To think i should be allowed to sleep!!

[Pancake2015]

Every single night my 5 and 7 year old are waking up between 2-3am. They dont go back to sleep and as im trying to i keep hearing them chat and whispering. I get increasingly frustrated as the nights go on. Now ive put one in my bed and im downstairs, so frustrated as im back to the bastard settee. I will not sleep with as they would love that and no doubt do it all the more. I wish i could stand not putting one in to my bed altogether, but after trying for two weeks and seeing me snapping at 3am and shouting, i realised it wasnt acceptable for my neighbours to also be forced awake by all of us!

Aibu to think a 5 and 7 year old should be able to sleep right through the night and i should be able to get at least 1 night a week to sleep properly before having to deal with the following day?
My patience has well and truly gone.

My 5 year old goes to bed between 7:15-7:45 and my 7 year old between 8:30-8:45 depending on how quickly 5yo falls asleep.
They did go at a reasonable time together but that ended up where they were awake until 12am messing about and again, i couldnt sleep.
I now find i struggle to go to sleep knowing theyre going to wake up. Then my eyes cant take anymore, i start dozing and then there is crash bang wallop and theyre up!!

[Pancake2015]

Oh and when they do finally fall back to sleep theyre raring to go again at 6am

[fanjoforthemammaries7850]

No solution here but sympathies...I keep waking up as DD keeps knocking on the wall. .it's like torture...

[TheBouquets]

You poor soul. I am awful for sleeping and it is bad enough me being unable to sleep. You are willing to sleep but the DCs just wont settle. I don't know what to suggest because I have not succeeded myself yet but I hope that the DCs will settle once the schools are back and they are back in a routine.

[Pancake2015]

That is exactly what it is. Torture!

[Pancake2015]

It started before the holidays. I thought maybe excitement with the build up to christmas. They went back to school on monday and its still happening. Biggest sigh ever

I hope you are both able to get some sleep

[Pancake2015]

Didnt mean to put that in bold ha

[AcrossthePond55]

No solution I'm afraid, unless it's taking away privileges for chatting when they're supposed to be sleeping.

But would it help you to have a blow up mattress in your room for one of them to sleep on instead of in your bed? At least that way you won't be sleeping on the sofa!

[Pancake2015]

The blow up mattress is a good idea. Extremely annoying though as i feel i am going backwards. It is suppose to get easier on the sleeping side of things as they get older. It did! They gave me it, and then took it away.

I love sleep!

[HarrietVane99]

How about for every five minutes they keep you awake in the night, they go to bed five minutes earlier? They need to make up all that sleep they're missing, don't they? And take all books, toys etc out of their room so it's really boring.

What do they do immediately before bedtime? Are they overstimulated by screens, activities etc?

[treaclesoda]

I never slept through the night as a child. I wasn't over stimulated, wasn't being naughty, I just couldn't sleep. I'm pretty similar now (hence posting at this time of the night). As a child it was scary and lonely to be lying in the dark watching the minutes tick by on the clock.

Obviously they have to learn not to wake you, or each other, up, but I'm not convinced that punishing a child with loss of privileges for not being able to sleep through the night would make any difference. I couldn't force myself to sleep then, just as I can't now.

[Pancake2015]

Its usually bath, drink and bed. They are tired when they go to bed as they do fall asleep fairly quickly. Sometimes they admit they are ready for bed. Same as when they wake up, they look so tired.
One of them is waking up, i think and waking the other up out of boredom.

I dont know what to do as punishments dont feel right. I did bar them from any consoles or tablets last week for a day. I told them when they wouldnt go back to sleep. It had gone from 2am to 5am. I had to follow through.

But i also cant continue losing my cool early hours in the morning every day. Im also really struggling to function and have patience throughout the day. I usually crash when they come home from school and am just an irritable mess!
You can also see a dip in their behaviour which i can only blame on tiredness. Just general groggy and moodiness.

[Pancake2015]

They dont play with anything in their room. They just jump about and stuff...but often whisper! Theyre trying, i suppose with the whispering! Many times i have been woken from a big massive bang off them doing a jump off the bed. Not a good way to be woke up, i tell you!

