explained.

OP could be excused from not knowing that the default meaning of “grammar” means a state school if she had had no professional involvement in educational after all, grammars are not in all counties now and her local independent school is called X Grammar- but as a teacher you’d have to be living under a rock not to know this![/quote]

I also work in education and have done for 25+ years, plus used private education for DD's primary and secondary education.

Many areas throughout England do not have grammar schools. The only 'grammar' schools in some areas are private ones which use the grammar school title in its name.

Like many private schools use the title High school units name. Locally people will refer to those schools as 'the grammar school or 'the high school' in my experience (from being in a non grammar area) so I can totally see why the OP may well have dine this - something which they then clarified in one of their later posts, for those not used to seeing non state selective using the title.

You can try and make it a bigger deal and use it to try and trip the OP up if you really want, but tbh it says more about you as a person than it does the Op. 🤷‍♀️

Not all bright children flourish in less academic environments. Some will do well anywhere, but others will sink.
^

This. And remember peer pressure is a powerful thing for a teen.

From someone who ended up a total underachiever due to bad secondary school choice by my parents, please send her to the grammar and let her fly. Reach her potential.

You mentioned trips @ Fri 04-Mar-22 15:28:12 🤓

Aiui lunches at state schools are paid for by parents unless you qualify for free school meals.

When you say lunches at the private school are ‘exactly the same’ do you mean price or content?

My kids’ school meals are covered by the fees although they are accounted separately so you can see the price. The trips that are not covered by the fees are optional.

You know your daughter, if you think she will flourish at this school then absolutely send her. Not all bright children flourish in less academic environments. Some will do well anywhere, but others will sink.

I’m sure OP will find the best schools for her other children when the time comes, but I don’t think it’s fair that her eldest daughter should miss out in the name of ‘fairness’. For all the talk of the younger siblings resenting her, is it not equally likely that she could resent them for, as she may see it, holding her back? It cuts both ways. Equity is preferable to equality.