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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Male midwives - aibu

445 replies

Ikeasucks · 15/09/2021 11:54

My 27 yr old niece is pregnant and we were discussing the coming birth - she said she would like to put female only midwife on her birthing plan but is worried how the staff, her friends etc will react as one “friend” told her she was being sexist and bigoted for taking that view. Aibu in thinking it’s perfectly fine and understandable for women to want another woman at such a time - it it’s possible

OP posts:
XenoBitch · 15/09/2021 15:25

YANBU it is totally understandable in circumstances such as this. Anything that would help put the soon to be mother at ease is a good thing, surely.
Only time I would say it is unreasonable is in emergencies, or when under a GA. Insisting the whole surgical team, anaesthetists and circulating team are female would be a logistical nightmare. Or even any awake procedure where there is a team of people involved.

Loudestcat14 · 15/09/2021 15:24

There are also male lactation consultants with is just a fucking joke frankly. And yes it does make me wonder why these males seek these roles out.

What an abhorrent comment to make.

jerometheturnipking · 15/09/2021 15:23

I once had a heated debate with DH about male midwives.
His argument - isn't it great that they care about the lives of women and want to bring babies into the world.
My argument - if they cared about women they wouldn't put them in the position where they feel guilty about wanting to refuse their care on the basis of wanting a female environment.

Doomscrolling · 15/09/2021 15:23

Far and away my best birth experience was an all female team. It wasn't something 'done to me' it was something I was a part of. It made a difference to my recovery of the previous birth traumas.

No woman should ever feel bad about requesting female HCPs.

saleorbouy · 15/09/2021 15:21

A round of applause for equality, most of you are dismissing a trained professional midwife (should this even be a job title anymore?) purely on gender.
Would you also send out a male gynogologist? I'm sure the doctor who performed my vasectomy would not have been impressed if i'd turned her away because of her gender and neither would you MN ladies.
This is equality, men performing traditionally womens roles and vice versa you can't pick and choose!

EishetChayil · 15/09/2021 15:19

I asked for women only and nobody batted an eyelid.

Evesgarden · 15/09/2021 15:18

Every woman would be seen by a female midwife.

Only some wouldnt mind being seen by a male one.

There is barely enough midwifes to cover the floor on any given day so why are we giving a precious place to a male when there would be zero issue with a female midwife.

Why should women have to weigh up being left with no midwife and possible danger or giving in and allowing a male midwife attend to her?

There are also male lactation consultants with is just a fucking joke frankly. And yes it does make me wonder why these males seek these roles out.

Anon778833 · 15/09/2021 15:16

At the end of the day, there is still a power imbalance in society in favour of men. Which is why the OP's niece isn't bigoted.

Original poster
Ikeasucks · 15/09/2021 15:13

*I still think. that we need to work on why do females are not comfortable with male medical staff.

Obviously there are reasons behind asking for female staff, abuse is one of them. But I often feel there is a general issue with it and I really think. it is deeper ingrained in us female*

Because they feel vulnerable? Because they might be more relaxed and open to another woman when they feel vulnerable. Different but i request female masseuses too - because i want to he relaxed and enjoy the experience- not feel uncomfortable or exposed to some strange man

OP posts:
MrsOvertonsWindow · 15/09/2021 15:12

@reluctantbrit

I still think. that we need to work on why do females are not comfortable with male medical staff.

Obviously there are reasons behind asking for female staff, abuse is one of them. But I often feel there is a general issue with it and I really think. it is deeper ingrained in us female.

I think a lot has something to do with the view we have of our own bodies, not feeling comfortable being naked around other females in a changing room or even around our own children.

Isn't it. time to start thinking about this and working on changing it and then hopefully the idea. of female care only comes to an end and we judge nurses/midwives by their job not their sex/gender?

It's not women that need changing reluctantbrit Statistics are clear that men make up the vast majority of sex offenders. While serial sex offenders like this work in the medical profession no woman should ever be guilt tripped into having intimate medical care from a male hcp against their wishes or instincts. And just look at what can happen to children when parents trust the hcp. Totally depressing.

londonnewsonline.co.uk/midwife-who-downloaded-hundreds-of-indecent-pictures-of-children-avoids-jail/

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-30273548

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9316361/Doctor-58-groped-female-patients-breasts-medical-exams-court-hears.html

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/4287180.stm

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/doctor-groped-nurse-and-patients-r29xnmxlg

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/dec/03/child-abuse-carried-out-under-guise-medical-treatment-inquiry-told

Feelingoktoday · 15/09/2021 15:10

@toomuchlaundry

I had female midwives (didn't request them) but as others have said they are in the majority in that occupation. But the consultant who had to do the James Herriot impression and stick his hand up and pull out my retained placenta was male. At that point of time I didn't care who was doing that. It certainly was not in my birth plan! So your niece may have to be open minded that things may not go totally to plan, and if so that is probably more likely to involve male medical staff.
Yes I agree but she still has the right to choose the sex of her midwife. It might not go to plan but she still has that right. In London, I would imagine many Muslim women make this choice too and we don’t question them we embrace it as inclusive.
toomuchlaundry · 15/09/2021 15:07

I had female midwives (didn't request them) but as others have said they are in the majority in that occupation. But the consultant who had to do the James Herriot impression and stick his hand up and pull out my retained placenta was male. At that point of time I didn't care who was doing that. It certainly was not in my birth plan! So your niece may have to be open minded that things may not go totally to plan, and if so that is probably more likely to involve male medical staff.

