Partner unhappy with botox & more

OP, I don't think either of you are being unreasonable.

I actually didn't take your partner's response as manipulative. I just took it to mean that she was disappointed and upset because she's realised you have different values on something that might be important to her. She was probably crying because she's scared that if you do it, she'll lose her attraction towards you, and she doesn't want to feel that way. I think it's completely possible to love someone but for certain things to still be able to change the way you think/feel about them. How much just depends on how much it matters to her.

At the same time - it's YOUR body! Absolutely do whatever you please with it. Her take on it doesn't matter. It's just that she's communicated something that's true for her: "In the past, I've lost attraction over this kind of thing".

I've been in a similar situation on both sides.

My last ex liked to get Botox and other things done. It was a turn-off for me. But that's NOT because these things are weird. For me, it was reflective of a bigger compatibility issue - which was that she was very insecure, unhappy with her life overall, and quite obsessed with youth and beauty and materialism. I felt like... what happens when I'm 50, 60, 70? Will she find me repulsive? What about 35? 40? Will she be turned off by the lines on my face? It just made me uncomfortable. It just made me realise we were on different pages. I've just always liked natural ageing lines and stuff like that. I find it really attractive.

On the other hand, my ex before her hated tattoos and made it clear that if I got more than one, she'd have a problem with it. I understood, but got as many tattoos as I wanted anyway. It's my body. I don't regret it one bit.

At the end of the day, I think it's completely ok for a person to express what they do and don't find attractive. It would be way worse if they said nothing, you got something done, and then they aired their feelings after the fact.

But it's her choice, none of my business.

Done by a plastic surgeon, no one should be able to tell as such. You should just look "fresh"

Well, it depends. One of the people I know whose "work" is obvious actually IS a plastic surgeon! I'm assuming she has it done by another surgeon - to be fair, I don't know exactly what she's had done, it could be far more than Botox.

Loving all these posters who believe themselves to have the moral high ground, who don’t give a shit what they look like and who above and beyond any trifling, shallow concerns about their appearance and ageing.
Just all feels so disingenuous and actually ironically…false!

I recall a lot when I was younger, getting jobs based on my appearance (which was then, very pretty). Naturally that improved my self confidence. As I've aged, naturally my attractiveness has waned a bit and I don't place a lot of importance on it compared to in the past but I still make an effort with my appearance to look good.

If you'd got jobs based on natural ability or qualifications that would have improved your self confidence similarly and ability is less vulnerable than appearance to the vagaries of the passage of time.

As you say - as you've got older your confidence is less linked to your appearance and ultimately looks will wane. So you've developed a more integral self confidence. But some women lose confidence as they age because their looks are impacted.

This could have become a discussion of how the beauty industry preys on women.

Did you read it?

This could have become a discussion of how the beauty industry preys on women. It could have been a discussion of the patriarchal standards of aging and finding a balance between fighting sexism and feeling complicit by participating

Loads and loads of posters have addressed these issues. Did you not read the thread?

I find it very interesting that so many have turned this into a defense or attack of Botox itself. It’s clear that OP’s partner has a problem with these kind of cosmetic procedures in general. It’s not a debate about the quality or results of the specific procedure. There are real societal influences at work here. This could have become a discussion of how the beauty industry preys on women. It could have been a discussion of the patriarchal standards of aging and finding a balance between fighting sexism and feeling complicit by participating. Instead, it’s a debate on whether or not Botox looks natural.

I don't have it done by a plastic surgeon. He's a former GP. Occasionally if he's not available, a nurse does it. They all do each others' as well. None of them look stretched or frozen or trouty. They look like perfectly normal people without heavy lines.

I think its unfair to hold women who have procedures responsible for perpetuating ideas about women's appearance. Physical attractiveness will always be highly prized, and this will not be changed by women opting not to enhance their appearance. If everyone was completely natural, the naturally beautiful women would still be held up as a standard to aspire to, just as they were before procedures were available. Yes, it's a great pity women's appearance matters so much in our society, and if you want to distance yourself from that by not enhancing your own, fair enough. But it won't stop female beauty being prized or women being judged on their appearance, even if we all did it.

Done by a plastic surgeon, no one should be able to tell as such. You should just look "fresh"

In reality though most people don't have it done by plastic surgeons, they have it done at beauty clinics and don't know when to stop. One of my friends started off with "a bit of Botox to freshen up" and has moved on to a trout pout and cheek fillers.

Most of us don't look anything like celebrities, with or without Botox. And if you think Botox is the only thing famous women use, you're just showing, again, how very little you know about it.

I put off having it for ages because I was so sure, despite having no experience, that I would inevitably look like Pete Burns and, of course, that it would make me a Morally Bad Person. All bollocks. Nobody noticed and I may be headed for hell, but it won't be because of this.

OP, the point is, do what you want with your body! People judge people who get Botox, and other people judge people who “let themselves go”. You can’t please everyone so please yourself.

Botox is actually used in all kinds of ways. For example, it can be used to treat excessive sweating and has been found to be very effective for tremor due to Parkinsons.

Personally I base it on all the women I know at the gym and at school who think no one can tell

Occasionally one of them will confide in me that they've had botox or fillers and I always act shocked and say I couldn't telL

If only occasionally they confide in you how do you know the vast majority of them think no one can tell are you psychic?

It's your choice what you do with your body.

It's your partner's choice whether she leaves because of what you do.

Are you sure you both are compatible?

Where do you draw the line OP?
If you have botox I'll leave.
If you dye your hair I'll leave.
If you go on a diet I'll leave.

Let her leave.

Her reaction is a bit OTT but I must admit I'm not into the fake look either.
To my eye most cosmetic procedures are obvious and many start off with the odd tweak before it becomes all consuming and while striving to get the "the look" any natural beauty and contours are lost.
Look at the many celebrities who have opted for botox and fillers and now just look a bit ridiculous.
Subtlety is really key.

@Gonnagetgoing

Women with Botox unless you look at their expressions no not generally

Expression is exactly what you're looking at when you're talking to someone. That's why it's noticeable and somewhat eerie.

[quote PrimroseBed]@DrSbaitso Again, you’ve put your own views in here (“minor and morally neutral”). Sound like OP’s partner doesn’t share your views.

The fact is, OP gets to choose what to do with her face, the partner gets to choose whether to stay with her. Given the partner’s strength of feeling, it sounds as if that won’t be an easy choice. That’s why she’s upset. If you just want to say that you think she’s wrong, knock yourself out.[/quote]
Oh, well thank you ever so much.

Ok, I think she's wrong, and I think it's clear that she and many others on here put a moral value that doesn't exist on it (in at least some cases, because they want to do it themselves), and I think crying at your partner over it is manipulative. And I think she can't love OP that much if she would actually reconsider the relationship over the skin equivalent of a balayage. Half a balayage, really. Most people don't do Botox more often than once a year and the procedure takes about 90 seconds.

Personally I think OP should just go and do it on the quiet. Partner won't even notice.