To be annoyed at IVF comments

I do think societal and sociocultural pressures saying people to have a great job and at least one MA, five years worth of bloody wages in the bank as savings and at least four bedrooms and have known their partner for at least ten years or you may as well be having a baby with a stranger, or don’t bother TTC until you can safely pay for private school or you’re completely reckless, or you ‘should travel as much as you can before you have kids!’ or whatever people say. I see it on here all the time. ‘Why are you having a baby when you don’t even own a home, you’re putting yourself in a precarious position!’ Etc...

So many of my female friends have waited and waited through living in the flat in London and it not being good enough for a child, no schools good enough nearby blah blah, and when they finally have their big house in the suburb with the grammar school catchment and the good job and the car and the big wedding too, they’re in there mid to late 30s with partners in their 40s and it’s not happening as fast and it’s heartbreaking for them.
Not saying just getting pregnant at 20 with the first fella you fall in love with is an amazing idea either but there has to be a middle ground.

First of all OP, massive sympathy for you - infertility is shit.

The problem is that the NHS is unsustainable in its current form. It simply can't continue to meet the health needs of the population if things stay as they are (even if taxes rise and funding increases).

This is largely due to the far higher health costs associated with an ageing poulation.

So, changes will need to be made to the NHS. This may include some things not being covered that we would ideally like to have covered (IVF being one of these). Alternatively there will need to be some kind of point-of-service contribution.

Snowflakes they indeed are cancelling appointments. The lady told me on the phone when I enquired, that all non-essential appointments were being cancelled. She didn’t know when they would resume.
I do wonder when things return to normal again if there will be another slash of nhs departments budgets due to the massive recession/depression we will have financially.

Maybe they will do away with fertility treatments full stop?

I think obesity should be treated where children are concerned though

Yabu theres certain drugs that are deemed too expensive on the nhs for cystitis fibrosis which would extend someone life. My 2 year old nephew would benefit from such a drug. Theres many cancer treatments not available due to budgets which could save lifes. The NHS is a valuable asset we are lucky to have we are the only country to have this everyone else pays through insurance.

@Strawberryshortcake28 I am completely with you. I’ve been there and absolutely get it. Don’t read the comments on this thread. Inevitably you’ll get all the ‘children aren’t a right’ and ‘just adopt’ crap that is so prevalent on mumsnet, surprisingly enough from people who’ve never had to fight to have children. Please ignore them and know that you are absolutely justified to feel how you feel.

How bloody rude to compare it to diseases linked to obesity or smoking! In the majority of the cases, the infertility is not caused by something the patient has done.

people do like to say having a baby isn’t a ‘right’ and I’m always interested in where this list of ‘rights’ is as far as the NHS goes. Do you have a ‘right’ to antibiotics for an ear infection? Do you have a ‘right’ to physiotherapy after a car accident? Neither are strictly necessary.

I don’t think anyone actually wants to see an NHS run on the best principles of utilitarian medical ethics. I remember watching a documentary about the debate around treating very premature babies in NICU - there was an NHS manager basically saying if it was up to her she wouldn’t treat babies born at 23 weeks but unsurprisingly it wasn’t a popular opinion.

Do you really think IVF is going to be available on the NHS in the future??

Just one of the many changes to come....

Yes, but if people had to pay for all that there'd be a lot less people desperate for a child I'm sure. It's only because it's free

Although it isn’t essential to procreate, if we are going to stop the NHS using resources on providing a loving couple with a child with a child, then we’d better stop spending on all things that are other people’s fault.

1. Sports injuries
2. Type 2 diabetes
3. Smoking related illnesses
4. Hip/knee replacements where it’s caused by obesity
5. Car crashes when someone is at fault, charge them for the injured’s care

I won’t go on and on as I’m sure you get the point!

But if we stop treating infertility where do we draw the line?

Also what @Dyrne said 100%! If people don’t think having children is important enough why should anything related to childbirth be paid for by the NHS? I bet people would feel differently on the IVF issue if they had to fund their own scans, treatment, labour etc because it was their choice to get pregnant.

Exactly.

Who is saying this?

They are not being unreasonable to have that opinion.

They are, however, being very unreasonable to express it to you given your situation.

I get that I'm not ill as such, as my infertility isn't for any diagnosed reason. But my body obviously isn't working as it should, seeing as I was unable to get pregnant. I chose to adopt so I came to terms with the fact that nothing could be done for me, but quite clearly there was something wrong.

first you need to do some reading too.

From the WHO...

www.who.int/reproductivehealth/topics/infertility/definitions/en/

I am one of the very lucky people who got pregnant from the one nhs ivf cycle I was allowed. People are very quick to have opinions on ivf and some of the comments I read are just horrible.

I will be forever grateful that our wonderful nhs gave me the amazing gift that is my gorgeous dd and no one can know the heartbreak of infertility unless you have been through it.

Also what @Dyrne said 100%! If people don’t think having children is important enough why should anything related to childbirth be paid for by the NHS? I bet people would feel differently on the IVF issue if they had to fund their own scans, treatment, labour etc because it was their choice to get pregnant.

With all due respect it is not a disease, it will not kill you. In my job I have seen people suffering from horrendous things but not having a child is not like dying in agony of cancer.

@ElonsMusk my DC has also had his appointments to monitor his autoimmune condition cancelled too. I don’t think certain health conditions are being singled out for being left at the moment. It’s across the board sadly.

for all those with cancelled appointments for various things within the NHS

How about doing a bit of reading @namechangegamechange2

The world health organisation recognises it as a disease.

God, I hate this.

The NHS isn’t struggling because of IVF. In fact I’m willing to bet it’s a drop in the ocean of its spend. People just love to pass judgment on what they think is ‘worthy’ and unfortunately IVF is an easy target. You could stop all the IVF and the NHS would still be chronically underfunded.

I hope you tell these people to piss off!

The NHS is a wasteful almost bottomless pit of inefficiency, there are plenty of things which could be cut or processes improved to be better quality and value for money rather than cutting IVF. Horrible attitude no doubt from people who have never had to deal with it, I do think the criteria should be the same across the board though and not vary by trust.

Can you please stop calling it a disease.

If people are making those comments to your face they are being very insensitive. You are allowed to be angry about the situation but people are allowed to disagree with you. I don't thank that infertility is a disease and I don't agree that the NHS should pay for it. There isn't a bottomless pit of money and so many other services and drug to treat illness are underfunded.