to think that community service should not be about humiliation?

"Can you not see the point in looking at the reasons that people commit crimes and trying to address some of these issues?"

Oh yes! poverty, poor education etc etc. All that should be addressed and funds allocated to make a real difference.

But when you have someone in court for say the third time it's no use saying "don't do it again" because you tried that before and here they are.

Victims have rights too. The right to enjoy their life without fear is one of them.

When I first posted on this I was just putting it dramatically to make a point. I don't favour cutting bits off people really.

Also I wouldn't do anything drastic to anyone for the first offence. The first time might be their last. Rehabilitation might work for someone who just made a mistake and feels remorse.

My proposed punishment would be a quick and painless death and only for those who come back again and again. This would be entirely voluntary.

The judge would say "look this is your last chance. Next time we take you through that door there and inject you. So only commit another crime if you WANT to die ok?"

Onagar - war is not a way of trying to persuade your population to respect the social contract. Where the rhetoric has been used for that as in the war on drugs it's been a total fucking disaster

Onagar - yes it says we should try and do some rehabilitation, instead of just locking people up.

you dont do 40 ours a week too! its done in chunks of 7 hrs according to you work patterns. peopel with leave can try and do a week to get it down.
the min is about 40 and the max is 240 hrs
if you divide that into 7 hr chunks that is a lot of days off!

lol at eye for eye
its not master criminals doing unpaid work! its people like your brother who got too drunk and hit someone when he was out, or your alcoholic sister who cant remember not to drink and drive, or the youth who causes criminal damage

its not always about punichement though is it?
FOr some offenders its the ONLY piece of work they have ever completed, for some it gives them an amazing boost - pride in what they CAN do and often motivated tehm back to work

you really need to know a little bit about it to have a good idea.
of course the whole thing is starved of funds and that really restricts what probation can do.

If any of you ahev any projects that need doing, approach your local probation office and suggest it. Unpaid work totally revamped a scout hut ( INside and out) near us over a year

( its called UNPAID WORK now)
c/service was YEARS ago

thye dont wear jackets around here any more

the hting is PEOPLE CAN REFUSE TO DO IT
and if they do - they gointo custody that is £££

Most crimes are committed by the same criminals. Therefore once you disable or kill them you prevent the 100s of crimes they were going to commit.

There was a case recently where someone was let out of prison and stole a car to get home. Says all you need to know about so called rehabilitation.

Don't have to go to Saudi to find a culture that accepts killing and maiming as methods of achieving aims

This culture (here in the UK) accepts war as a means to an end even though that means killing non combatants. Much worse than what I'm advocating as at least I'd only execute those who committed a crime in the full knowledge of the punishment that came with it.

It is revenge. That can be the only motivation for punishment that doesn't contribute to prevention. We tried the bloody code before. Didn't work. Convictions go down, so criminals know that they are less likely to face any consequences.

I'm sorry but how can anyone say they don't agree with labelling people? No matter how you word it it's still a label. Criminal, offender, person who may have had a tough up bringing so has turned to less desirable habits.

"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind" Ghandi. I favour deterrent and punishment; In theory I believe in the death penalty, but couldn't put another human being to death. I think common sense has gone out of the window in the justice system. It's time judges were able to say "You've done X, your punishment is Y."

I just think if you advocate torture and murder as ways of reducing crime you would be more comfortable somewhere that view isn't considered fundamentally uncivilized. You might find you don't like some of the other things torturers and murderers are in favour of though.

Oh and you misunderstood about revenge too. If I wanted revenge I'd be talking about much worse things. My position is partly about deterrent, but mostly about making sure they are not physically able to do it again.

I favour execution for most repeat offences as that works in 100% of cases.

What I don't favour is patting the criminal's 'inner child' on the head and giving it a sweetie

TheCoalitionNeedsYou, telling me to fuck off to saudi was fairly predictable. Surely you can do better than that.

I can assure you that cutting off hands (or heads) prevents repeat crimes while 'telling them off' doesn't. This 'be nice to them and they will be nice back' is great for children's bedtime stories, but doesn't work in the real world where the rest of us have to live.

Community service is only what most law abiding people do every day anyway. Why should doing it just for a little while be a punishment? and how on earth can any sane person think it is too harsh a punishment.

Onagar - your not meant to feel sympathy for the criminals, you are meant to feel sufficient sympathy for the victims to put aside your selfish medieval desire for revenge if it gets in the way of reducing the number of victims.

Takver, speeding and parking illegally carry their own punishments. People who have to carry out community service are generally considered to have committed more serious crime.

If they are doing 40 hours each week then it's reasonable to suppose they are unemployed. Otherwise it would be less hours for a longer period.

I'm supposed to be sympathetic to criminals? yeah right. Cos they couldn't help it could they. They have 'compulsive stealing old ladies purses syndrome' because they were not breastfed enough or they have low self esteem issues.

Well tough. All the punishments are voluntary. If you don't commit the crime you don't do the punishment so get over it. Community service is very nearly no punishment at all. Most of us have to work at things we are not that keen on even when we are not in the mood.

Stone some even.

You can some some adulterers while you're there.

I'm also hoping that all the people on here who want to 'send messages', 'punish' and 'humiliate' others have never, ever, broken the speed limit/parked on a yellow line/taken any illegal drugs etc.

Do you know anyone who has ever done Community Service, Onagar? I do, and the person concerned isn't on benefits, and had to pay for childcare while they did the work. Oh, and if you knew the backstory to why they had offended, you might possibly even feel a little sympathy.

Or maybe you'd rather just cut their hand off?

Fuck off to Saudi then.