To find getting older so incredibly sad

Deo, the 'Vanity' in the religious sense isn't around looks, but thinking that you are superior, or your achievements are greater and more important than those of others. You pretty much fit that criteria. Not going through the Menopause isn't something to brag about. I'm nearly 48, thankfully I haven't had a period for nearly two years, it's great.

I've always wanted to go to a particular place (outside of the EU), that no-one I know wants to, this thread has, along with getting over a major illness has spurred me to go this year, alone. You never know if you're going to lose your mobility, at any age really, but your odds go up, as you age.

The place I want to visit is steeped in history and people there had very sad lives and deaths.

I agree that it's a privilege to have concerns about aging, other than needing to be physically fit, to survive.

I didn't have a good upbringing and I was very looks focused. I went through a lot of angst, which is now gone. I don't feel the need to explain why chashing money wasn't what I've ever been about. I wish I had my confidence now, when I was a SAHM.

The freedom that you personally experience post 45, can't really be explained, fully.

Watching the Television coverage of the tributes to David Bowie, it suddenly struck me that all of the men on the show had been fans from the start (all 50+), but the female co-presenters (early 30's) could only speak of listening to his music.

Women, post reproductive, are still seen as irrelevant, in the UK that's the next battle to take on.

I often tell my children how great they look or that top really suits them etc etc. Or how nice their hair looks a certain way.

I do it to everyone! Isn't it just a kind, friendly, positive thing to do??

Swedish, very important issue. I am much more likely to say they did well - if they are kind to someone etc than comment on looks. So yes deliberate policy just like my mother to tell children they do well when they do good rather than when they look physically attractive. Of course I might have once or twice said they look good but it's not something often said and they are so lucky to have that philosphy in this family.

Let us not forget the old English sayings such as pretty is as pretty does.

Relinquish vanity in 2016 and the route to ahppiness might be yours and I also agree that relying on material things for happiness is silly too. i am always going on about the things that make people happy being fresh air, moving, wholefoods etc, lots of sleep, drinking water. Of course women are more secure and can protect their chidlren if they earn a lot but if you make that your life's aim then like King Midas you will drown in your own gold.

There endeth my moral lesson of the day. Go forth and eschew the mirror and look instead into your own soul.

I'm 38 and I feel the same OP. It's just very sad. My parents are already dead so at least I don't have that to worry about but yeah, the thought that I might now be in (or past) the middle of my life is a bit scary.

Hmm I do tell my kids they look nice, I like your outfit, your haircut looks great etc. I suspect this is because I just got a barrage of criticism from my mum about my appearance and it really hurt. Perhaps it would have been better not to mention it as PPs have said.

However I don't make it a big deal, I compliment them on trying hard, being kind, clever and all that too, and I don't make it the be-all and end-all. I'm a bit torn on this because on the one hand it shouldn't be an issue. On the other I think you want your mum to tell you you look lovely and to find you gorgeous. But that could be because of my background.

Sounds as if I would have been a huge disappointment to you then. Clothes are one of my favourite hobbies

I am 42 next week and wouldn't give anything to be in my 20s again. I love the freedom of caring less about other people's opinions.

Thanks for your honesty OP. I think the point is that feeling sadness about being mortal is quite normal and definitely does not preclude appreciating life, living life to the full (never quite sure exactly what that means) and being a decent person. I too (I am 57) feel deep sadness about the fact that one day I will not exist and that my son whom I love dearly and my family and friends will continue life without me. And yes many aspects of getting older are sad and troubling however there are pluses too. I know at 35 that might be difficult to grasp. I see myself as continuing to grow as a person in becoming more compassionate and thoughtful, I hope that is something you will achieve but your honesty would indicate to me that you are already there. Personally I believe being upfront and honest about the fear of growing older and death is a good thing.

That is what I was shooting for, Slightly. I hoped they would all see clothes as functional and not a hobby, and would learn to take care of them properly and make good purchasing and discarding decisions.

My parents never put much attention on our looks either, more on behaviour, and intelligence. I'm glad - it didn't stop a couple of us being interested in fashion and makeup, but as something you did rather than something you were, IYSWIM?

I am very glad they did. My peers seemed way more fucked up about appearance (I remember one girl in school telling us she was going to kill herself at 40 FFS so she wouldn't get old )

I tried to avoid telling my DCs my opinion on how they looked too. I never considered it relevant to their developing self image. Once they got to their late teens the question of appropriate dress for their jobs came into play and we discussed that -- what worked with already existing clothes, what was a reasonable price to pay, what was easy to wash, what suited a certain shape or colouring and what did not. I made up my mind that if I wouldn't tell DS he was looking good, looked handsome, etc, then I wouldn't tell the DDs anything along those lines either. Telling a girl she looks pretty is as dangerous as telling her she is clever, imo.

