To walk out the hospital before seeing the consultant

have just recieved this from my dad which in the circumstances is very apt
These may raise a smile or two........

Jack and Jill went up the hill to fetch a pail of water.
Jack fell down and broke his crown and Jill came tumbling after.

Both subsequently died in the ambulance and the PCT set up an enquiry, which came to the following conclusions:

1. The 50 mile journey to the nearest casualty department was in the couples' best interests.

2. The fact that there was no local bed in which Jack could mend his head was unfortunate but no targets had been breached and he had been offered a choice.

3. The lack of vinegar and brown paper was not material to the man's death as NICE had not yet decided whether it was cost-effective and in any case both the brown paper nurse and the vinegar nurse were away on courses.

4. The GP was most to blame and should be suspended and referred to the GMC as he had:

a. Not reported Jack and Jill's lack of water to social services;

b. Failed to recognise that anyone going UP the hill to fetch a pail of water must be seriously demented;

c. Had not involved the Falls Coordinator which resulted in Jill tumbling after Jack.

Dr Foster went to Gloucester in a shower of rain He stepped in a puddle right up to his middle and never went there again. This also resulted in major public debate.

The Press said it was outrageous that - given the fact that doctors were paid around half a million pounds for a 30 hour week - Dr. Foster should be put off by a mere soaking.

The politicians wanted to know why any doctors were going to Gloucester in the first place as it was an over-doctored middle class area unlikely to vote Labour at the next election.

The RCN said doctors weren't needed as nurses could do their job just as well, they were holistically trained and would have no problem with puddles as they could also walk on water.

The local nurse practitioners agreed that they would of course go to Gloucester after doing the appropriate course.

The Social workers said that no one had considered how the puddle might feel about being trodden into.

The managers decided to do a piece of work around rain and puddles.

The next time there was a problem in Gloucester it coincided with a large multidisciplinary stake holder conference and no one was available so NHS Direct advised calling the GP.

Once upon a time it was resolved to have a boat race between a BUPA team and a team representing the N.H.S. Both teams practised long and hard to reach their peak performance. On the big day they were as ready as they could be.

The BUPA team won by a mile.

Afterwards the N.H.S. team became very discouraged by the result and morale sagged. Senior management decided that the reason for the crushing defeat had to be found, and a working party was set up to investigate the problem and recommend appropriate action.

Their conclusion was that the BUPA team had eight people rowing and one person steering, whereas the N.H.S. team had eight people steering and one person rowing.

Senior management immediately hired a consultancy company to do a study on the team's structure. Thousands of pounds and several months later they concluded that: "Too many people were steering and not enough rowing."

To prevent losing to BUPA the next year, the team structure was changed to three "Assistant Steering Managers", three "Steering Managers", one "Executive Steering Manager" and a "Director of Steering Services". A performance and appraisal system was set up to give the person rowing the boat more incentive to work harder.

The next year BUPA won by two miles.

Following this, the N.H.S. laid off the rower for poor performance, sold off all the paddles, cancelled all capital investment in new equipment, and halted development of a new canoe. The money saved was used to fund higher than average pay awards to senior management.

Sorry have only read first couple of posts, just wanted to say a couple of things, firstly the NHS at the moment is trying very hard to address privacy and dignity for patients but it quite clearly hasn't addressed your privacy and dignity which is unacceptable. You should have been allowed to stay in your clothes or at least given a gown to put on. I'm not sure it was the right thing to do to walk out because if you think about it logically that makes the wait even longer for everyone as time would have been spent looking for you, calling for you again but I cna understand your upset paticularly at such a stressful time. The NHS is under immense pressure and I do think we have to remember it is a free service. What bothers me is the NHS promises things it can't deliver. I really hope you get sorted out soon, I would write a formal complaint to the Chief Exec about the lack of privacy and information as I'm sure he would be very interested and if you don't feedback to the hospital they won't know you're unhappy.

rubbish hippi!!

Sometimes you just have to wait.

I'd have waited as the time to go home & then back for another appointment would be more than just actually sitting there until my turn.

Yes, but tax and NI contributions is a minor payment isn't it - compared to what you would pay in other countries.

