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Original poster

To try for a 3rd child in my circumstances...

87 replies

Wicks71 · 04/09/2012 10:14

Name changed.

I am becoming so indecisive that I can't see the wood for the trees sometimes. It's weird as professionally, I make decisions all the time, but I am becoming totally useless in my home life (where to live, schools etc). I realise that I am incredibly lucky and that this is a good dilemma to have so I hope I don't get too flamed for being self-indulgent but I just wanted to see what other viewpoints there are.

I've just turned 41. I have 2 children. At one stage I didn't think this was going to happen at all for us so I do count my blessings all the time. I had my eldest when I was 35 (after undergoing IUI after trying to get pregnant for several years) and I had my youngest at 38 - after undergoing 3 IUIs and 2 cycles of IVF. The 2nd cycle of IVF was a huge success (obviously! She's currently upstairs causing havoc) - and I have 4 frozen embryos. For the past year or so, DP and I have been going back and forward about trying for a 3rd. We've been going round in circles - basically torn between head (counting our blessings with the 2 we have and quitting whilst we are ahead, our age etc) and heart (a BABY!). We'd kind of decided that we were going to leave it - well not really "decided", but the fact that we couldn't make a decision to take the plunge was meaning that by default we weren't doing it, if you see what I mean. But neither of us could let it go and it's occupies a huge part of our head space. The good (or bad?) thing is that we both feel pretty much the same and so it's not a case of one of us desperately wanting another child and the other being reluctant - but it does mean that we've been going round in circles somewhat.

A bit factor for me is age - I'm 41. Part of me thinks its too old but part of me thinks that in this day and age it really isn't. What's the general view on that?

We wouldn't try naturally - it's not worked for us in the last 10 years and also we have the 4 frozen embryos sitting there. Whilst I don't feel a huge moral obligation to absolutely give one of the 4 frozen embryos a chance of life (I mean that the fact that they are there isn't the deciding factor in itself), I do feel that if I am going to try for a 3rd, I should go down that route and give one a chance.

I think that because I'm one of 3 children myself, then it feels like the right number for me. We do have practical considerations about 3 (might need to move house - though we might have to do that anyway, it would probably mean ruling out private schools etc) but none of those seem to be the determining factor in themselves. I'm not massively hung up on private schools - DP was veering in that direction (for kids from age 7 or 11) but last night we both said that we thought it would be mad to let that dictate whether we gave our kids a sibling. I work part-time and would probably continue to do so if I had a 3rd child.

I would say that my biggest concern is my age. I worry about being not only too old to have another kid but also (just to be really morbid!) about being an old mum for them further down the line - ie how long will I be around. A neighbour died last year in her early 40s leave 3 under 4s. I plan to be around longer that that (hopefully!), but it did drive home to me that when they are in their 20s, I'd be in my 60s etc. So different to my mum who had my sister at 21 and all 3 of us by the time she was 29. Am I obsessing too much about numbers?

On the flip side - the 2 year old daughter of one of my closest friends died a couple of years ago - I've been at her side throughout and it's inevitably shaped me too - she says that she feels like a victorian mum now and wants as many as she can. I do now think that if something happened to one of my kids, they'd be on their own. These 2 situations are having a bit impact on my thinking.

Sorry, I've rambled a lot now. As of last night, we are thinking "fuck it", we are going to go for it.

My sister took the plunge a few years ago and had a 3rd at 41 (after having her first 2 in her early/mid 30s). She deliberated over the decision for a bit and ironically says that it was something I said that helped make up her mind to go for it - ie that you might regret not doing it but you are unlikely to regret doing it. Easy to say when it's someone else I'm advising! Should I take the same advice myself?!

OP posts:
expatinscotland · 04/09/2012 12:02

It doesn't matter how many kids you have, tbh. Life is always fragile.

If you feel it's best, go for it then.

Original poster
Wicks71 · 04/09/2012 12:01

expatinscotland - I'm so sorry to hear of your loss and I do understand what you mean. I'm not sure I agree that I need counselling though. I just mean that it made me realise how fragile things are and that maybe we should just go for it as anything can happen.

OP posts:
prizewinningpig · 04/09/2012 12:00

I live my life by doing the opposite of what the Daily Mail comments say. Does that help! Have you discussed it with your mum. I was dead set on stopping at two until she pointed out my eyes filled with tears every time I talked about it. Someone who really knows you would give better advice than us.

CrackerJackShack · 04/09/2012 11:57

Personally it sounds to me that you already know what you want to do, you just need to say it out loud.

Original poster
Wicks71 · 04/09/2012 11:57

I didn't have an amnio last time - at 37 - as apparently my risk after the nuchal fold and blood test was equal to that of a 21 year old (if only I could say that about the rest of me!!). As I say it would be my 37 year old eggs again - but as to whether I had an amnio - it would totally depend on what the risk level was after a nuchal fold/blood test. If it was a high risk then I would but I wouldn't automatically have one just because of my age.

OP posts:
expatinscotland · 04/09/2012 11:56

'I do think that my friend's horrific loss of her child has shaped my view so much.'