Deo I also notice you said as a result of your DM never telling you you looked quite good, your teens were spent reading feminist books.
You're not seriously thinking if parents compliment their children on how they look, they'll end up incapable of comprehending feminism, so your congratulating yourself?

I don't mind getting old. I am growing old disgracefully.
The main negative is my mind makes promises my body can't keep.

Upside, you really don't give a toss what other people think. Downside, you become invisible.

Oh.
I can't keep up with all DG's names

So, we can assume, DG, that you also never tell any of your 5 children that they look lovely at all?

And age of menopause is nothing whatsoever to do with anything you've done. But, hey, why miss out on having another go at women who aren't exactly like you.

Aspiring for more and more money, comparing bank balances, even constantly pushing for a Stella career is also vanity. They are all fleeting, all can be lost in the twinkling of an eye, so I wouldn't want to tie my self worth up in my career, or bank balance, although having them is not a bad thing.

Hmm I'm not sure I agree with all of that Deo. I'm vain. Whilst I fully realise there are more important things in life, clothes and playing with my apearance give me a lot of pleasure. Moreover looking in the mirror reminds me that time is beginning to run out and that I need to get a move on.

What does piss me off however, is the way for women, looking good has become conflated with looking young.

I sometimes think one of the best things my mother did was never tell me I looked quite good so my teens were about reading feminist books, beating everyone at exams, thinking about a stellar career and lovely hobbies with looks not really counting for much at all so at 50 those elements still keep getting better and better (no ill health as yet tough wood - not even menopause and I'm 54!!).

Those women whose life is their looks, who hooked the rich man, who keep him through being sexy and slim and are able to stop him moving on to the younger model, who have to jump through his hoops to keep him and his wealth tend more than women who support themselves to resent aging.

It is not for nothing all major religions have vanity as a sin. If you think about how you look it tends to make you miserable. I would argue it's morally wrong to send too much time on how you look. Go and wash the feet of a neighbour instead if you've time to look into mirrors.

Grill I'm one of the irritatingly happy, fit 50 year olds and can definitely confirm that things do get easier, well other issues are more difficult but I certainly think that young children and lack of sleep are a particular kind of hell!

I was also deeply aware of the patriarchy as a teenager for reasons similar to Mulit and as those years coincided with the onset of second wave feminism, that view has informed and guided my life ever since. But math is right that it only gets worse. My work involves the intersection of sexism and ageism (one of the very few fields that being an older woman is actually seen as a good thing). The devaluing of people as they age is especially sinister for women and actually contributes to elder abuse.

You get a clearer view of the patriarchy in all its glory in your mid thirties and it can come as a shock

Math I'm really nodding along to most of what you're saying, but I think I had a pretty good view of the patriarchy from the age of, oh, about 14. Thanks to an extraordinarily sexist science teacher.

And because I've always been "the clever one" and never more than vaguely not-quite-ugly, certainly never seen as pretty or valued in any context for my looks. I was the plain one, not ugly, just plain. So I always saw just how much other girls/women were being valued just for their looks, and not themselves as whole beings.

It's a total swizz that a lot of women (including on this thread) fall for. I like clothes, I'm blonde and intend to stay that way, I keep fit & slim-ish, I collect interesting shoes, and I love luxurious fabrics. I'm not puritanical about all these things, but they're about pleasure not my valuation of myself, or the internalized misogyny which affects us all to a greater or lesser degree.

There are a lot of things I could be sad about, and was sad about when I was 35 (losing the love of my life probably rates there) but ageing? Losing my looks? It's a ridiculous sucking of my energy, my attention, and my emotion.

Yes that is interesting Pacific. I don't think we talk about it nearly enough.

Floisme, yes, I agree, the conversation about ageing and time-related decline and the increasing awareness of the inevitability of death is a very difficult and uncomfortable one.
Like everything else, it gets easier with practice: I do advanced care planning with care home residents as part of my job and it is really quite surprising how many people welcome that conversation (although their children often find it harder than their elderly parents, interestingly).

I can remember using 'What's the alternative?' on my mum a couple of times. I really regret doing that now. She wanted to talk about aging and probably death and I used that line to shut her down - because it made me feel uncomfortable.