The sore toe vs cardiac arrest analogy doesn't work here. This was presumably an outpatient breast clinic. Not many life or eath emergencies. I understand about the terminal diagnosis bit, I do, but at the clinic I attended there were admin people who checked me in. Surely they should be able to keep tabs on who is where and just apologise for the delay to people kept waiting in really almost unbearable tension. Well, that's how it felt for me anyway. Not like a sore toe.

I disagree, we do pay for the NHS, through our taxes and National Insurance contributions.

The thing is Spidermama - we are patients, not customers.
Don't forget, we don't pay to see a doctor/nurse/consultant on the NHS.

I am Dutch. In Holland, medical care is means tested. That means, poor people pay pittance, better off peopel pay more. My parents pay around the equivalent of £300 PER MONTH into the Dutch health service. That is NOT private health care. My parents have to wait to see a doctor/nurse just as long as the poorer person paying £10 per month. The Dutch see that as fair. I agree.

You don't know how lucky you are to have the NHS. Yes it has its faults, of course it does. It is being mis-managed at top levels, as a result the nurses/doctors are rushed off their feet.
Both my SIL and my MIL are NHS nurses. MIL does the OP clinics. She never ever gets a break apart from a very short lunch break. She tells me the nursers do not keep patients waiting because they are too busy gossiping/drinking tea. The later the clinic finishes, the later the staff get to go home, so it is in their best interest to keep things moving.

Instead of moaning about it, and lamenting about behaving like customers, put up with it as much as possible and be nice to the nurses. Heaven knows they could do with a friendly face!

One other thing, if they were going to give you bad news, you probably would have heard from them by now

Like anywhere else you can always come up with examples of good and bad practice. Sadly things only change in the NHS once complaints reach a certain level - there are no rewards (certainly as far as the staff at ground level are concerned) for working, harder, faster, or better. At some point, something bad happens, and then you get extra staff or resources.

Stripey, I would advise writing a letter to the Trust involved stating your concerns. Even if it is simply logged and you get a standard letter back, it could be the last letter needed to trigger them hiring an extra member of staff in breastcare, for all you know. They may also investigate - and you may get an explanation for what happened, which would be good.

This is the only area in our lives where most of us expect to receive poor service - you shouldn't have to go to a clinic and expect that you might have to wait 2 hours to be seen, should you, but we do.

Sorry this is turning into a bit of a general NHS rant

I wouldnt have left without finding out why they wanted to see me, but I entirely understand. After I had DD2 they where concerned about retained placenta and I had an internal scan, half way through the doctor/radiographer?? not sure who does these things... Said I need to speak to my colleague and left the scanner inside me and left the room (btw the door was opposite my feet so entirely exposed!) she didnt come back for over 15min, if I could have figured out a way to leave I would have done!

I felt so scared and exposed and they hadn't let my DH come in with me, so was on my own, they lock the doors so people cant walk in, but because she had left the door was unlocked, so anyone could have just walked in on me.

Fortunately someone did eventually come back, I just wanted to get out of there by that time so didnt complain

I'd have gone back to reception to ask them to page the consultant.... but it's easy to be wise in hindsight.

The thing about sitting there topless is disgusting - there is no call for that whatever is happening in the next cubicle or ward. It doesn't take 20 seconds to give someone a gown to wear whilst waiting for an exam or have them change when the consultant turns up. Doctors and nurses may have "seen it all before" but they haven't always seen yours - besides which, anyone could have walked in.

I once walked out of a&e in similar circs. I had been waiting for 3 and a half hours, with 2 small children and I was pregnant. None of us had had any lunch, because we were very poor at the time, and couldnt afford the automatic machines, and we hadn't expected to be there for so long. When I finally complained, the staff said I would be next on the list, I waited for 15 more minutes and then left.
Fortunately, ds turned out to be OK in the end.

And just to add I still don't get why the OP wasn't given a gown to put on just to cover up with while she was waiting. They should keep stuff like that in each room for exams of that nature.

Spidermama,

My point is this: If your loved one was critically ill and his/her nurse walked away from him to politely explain to her 15 other patients (one at a time and very politely) that their care was going to be delayed, you would really be infuriated. Especially if your loved one died as a result.

It doesn't mean that the other 15 patients aren't important. But you don't kill one person to make another who is less ill feel like a valued customer.

The first thing they teach nurses is how to
prioritize. Breathing problems first to the exclusion of all else. Then cardiac problems get dealt with, then pain. Then everything else. You don't even think about the everything else until you have dealt with the first things on that list. Duh.