I wouldn't procede until I worked throuh with a counsellor about that, tbh. I lost a child myself, who was one of 3. DH has had a vasectomy and I'm 41 so no more children.

But honestly, it's not a good factor of input into having another child and I'd honestly work through those feelings.

OutragedAtThePriceOfFreddos · 04/09/2012 11:55

Sounds to me like you won't regret trying, but you may well regret not trying.

In your position, I'd go for it.

Original poster
Wicks71 · 04/09/2012 11:54

"throw" not "through" - yikes.

OP posts:
Original poster
Wicks71 · 04/09/2012 11:51

I meant to say - thank you for all your views, I really appreciate it. It's all very interesting to through into the mix. As the fertility consultant said last year - this is a luxury dilemma to have - and I get that. I realise that compared to all the other people she sees who are desperate for a child, us prevaricating over a 3rd is a bit of a "my diamond shoes are too tight" dilemma. I was that person once too. I spent several years being eaten up by the thought that I wouldn't have a child. Getting to the point of fertility treatment was actually the easiest bit as it felt that we were doing something pro-active. I know that pain though. I remember it all to well.

I value my own siblings so highly. I'm one of 3 and whilst we don't live near to each other, we are very close. I see how my kids are with each other and want more of that for them. I know there is no guarantee that they'll be close though.

I do think that my friend's horrific loss of her child has shaped my view so much.

One of DPs reservations is that he dreads the newborn phase. But as he said last night - that's only a couple of months. I dread the postnatal phase immediately after the c-section - but love the newborn phase EXCEPT that I've driven myself slightly loopy both times over my disasters at breastfeeding. DP is concerned that I'd beat myself up if that happened again. But all of these things are small fry really - they aren't the deciding factors. Though I don't know if 3 c-sections is (all that the hospital said last time is that my bladder had stuck to my abdomen wall and so they had to yank it off - sorry tmi and so it was quite raw and I had to have a catheter for 3 days. It was probably due to scar tissue from the previous c-section and I did lose some blood. They didn't advise me not to have another - they just said that if I did have a 3rd I make sure that the consultant whose care I was under was aware of this occurence).

OP posts:
Lambzig · 04/09/2012 11:51

Good lord, if you start listening to Daily Mail comments section you will lose the plot. I have never seen a more mean spirited, smug, santimonious and ill mannered collection of people who appear on almost any thread (although anything on fertility gets the ranters out - I remember reading one about Denise van Outen having a baby mid 30's that had a similar reaction of being too old and that Amanda Holden had got what she deserved, that stopped me reading them).

If it helps, when I had my booking in appointment at a well known big London hospital in a relatively affluent area, I said to my midwife "I know I am pushing it as a much older mother now, is there any additional issues to last time" and she said I was about average age for them these days.

From your posts, the only issue that i think is a real concern is the one regarding your C-section complications, but you and your consultant will know what that means for a third pregnancy.

I would go for it too, but I have a philosophy in life that I would rather regret doing something, than regret not doing it - and I cant imagine regretting another child.

Original poster
Wicks71 · 04/09/2012 11:38

We went to see the consultant towards the end of last year about the practicalities. She was great - clearly we wouldn't expect her to make the decision for us but obviously we discussed the pros and cons that we were weighing up (it was funny - she kept wavering too - first she said, I think after all you've been through, you should count your blessings and stop but then she said "but then again, the embryos are just there!". I would say that after that consultation we were about 80% likely to go for it (I even got hold of my medical records from my last c-section to refresh my memory on the complication) - we gave ourselves till the end of the year to decide but never really got round to sitting down and properly discussing it. Life got in the way. We went off the boil on the idea a bit after an exhausting time with our kids at the end of last year/beginning of this year (when they decided that sleep was not really their thing!) and I think we let the idea drift away and were inclined not to go for it - but it was still simmering. I then had a skiing accident in Feb so had to have surgery and was on crutches for months so I guess that meant decisions were shelved.

It's really hit us now though that it's now or never. DP had gone off the idea a bit earlier in the year - age/tiredness/lack of patience/my health etc but last night came home and said "fuck it, shall we do it?!" My knee jerk reaction was to agree and probably I should trust that I guess, but I do have a tendancy to overthink things (No shit!). I've made an appointment at the fertility clinic to start the ball rolling but am now worrying! I need to just make a decision either way!

Our family life is loving but chaotic. I'm not one of life's tidy/organised people and I do wonder about the chaos that a 3rd would bring. Part of me thinks that I should get a grip in my home/my finances (we both earn good money but don't ever seem to have much!)/my weight etc before we try but then I'd be even OLDER. If I'm going to do it - I should just get on with it.

When we talked about going for it last night I said that I wish we'd made the decision at the end of last year - this really annoyed DP (undertandably - I'd annoy me too!) as he just said "well we didn't. We are here now and we can't make the decision then, that's passed, we are here, now".

If we were 5 years younger I think we'd have less reservations. I think we'd have definitely gone for a 3rd. One thing he says is that with hindsight we should have "got on with it" sooner (just to contradict his comment last night!) as we got together 15 years ago. He said "what the hell were we doing for all those early years that we were together?" Err, having fun largely. He's right though but it's too late to dwell on that. To be fair - we did start trying when I was 32 - we just didn't bank on it taking till I was 35 to have our first child.

