To think that JK Rowling is being very unfairly treated.

I agree, and am called a TERF for it, but I believe in safe spaces for biological women and girls. I have nothing against trans people, and am for anyone living the best and happiest life they can, but this is sets a dangerous precedent for women. I feel particularly defensive of lesbians who, it seems, have no place anywhere.

I know of some woke parents who have pretty much planted the idea in their kid's mind from birth that they maybe in the wrong body - so all orchestrated by the parent - all for the parent's own woke vanity. Very damaging to the child's sense of identity and mental health. Again, it's a form of child abuse.

And calling the child "they" or whatever other pronoun FROM BIRTH - wtf! Makes me so angry - on behalf of the poor child. Cue years of therapy.

F your pronouns' and 'Notorious Transphobe'*

Those badges are funny/ironic - nothing wrong with them

How is that funny?
Fuck your pronouns
Hilarious

@printmeanicephoto
I would quite like to see the data that say it is not abuse to use puberty blockers in a tiny minority of kids.

I think for a good proportion of transitioning kids, prescribing puberty blockers is tantamount to child abuse.

[quote BudgieHammockBananaSmuggler]@ImpatiensTo be direct, if person going through male puberty lives their life as a woman, they will just look like a man in a dress. Which may have have ongoing psychological impact for their whole lives. A more ‘natural’ transition may avoid this. That’s the basic point.

It would be difficult to identify this small group as you say. However I would exclude anyone who experienced dysphoria as a teenager and would only consider those where there was strong collateral information that the person had lived as the different gender for essentially their whole life[/quote]
This comment is a disgrace.
The group is so tiny that none of us can identify it. There are no other options left on the face of this earth, in this time and age. So a child who cannot vote and is being used as an experimental rat basically has to go through with it and the world is so black and white that there is no other support available to help this child. All that’s left is a puberty blocker to ‘naturally’ transition into the rapid decline of a body that is perfectly healthy and rigorously growing otherwise.

What the fuck is wrong with you? Have you ever read even the most basic biochemistry before writing such irresponsible shit online?

Where does the money trail lead to?

An 18yo is more likely to be able to make a complex decision than a 12yo. And in the meantime their body hasn’t gone through the physical changes of puberty. That’s the point of puberty blockers.

And neither has their brain gone through the physical changes of puberty.

Not only has their physical development been halted, distorted and damaged, so have their mental and emotional development.

An 18yo who has been on puberty blockers for several years does not have the mind of an 18yo who has experienced puberty. I doubt they are any better able to make such a complex decision than they were at 12yo.

Un medicated, over 80% of trans-identifying teenagers desist. Medicated with blockers, over 90% continue to cross-sex hormones. Does this tell you that clinicians who prescribe blockers have a stunning ability to identify 'genuine' trans, or that blockers are part of the problem?

Anyway I am bowing out as it is tomorrow now and I realise I have derailed this thread from the original topic. Hurrah for JKR! X

@ImpatiensTo be direct, if person going through male puberty lives their life as a woman, they will just look like a man in a dress. Which may have have ongoing psychological impact for their whole lives. A more ‘natural’ transition may avoid this. That’s the basic point.

It would be difficult to identify this small group as you say. However I would exclude anyone who experienced dysphoria as a teenager and would only consider those where there was strong collateral information that the person had lived as the different gender for essentially their whole life

YANBU - She's 100 percent correct IMHO.

Cancel culture is just wrong on so many levels.

Some woke lemmings are so "open minded" their brains have fallen out.

Life is sweeter without Twitter in it. The powers that be at Twitter have no problem censoring when it suits them, but they turn a blind eye to offenders with whom they sympathise. It's a sick place.

Of course there are issues with puberty blockers.
What you call ‘issues’ are basically ‘adverse events’ and are adverse enough to not be approved, hence the off label use.
It boils my blood.

Thanks @Impatiens for appreciating that I am generally agreeing with the arguments here (in this thread and many others)

Really my only point is there is a small group of people where the situation is more complex and I don’t think they should be lumped with the much bigger group of trans people that (rightfully) stoke up debate here on Mumsnet and everywhere else.

For this group of people it is more complex. There are no right answers. Of course there are issues with puberty blockers. Of course! But this has to be counterbalanced by the risk of not using them. I’ve only brought up puberty blockers as this was mentioned on the very first post. It’s just one aspect of the incredibly complex decisions that this tiny percentage of whom I consider to be true trans people have to struggle through.

Anyway I’d be interested to hear if anyone understands what I am trying to say. I’m not naturally argumentative!

Yanbu.

BudgieHammockBananaSmuggler
An 18yo is more likely to be able to make a complex decision than a 12yo. And in the meantime their body hasn’t gone through the physical changes of puberty. That’s the point of puberty blockers. I accept your point that they may cause brain changes that arguably might affect later decision making, hence the need for detailed evaluation. You seem to be characterising me as simplistic, when actually I am trying to point out that the reality is more complex.

This is true. But in the meantime physical side-effects of the puberty blockers may well have done that 12/13/14/15/16/17 year old actual harm, which is not reversible. Bone density cannot be magically restored, blood disorders carry on, joint problems don't disappear, sterilisation seems to be for the rest of your life, and so on. It's quite a gamble to assume that a given individual will suffer none of the ten-per-cent-possibilities: there are an awful lot of them to not-get.

And nobody seems to have the slightest idea what they may do to the function of the thyroid, because it seems that nobody has even checked. The only gland they are sure puberty blockers alter is the pituitary -- and you mess with any of the ductless glands at your peril, because they are all fairly carefully balanced and if they get out of whack they tend to stay that way unless you have medical intervention, in the case of the thyroid for the rest of your life.

Maybe it's worth it; at the moment at least, a thyroid problem gets you free prescriptions. And you are going to need those if you transition and go the route which leads to life-long medication.

@BudgieHammockBananaSmuggler
I was being sarcastic when I write puberty blockers don’t affect brain.

DISCLAIMER: DON’T try this at home.

The brain is an organ. An organ in which lots of changes occur during puberty. Quite frankly I would be very surprised if puberty blocker don't have somewhat of a negative effect on brain development.

You need at least two groups of children in a clinical trial for this sort of experiment: one that receives a puberty blockers and one that doesn’t.
There are many other factors that need to be considered but I should stop here.

It's actually quite sickening. We are using these children as guinea pigs. Just pump them full of drugs and hope for the best.