I do understand that the OP was talking about an OP appointment and things aren't so acute down there.

But just because you have something horrible going on doesn't mean that your nurse's other patient doesn't have something worse going on. She will feel for you but take care of the worst patient first to the exlusion of everything else. She would do the same thing for you if you were in a bad way.

That does not imply that she doesn't understand or care that you are suffering. But many people take it that way.

I have had too many years of hearing people complain that their sore toe wasn't being seen too fast enough while I was in the next bay with a dying baby/hysterical parents.

I think it is usual to be asked to undress while waiting. In fact, I saw the breast nurse before the doctor and she left the room to let me take my clothes off, even though it was her who would be examining me first. Well, her and the medical student who gamely tried to hide his disappointment that he hadn't seen anything interesting all day...

Being kept informed of delays is only courteous though.

I hope that when you get them, your results are just as disappointing to any eager medical students as mine were

What a horrible experience stripey. You shouldn't have been treated like this. It's very upsetting. I would probably have done the same then regretted it profoundly.

Anoah your attitude infuriates me. Of course there are people worse off. That's always going to be the case but that's not to take away from the stressful and upsetting experience stripey had.

It's like the way NHS professionals justify over zealous intervention in births and the like. 'Huh! You should think yourself lucky. Other women have blood and this and that and blah blah blah'.

How stressful for you Stripey.

It's shame they didn't keep you better informed, especially important I would think in that type of clinic. Patients are bound to be more anxious than usual. Have you made another appointment? I hope it's good news.

I do think it is getting worse though. Like Fio we spend alot of time in NHS clinics. Our last orthopaedic appointment was a 10.30 slot. We didn't get seen until after 1.30; a shockingly long wait for a paeds. clinic. Too many patients and sadly not enough staff.

When I have my appts at the breast care centre they always tell me to undress and await the consultant, perhaps it is normal to?

I always keep my bra on though, it doesn't take a minute to remove that when they arrive and it stops you feeling quite so odd perched on the couch behind the curtain waiting for the door to open...

If I've waited long enough to leave I always go to the appointment desk and say, as pleasantly as possible, 'I'd like to reschedule. I've been waiting here (X amount of time) and I have another commitment I need to attend.'

While I understand your upset and frustration I can absolutely promise you that in our clinic no consultant or health professional sits down all day. We work our socks off to try and get everyone seen and regularly miss lunch (the only break we're allowed in the NHS) because clinics run late and I am unusual because I leave on time. I only do that because if I don't I would be late to pick my children up and then thay'd lose their nursery place. Everyone else at my workplace works late.

What you should have done is slipped your top back on and gone back to reception to ask what the hold up was. What actually happened was probably that the nurse and cinsultant wasted time looking for you and not being able to see someone else.

If you're not happy, make a complaint in writing. It will be dealt with quickly and the urse and consultant will know why you were upset. Hopefully they will make changes to their practice so it doesn't happen again. But honestly - you didn't help yourself or them. And very seriously, what if you do need treating? an hour today would've saved a extra 2 weeks wait (or more) and you don't know if it's that two weeks that could make all the difference to you. Sorry to be so harsh but we're here to help save your life, it's not like going to the bank to sort your direct debits out, it's blo^dy serious.

Do they not let dd queue jump fio? DS1 didn't wait even a minute last time we were in A & E. Didn't wait for an x-ray either, straight in. The first time we went (for the same thing) he was kept waiting 5 minutes. They were very good (and quite keen to be rid of him I think )

Having said that he never jumped queues at the CDC and it was a bloody nightmare, luckily they all go to see him at school now which makes life a lot easier.

i ahev spent fair too much of my lifein nhs hospitals btw

I am wondering whether the situation for waiting times is getting worse tbh. I have been to several appointments with dd lately where I have been kept waiting well over an hour (she has severe special needs) and I dont think it is appropriate without explanation. fAIR enough in a&e, but in a normal clinic it becomes excessive when you have other family commitments. I am sure it never used to be that bad

allnurses.com/forums/f18/rules-er-long-170440.html

The link I posted is a pretty interesting read for those of you who are interested in seeing just how burned out some ER (A&E) nurses are these days. Even if you only read the first 2 posts it might put things into perspective.