I know what several of you mean about knowing when you are done. I don't know that I'm done - I just worry. I logged on to the Daily Mail website today (I know, I know, that was my first mistake right there!) to browse the showbiz gossip and saw an article by Kate Garraway asking if she's selfish to consider a baby at 45. The vast majority of comments (albeit from DAILY FAIL readers - let's bear in mind!!) is yes.

I might have a chat to the doctor about the health risks of another c-section.

OP posts:
expatinscotland · 04/09/2012 11:38

I'd do it even if the eggs were 41. But then, I'm one of those people who wouldn't have an amnio.

Margerykemp · 04/09/2012 11:27

The fact that the eggs were 37 years old rather then 41 would swing it for me as you dont need to worry quite as much about chromosonal abnormalities.

Would you still have an amnio?

expatinscotland · 04/09/2012 11:22

I'd go for it.

HugeFurryWishingStool · 04/09/2012 11:18

I'd go for it if I were in your situation.

Lambzig · 04/09/2012 11:13

I dont think your age is an issue at all (but I am biased). I also think you will know when you are done.

After 10 years of ttc, and IVF my DD was born when I was 42. I had thought that I would be so happy to have one that I would be done, but after a few months both DH and I really wanted a second child. Similar to you I had frozen embryos, but was realistic that if it didnt work, we would draw a line under it. I am now 30 weeks pregnant and so far have been very healthy, so fingers crossed.

Like you, I really didnt find the ivf that stressful despite having failed cycles. It was just a process that led to disappointment all but the last time, but life went on around it. Only you will know if you and DH are emotionally and physically equipped for the rollercoaster of getting your body ready, waiting to see if they defrost OK and waiting to see if its worked. As you say, there is a big difference in risk and success with your 37 year old embryos versus trying a new cycle.

EdMcDunnough · 04/09/2012 11:05

Oh God Shock Grin

PropertyNightmare · 04/09/2012 11:02

EdMc I totally predict a fourth child for you! I think you will love three and will be tempted to go for number four quite quickly..... It get any harder after number three, imo. One to two means learning to attend to multiple needs, two to three mean perfecting juggling, three to four no change (your skills are honed!) just more fun!

BeautifulBlondePineapple · 04/09/2012 11:01

In your shoes I'd go for a 3rd. You'll never regret having a child, but if you're thinking this much about it and have always wanted 3 then there's a fair chance you'll regret not doing it when it's too late.

I'm one of 3 and always wanted 3 as well so I know where you're coming from. Your point about giving your children another sibling in case something happens to one of them is something I really thought about too (a bit morbid!)

And no, I don't think 41 is too old.

NUFC69 · 04/09/2012 11:00

I had my last child at 33 (am now 64) and we pondered about having another child when I was late 30s - to be honest, I wish we had just gone ahead and tried for the third - my husband says the same. We now look after my DGS (aged 18 months) and will be helping with DGD when my daughter-in-law goes back to work early next year. It is only one day a week but we are exhausted when he goes home (do love it, though). I suppose what I am trying to say is that if you were asking should you have a third in your 60s, I would say no, but in your 40s I can't see it being a problem.

WilsonFrickett · 04/09/2012 10:58

With us, my husband was quite anti trying again, and I was quite apathetic - as in he'd say 'oh, I don't think I could go through the lack of sleep again' and I'd say 'yeah, I suppose you're right'. Our housing situation and financial situation at that time also had an effect on how I felt. So I kind of didn't have a 'big' reason for not wanting another baby, more there were a lot of little reasons and I just drifted. Not quite drifted. There were lots of reasons not to, and I didn't see the reasons to try again. (I hope this is making sense!).

Now our situation has changed, we're in a bigger house, things are more settled. And it's too late for another one. So I let the chance of a second baby drift out of my life. That's been quite hard to deal with.

How would you feel if you didn't try for #3?

PropertyNightmare · 04/09/2012 10:57

I really think that you should go for it and try to use one (or two!) of the embryos. You are able to offer any future children love, stability and you can financially support a larger family. I have four children and I love that we went with our hearts to find the optimum family size for us. Our children love having plenty of company and play pals on tap.
It is entirely true to say that it might well haunt you forever if you decide against something that deep down you really want.

gordyslovesheep · 04/09/2012 10:53

I had my 3rd at 38 and if I was still me my ex I'd be trying for number 4 - I am 42!

I don't think your age is an issue

Original poster
Wicks71 · 04/09/2012 10:50

Definitely would go for single embryo transfer. That's what I did with my last ivf too - I didn't want to run the risk of twins. I've got 4 blastocysts so the odds would be fairly high.

One thing that we are both definitely in agreement on is that we'd stop after the 4 frozen embryos. We'd definitely not try a fresh IVF cycle. I am 100% sure of that.

OP posts:
sleeplessinsuburbia · 04/09/2012 10:49

Of course you're not too old and you sound like a considerate person who is a good mum. It hasn't occurred to me to stop because of my age!

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