Was I rude? To have told her to stop hinting and just ask me directly....

@fedup21 its more to make sure to keep the bill even as if out with fiancé it comes out of the joined account so I don't want to order king prawn starter and lobster main with a cocktail if all he is having is dough balls, cesar salad and a diet coke etc. I feel guilty etc.

If out with others if it is the first time I have no clue how they want to split the bill that is most convenient for them do they want to split evenly, each pay for own, take turns? I want to know what is easiest for them. If we each pay own it could take longer to sort the bill maybe they just want to take turns so we can just pay and leave without faffing about. So to keep it simple I try to match the cost

She wanted OP to offer, so that she could feel valued, or special in some way. She wants the OP to offer to share her Jaffa cakes because she wants to feel like OP cares for her.

^^ This.

A family member's sense of entitlement was so vast that he used to confuse making a request with having to beg. Effectively, it was:

Give me [X] without me voicing a desire for it. I will mock you if I don't want it. But my wrath will be unending if you don't offer it as tribute to me. Likewise, if I have to tell you that I want it, you're forcing me into the servile position of having to beg. And my wrath will be unending etc.

Some people substitute martyrdom and spoon-stirring for wrath but you catch the drift.

@redappleandaquamarinebow1987 I see where you're coming from, but gosh, people generally don't mind someone asking for a favour, with a quick, no harm no foul if it's not a goer, I understand it's putting you out.

If you said, 'gosh it's hailing out', I'd most probably look out, and agree, and that would be that, not realising that you were actually wanting a lift - I really can be that dense if otherwise occupied - and the person hinting is not my mother! Which is a shame, because I'd happily give you a lift.

Ok here is a scenario 'i could say oh no it is hailing outside' or I could say 'mbosnz I really hate to trouble you. You see the issue is as you know I don't drive and it would be a one hour walk back home and the bus is never reliable in this weather so I could be standing out there even longer. I normally would not ask for a favour like this but as my house is on the way to you could you please give me a lift. I realise this is a busy time for you so please feel absolutely free to say no I will have to figure out something else. I know you probably just want to be left alone after work I am really so sorry...'

If you told me it was hailing, I’d have a look and agree. End of the conversation unless we wanted to talk about the weather for a bit.

* So I can only order a cocktail if fiancé is having a beer or cocktail too. I can only have a desert or starter if everyone else is and it has to be their choice to have one so I need to go last etc

I feel for you but bloody hell... I sympathise with your fiancé and friends. Exhausting and irritating having a friend like this. add worse by fact they often feel they are being easy and accommodating, when they’re really really not

So I can only order a cocktail if fiancé is having a beer or cocktail too. I can only have a desert or starter if everyone else is and it has to be their choice to have one so I need to go last etc

This sounds like you have a fair few anxiety issues about what is acceptable or not socially.

I would argue that hinting was definitely not!

@ mbosnz sorry forgot to tag you in the previous post 😅

Ok here is a scenario 'i could say oh no it is hailing outside' or I could say 'mbosnz I really hate to trouble you. You see the issue is as you know I don't drive and it would be a one hour walk back home and the bus is never reliable in this weather so I could be standing out there even longer. I normally would not ask for a favour like this but as my house is on the way to you could you please give me a lift. I realise this is a busy time for you so please feel absolutely free to say no I will have to figure out something else. I know you probably just want to be left alone after work I am really so sorry...'

Good riddance, OP! Now cut her a wide berth. She can hint at someone else. Stop handing over your lunch, FFS. Ignore her. She knows it won't work anymore.

to me it is a way of saying I really need help with xyz but please don't feel like you have to help I feel bad enough for asking and I hate being a burden by pushing interaction with me onto you so please do feel free to say no if you don't want to help etc

But why on Earth wouldn't you just say that?!