Feelingoktoday · 15/09/2021 15:07

@Whatwouldscullydo

I think a lot has something to do with the view we have of our own bodies, not feeling comfortable being naked around other females in a changing room or even around our own children

I'd say it was more a consequence if everything that happens to women and girls at the hands of men. Don't trivialise centuries of abuse and oppression by making it sound like we are just paranoid about our stretch marks or something Hmm

Exactly!! I don’t have any issues at all regarding my body. Yet I can still recall the 15 mins I spent in a Family planning clinic with a male GP at the age of 18 and how it just didn’t feel right. I don’t need to be told that I felt weird because I had body issues or that I need to be “taught” to accept a GP just because he is a GP.
Marguerite2000 · 15/09/2021 15:03

@HarrietsChariot

Yes she's a bigot for only wanting a female midwife. It's no different to her only wanting a white doctor or only wanting a male plumber.

You can't pick and choose equality.

Yes, you can actually. It's specifically allowed under the equality act. Some areas are exempt from being called discriminatory, and intimate medical care is one of them. These exemptions refer to sex, not race. Not sure why you brought race into it?
Feelingoktoday · 15/09/2021 15:02

“Isn't it more important to teach females that male medical staff is there to help us? I had bad experiences with female GPs, do I shunt down all of them?”

Really find that expression “teach females” gross. We have have the right to say no to anything we are not comfortable with. We do not “teach females” anything where their gut reaction is no.

montysma1 · 15/09/2021 15:02

A wish another female for intimate procedures is most certainly not discriminatory.

Didactylos · 15/09/2021 15:00

I find it very understandable how a patient might accept male doctors/anæsthetists/other staff while still wanting their midwife to be female - its to do with the nature of the relationship and care provided. A midwife being with you as a one on one for many hours over a labour builds up a different rapport and sees a different vulnerability to other professionals who have a more transactional relationship eg they see you when the situation warrants it, not across the whole of pre natal care/labour/4th trimester and really are there to deal with whatever issue is at hand, and normally are there in the presence of other team members, not as your sole care person.
Its perfectly understandable that people might have different comfort levels which would allow them to accept other male professionals while wanting their midwife to be female

Skinnytailedsquirrel · 15/09/2021 15:00

Your niece has a strange "friend" if that friends thinks requesting a female midwife is "bigoted" That is a scary attitude for someone to have and I guess she's one of those rainbow flyers.

Shadedog · 15/09/2021 14:59

I have female everyone when I have the choice. I have had male hcps at deliveries but I have had my female midwife there too. You are alone with a mw in a way you aren’t with an obstetrician or anaesthetist etc. There is also likely to be more than one midwife on duty. The ideal situation is to labour nice and calmly and have a low intervention birth with a mw, not to have someone there who makes you uncomfortable when you at your most vulnerable and told you should just get over it because if you need intervention a whole team of men will be there. I know some women are comfortable around unknown men but that doesn’t negate other woman’s discomfort.

Whatwouldscullydo · 15/09/2021 14:59

I think a lot has something to do with the view we have of our own bodies, not feeling comfortable being naked around other females in a changing room or even around our own children

I'd say it was more a consequence if everything that happens to women and girls at the hands of men. Don't trivialise centuries of abuse and oppression by making it sound like we are just paranoid about our stretch marks or something Hmm

Feelingoktoday · 15/09/2021 14:57

@daisyjgrey

What absolutely blows my tiny brain is that there are people all over this thread saying that it is AWFUL to request a female midwife for what is probably one of the most vulnerable situations you will ever be in, but Mumsnet is famously populated by people who will fiercely argue that transwomen are still biological men and shouldn't be able to use the same toilet as them.

Pick a side! You can't have it both ways. Or is it just that you only have an issue when it makes you bristle personally?

This I agree. But people get confused between sex and gender and don’t appreciate how important it is to separate the two.
ChloeCrocodile · 15/09/2021 14:55

Maybe we need to get annoyed at WHY countless women don’t feel comfortable feel males in an intimate space, not direct anger at said women for saying no.

Absolutely this!

Also, being okay with male doctors and not midwives isn't about any sort of seniority, it is about the specific type of care you are receiving. I had mostly male nurses during my only hospital stay and I didn't mind at all. But they weren't doing intimate care. If someone needs to examine my hand, ankle etc I don't care what sex they are. But when it comes to my vagina I'd absolutely prefer examinations to be done a woman.

TheWayTheLightFalls · 15/09/2021 14:47

Totally her choice but a) there are very few of them b) I'm another one adding to the chorus of those saying that I had a male MW and found him great. He actually came in to talk me through breastfeeding. Initially I was bemused but then realised that the, say, 22 year old female MW would have as much lived experience so it's not a reason to decline imo.

reluctantbrit · 15/09/2021 14:44

I still think. that we need to work on why do females are not comfortable with male medical staff.

Obviously there are reasons behind asking for female staff, abuse is one of them. But I often feel there is a general issue with it and I really think. it is deeper ingrained in us female.

I think a lot has something to do with the view we have of our own bodies, not feeling comfortable being naked around other females in a changing room or even around our own children.

Isn't it. time to start thinking about this and working on changing it and then hopefully the idea. of female care only comes to an end and we judge nurses/midwives by their job not their sex/gender?

daisyjgrey · 15/09/2021 14:43

What absolutely blows my tiny brain is that there are people all over this thread saying that it is AWFUL to request a female midwife for what is probably one of the most vulnerable situations you will ever be in, but Mumsnet is famously populated by people who will fiercely argue that transwomen are still biological men and shouldn't be able to use the same toilet as them.

Pick a side! You can't have it both ways. Or is it just that you only have an issue when it makes you bristle personally?