Any chance of Tormead going co-Ed?

[GuildfordMum77]

There’s a real gap in the market for a good co-ed school in the Guildford /Godalming area. With the new head coming from an excellent co-ed background, has anyone heard any whispers?

Hey OP, you're very right, there is definitely a gap in the market for a good co-ed in the Guildford market place. The boys certainly don't have the level of great choices afforded to the girls!

I find it really interesting how you mention Tormead as the likely candidate. Apart from GHS (which, as per United Learning's business model, and fundamentally their roaring top ten performance, will always remain girls only) there are a number of other conversion options out there. Such as St Cats and Priors Field.

I say this, because, unless there is a really strong business model, the "going co-ed" process usually comes about due to a fear of declining student numbers. The exception is usually when one is taking girls into a "boys only" school, in which case it is normally a combo of that plus a good way to raise grades.... which adding (smart) girls, sometimes stolen from girls' only schools, usually does.

Going co-ed for a girls school in Guildford, will, especially with RGS around sucking up the traditionally "smarter cohorts", cause grades to go down.

For a school like Tormead, which seems to attract solid numbers each year, and produce pretty decent results, for them what would be the point in going co-ed? A genuine question. Given that most girls' schools, tend to loose numbers from year 11 to sixth form, as our DDs see an attraction in going elsewhere to experience "life outside" / "boys" before Uni, If I was considering co-ed, it would be for sixth form only, with a rigorous entrance exam, to protect A-level performance.

I've seen the new Head speak, and despite his clear pedigree, co-ed experience and the way he communicates (which is pretty impressive, I have to say - and i'm a big critique of crappy public speaking!) it is clear that he does believe in the benefits of a single sex education.... At the very least he talks with perceived passion about one! So not sure if it would be forefront in his mind right now or not? I imagine, like most headteachers, he's trying to get everyone back into the swing of "normality"!

Going curve ball here...... But if i'm completely honest, I always thought that with the general appeal of boarding decreasing, leaving a school with a cost base built around one (higher than day only), that St.Cats would be the one to take boys first!

But then I freely admit that I'm quite off the wall, generally!

Good debate though OP!

Totally agree with @Lindseylovescake - I've certainly heard no such murmurings on the Tormead grapevine (and I like to think that I am pretty plugged into these things ). I think that this rumour stems purely and simply from incoming head Mr Boyd having a co-ed background.

When Tormead has such a clearly defined and strong USP - as the more nurturing, supportive Guildford-centre all girls' option, which nevertheless delivers excellent exam results, they only have something to lose by going co-ed.

Agree with the previous two PPs. I wonder @GuildfordMum77 what you think / why you asked?

From the comms and marketing, I think the new head is quite aware of the benefits of a girls' only environment for those who choose it. He's speaks very passionately about it and also seems to have a DD of his own.

I have heard similar rumours locally but I think they are unfounded. We moved out of London during covid and looked at all these schools. We came out of Tormead and thought if it was Co-Ed it would have been hands down winner for both our DC, even if they got into GHS or Lanesborough/RGS. Having been in London before, we loved Latymer Upper partly because of it's co-Ed modern nature so guess I was hoping tormead would be the same feeling! There was a slight hard sell feeling at tormead so we did wonder if they are having to work hard to get/keep numbers high enough- not always a bad thing though and probably inevitable with private school costs these days.

We ended up further south from Guildford for preps but are keeping those Guildford schools in mind for senior. Tormead may rejoin our list if it does go the co-Ed way. I think the Tormead head posted on here once so might come on and discuss.

Hi @LongGiraffe, we actually chose Tormead having moved house from Richmond in March 2020, the move wasn't covid induced, just bad timing! Ive posted quite a few times throughout the process last year, and I have to say that although they did put a lot of effort into our admissions process, which we really, really appreciated, given it was lockdown and couldn't go to see anywhere, to call it a "hard sell" is a bit cutting. It certainly wasn't how I and a number of the new parents we talk to felt the process went, in fact one other London dad I'm friendly with found it quite refreshing to actually be a valued customer, instead of the old soft sell / we don't really need you / people just apply here because its the thing to do.... i.e. the old hat ways of doing things.

When rules allowed, they even invited us in for after school, personal tours of the external areas of the site, video tours, plus kept in contact with us and DD during the process. It really helped quell her/our nerves as admissions in 2020 were, as you know, almost blind! And for us this was a big £££ investment.

The school has certainly worked out well for us, with new kids seemingly joining all the time, I actually believe a number of year groups (at the prep at least) are now running waiting lists. I know some parents were worried about class sizes, however we've learned there is a cap on those, so they will stay small... so we are relieved!

I guess it just depends on what you're looking for, for example it doesnt have the lovely outside of some preps or the traditional boaters and ribbons of others, but it does well as an inner city school.

I think the Head was from the school you mentioned, perhaps in times things will go a bit more "modern", but as far as going Co-ed, im not sure how popular that would be with the current parents!

I also dont think i've even seen the Tormead Head on here , can you remember where or quote? Pretty sure / actually hoping he has better things to do!!

It wouldn’t surprise me. There’s a whizzy new sixth form centre to fill (and pay for); and from what I’m hearing, existing Tormead parents aren’t that keen to fill it

however, that may be no
more than the usual grumpiness when a new head starts changing things in a previously very settled environment

I would be extremely surprised if Tormead went co-educational any time soon. We remain very happy with the school under David Boyd's leadership. DD1 left this summer having attained 3A*s in her A levels (and an A in her AS last year) and DD2 is continuing with her 4 A levels in the Upper Sixth and is predicted to do equally well.