@SamVimesFavouriteDragon I can see where you come from but to me it is a way of saying I really need help with xyz but please don't feel like you have to help I feel bad enough for asking and I hate being a burden by pushing interaction with me onto you so please do feel free to say no if you don't want to help etc

RedApple the difference in your situation is it sounds like you are just waiting for other people to go first? Hinting would be 'oh I really fancy a drink! Oh but you're not having one are you? No, I can't have one then. I'll feel bad if I'm the only one drinking.' Etc ad nauseam. That would be you making people feel they had to have one.
I think the difference between your (as you called it) people pleasing and the hinting is that hinting is designed to make others please you!

Sounded like you were the adult OP even if you were a bit heavy handed initially.

I was raised through manipulation, some hinting but mostly bribery, like: “do this or I’ll tell your Dad that…” “I’ll tell your Grandma if you don’t..” “you won’t get chocolate if you don’t…..” I didn’t understand how to ask for things directly.

I remember as a 16 year old at my first job I said to “'Sandra' give me a crisp or I’ll tell 'Mark' that you printed that out wrong” to which 'Sandra' replied calmly in front of the office “I’ll give you a crisp but don’t ever try to bribe me again.” At first, I was upset and annoyed and thought she’d made a scene, in fact she was calmly calling out my behaviour which made me question my behaviour. Point is I learned a valuable lesson that day, I never used bribery again.

You dealt with her behaviour at the time and you were probably at boiling point. Pointing out this in front of everybody may make her take a look at herself and make others aware of what she is like.

You did her a favour by reacting that way...she needs to learn to ask for what she wants...I hate hinters or over explainers...both equally annoying...

I dislike animals begging for my food, and with people I like it even less. They should at least strive for a little personal dignity.

So, I have read the whole thread and to go back to your original post this whole thing could have been avoided if you would just offered her some spare change for the bus when she was first whining

She sounds like a classic emotional vampire:

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p079fdqp

Doesn't mean she's inherently bad, but hinters are tiresome, as it takes more emotional energy to navigate their wishes than with a straightforward asker.

I'm another one training my kids to just ask (ffs).

The hinter is sitting in "Victim mode"
Staring at someone elses lunch ?
WTAF
Avoid OP -she has hit the jackpot with you losing your rag, thats exactly what she wants.

redappleandaquamarinebow1987 it's the extra and completely unnecessary mental weight of hinting that is really draining.

You know the person wants something but you have to devote a disproportionate amount of time and energy to figuring out what the person actually wants from a range of possibilities, then come up with a way to offer it in a way that sounds helpful without being insulting to their pride, and you risk coming across as slightly interfering if they didn't want anything at all apart from a listening ear. It's exhausting.

Even the most well-intentioned hinter is being inadvertently selfish and demanding.

is the passive agressiveness that is the problem not the hinting. Hinting in itself is nothing wrong

I would say that hinting is intrinsically passive aggressive.

Oh, I wish I had someone to share a cab home with! (rather than how are you getting home-do you fancy sharing a cab?)

I’m going to be sooo lonely this weekend, I just don’t know what I’m going to do! (Rather than-what are you up to this weekend, fancy doing something?)

Especially when the same person does it a lot, combined with doleful stares and whatever it is they want you to give them.

The odd instance from people probably wouldn’t bother me but that clearly isn’t the case here.

@fedup21 Yes I do realize I am on the extrem end of needing to please people

@Howyiz then it is the passive agressiveness that is the problem not the hinting. Hinting in itself is nothing wrong. It's when it comes with passive agressiveness or wanting to use people without ever returning favours, pestering (drop it after obe hint) it is an issue

For example it was only last year at 31 I stopped asking my mum if I may order something if we are out together for a meal

Right, I would say that is pretty unusual!

@Halo1234 hopefully the CF hinter will think the same as you and the OP can enjoy some peace.
@redappleandaquamarinebow1987 your situation is completely different unless you are passive aggressively hinting that you would really like a cocktail/dessert etc when the other person decides they don't want one.