I really do find rebutting this endless baseless speculation rather wearing but hey ho!

LOL @Mumsnut
There's no way Tormead is going co-ed. You do know it is now nearly 800 in size - not sure they need any more on that site? I had a work colleague with a daughter at a local prep on their 11+ waitlist for 2022 and they didn't even open the list, and now It's common knowledge the year group is 100+. The lower sixth is also now 70 - you can actually count them on social media.

All girls schools loose a chunk between GCSE and A-Level, I genuinely don't believe they think that will change, even with this new Sixth Form Centre. All parents, at every school, become disgruntled - usually because they've been there so long by that point, the girls have been tested to the hilt, parents have experienced grumpy teenager emotions at the highest level and then grass always seems greener / maybe something fresh will be fun. Mine nearly went to a co-ed, decision entirely based on the 'pretty' 17 year old boy on the front of the prospectus!

What they have done though is spent some of their charitable income on the girls who do want to stay, by investing in their facilities, credit to them. If you check the charity commission, they make more than enough surplus each year to cover it, so I wouldn't imagine they're relying on increased numbers to pay for it.

I'm an old Tormead family and I remember the damp squib when the former Headmistress opened up the 'new' (very cheap!) Tormad sixth form areas to my DD when she was in Year 11. We still stayed (despite pretty blonde prospectus boy), because DD was on a strong trajectory, with teachers who knew her and likeminded friends who wanted to stay..... genuinely, the ones who left, were always the ones that would go, were they missed, dunno. Did the girls who stayed do incredibly well, yes. In fact I remember 2 even coming back, after discovering the grass was, in fact, much, much browner elsewhere.

This story is the same for all girls Sixth Forms - it's a dark art.

@Mumsnut strange you've gone back 30 pages and resurrected a thread from a year ago... Your context also implies that you're not a parent yourself? So why feel the need to go back so far and then post at all, on an obtuse topic - unless you're working for Tormead's 'anti-marketing' department (aka another organisation?).

I'm a current Year 11 parent at Tormead, and although DD1 experienced pretty beige times under the last Head, the school has been transformed under the current Head. DD2 is in year 10 and she is loving it, and so are we, the girls of the new regime are notably having a much better experience than even the last.

I agree there is an element of fatigue amongst our year 11 parents and some girls, but I'm really hopeful my daughter continues to want to stay. It is also important to note that most girls say what they think is 'cool' at the time. For example, in the current Lower Sixth, where DD1 has a mate or two, so many said they were leaving at the end of Yr11, and most ended up staying, and they're having a great time, being treated like adult Uni students. In fact, 2 or 3 friends are already looking at returning from co-ed schools and a college locally.

I agree that nothing is perfect and all parents 'look about', at such an important juncture, but your comment seems barbed for someone who isn't actually at the school and digs up old posts for no reason. Please do come up with a clever/cryptic story to convince us you're not working for a competitor school/college!

I am indeed a Tormead parent, and have been for many years - in the Junior school and beyond.

I don't think my comment was that barbed, actually, and I find yours ludicrous in parts: I could just as easily suggest that yours is a 'paid' post. If I were 'having a go' for a competitor, there are more obvious areas to target.

Why did I post? Because these rumours do keep re-surfacing and because school is more jumpy and unsettled than I have ever known it, so anything seems possible.

Morning! Senior DD2 parent here and I have to say i'm not finding anything like that.

As with any new Head most things will change as they put their stamp on things. DD1 saw almost the entire reign of the previous incumbent, and by the end of it we were bored of nothing happening. Courses for horses.

I've also been a DD1 dad through a GCSE year (1st year of Uni now) and yes, things felt anxious in Year 10-11, and any minor change or tweak by the school was a worry (one I always remember is her having a teacher change and nearly having a breakdown over it, but the new one turned out to be much better!) but we ended up chalking this up to simple apprehension, for what is a big exam year, including some big choices for the next step.

Fundamentally any school, Tormead included, will want girls to stay for Sixth Form, but if they want to go elsewhere that's the nature of the beast and they've seen it all before, many, many times over! Your year group won't be the first group who feel 'unsettled' at this time and they certainly won't be the first to say they're looking elsewhere either. I seem to recall DD1s year group feeling just like your description, however, loads of them stayed and a few years later they're still staying.

What I can say though, is that all the above happens at all girls schools and if you want to talk, Tormead have been outstanding with us and other families in DD2s year group, so maybe book an appointment - you'll probably get further than on Mumsnet.

PS. Good luck with the GCSEs.... its nearly out turn (again)... hurrah! 🙄

That's a comfort, Mr Coffee.

@Mumsnut I'm curious, on the original co-ed question - is this something you'd like to happen or just something you think they might be looking into? I would imagine given how well the school is doing and its growing popularity locally, it doesn't need the numbers. I know the Prep School is pretty much waitlisted at all age groups as a friend is trying to get 2 girls in, but they only had space for one, awks!!

Sorry I digress... do you think co-ed would be useful for the whole school or are you just hinting at sixth form?

I definitely wouldn't want any part of the school to go co-ed!

I honestly don't think it will, the benefits of an all girls Sixth Form are well known (if that's your thing) for those that remain it serves them well - if that's what your daughter wants, of course!

I know girls do leave girls only environments after GCSEs for Co-Ed or to bigger schools/colleges to experience 'more', whether that's a different style of learning, different extracurricular offering or just boys. It's, like @ScottCoffee said, Horses for Courses.

It is strange why people always think Tormead is the one to go co-ed in Guildford, I know there's a gap in the market for a Co-Ed, but given the disruption it would cause them, it wouldn't be worth disrupting their current, well respected, girls-only offering.