[treaclesoda]

No, definitely not. That would scare the life out of me!

I'm sorry, I don't have any answers, but reading the thread did just bring it back to me how difficult I found it to sleep through as a child.

[Pancake2015]

Its ok. I dont think there are any answers. I think i just need to ride it out best i can.
Very difficult to do, but hopefully its a short phase.

I just needed to vent somewhere as i really didnt want to lose my cool again. I would just like to be able to relax and rest

[BugPlaster]

I think some cooperation can be expected from a 5 and 7 year old though. (What do I know? I'm hoping for when we get there). Ok they might be bored and scared being awake on their own but waking others isn't ok whether it's deliberately or by whispering.
So yes to loss of privileges if they continue to wake and be noisy. Can the older one be encouraged to read if they are waking first? A small light by their bed? Might make their eyes tired. Might've a terrible idea.
I don't think you have to ride it out without some form of plan to try to make it better.

[reni2]

Could you try out a later bedtime? Some kids don't need much sleep. Irrespective of this, 5 and 7 is old enough not to wake anyone else if they wake up. No advice on that one other than be max unpleasant.

I'd almost be tempted to go in with drums and trumpets an hour before they rise for a demonstration

[Pancake2015]

Its very hard to stick to any plan at the minute as im so exhausted by it all. Later bedtimes make no difference. I have tried (without them knowing) by letting them stay up later. I tried this when they were going to bed together, too and it just ended up them being awake even later.

They have been asleep for a while now but if i went to sleep now id be an angry mess when i get woke up again of thud thud thud in a couple of hours.
I hate myself for being so snappy and groggy, but how can i not be with little to no sleep!

[AcrossthePond55]

I don't understand why 'punishments'* for this don't feel right to you. You've asked them to be quiet and go to sleep. They aren't minding you. It's no different than if you'd asked them to wash their hands before dinner or to stop teasing each other. Are you saying if you ask them to do something and they don't do it, it doesn't feel right to you for them to have consequences for their refusal to do as they are asked?

You're never going to stop this if you don't give them a reason to want to stop it.


*I really don't like the word 'punishment'. I think it's used too often to deflect the need to set boundaries by making them sound harsh.

[reni2]

Right, dc you woke me at 2am and you are clearly full of beans, let's use the time for extra spelling and timestables practice. That's how I taught mine it is not clever to wake mummy at 5 am on a Sunday.

[AcrossthePond55]

Another suggestion, do you think it would do any good to put a folding screen between the two beds so they can't see each other? I know they'd still be able to hear, but maybe a physical barrier would give more of a sense of being 'separate'.

[Pancake2015]

Its not that i dont want to give consequences. It doesnt feel right because they should be sleeping, imo. For 5 and 7, they know bedtime, they know morning time. They were doing this. I was forever telling people how i have been lucky as they have been brilliant sleepers! Theyre making up for it now! That makes me feel like we have gone backwards.

It also doesnt feel right as i have found i really cannot do it. I go in their bedroom feeling like im going to handle this, and then realise that i havent. It adds to the frustration. I hate shouting at them, as it is so far away from what i would like and thats what i end up doing because im fed up of it, so i feel defeated instantly.

I have given up in a sense due to exhaustion, i suppose. I need to find some energy and will power to tackle this.

[Pancake2015]

Brilliant ideas with the homework stuff and the folding screen. The folding screen could be used as something to play with though, but it might work!

I did bring them down a couple of weeks ago and made them stay up a couple of hours downstairs just sitting there watching what i was watching on tv. They werent fazed in the slightest

[AcrossthePond55]

But if you start the night with them knowing what to expect then it's just a matter of enforcing it.

"Alright Buford and Ulysses, it's bedtime. We've talked before about staying in bed and being quiet because you need your sleep. If I hear any whispers or if either of you get out of bed tonight, then tomorrow there will be no TV/pudding/screentime/whatever."

Cue noise. You walk in and say sternly but not shouting "Alright, I warned you. I said no noise/jumping about and you didn't listen. You know what that means, tomorrow there will be no . If I hear it again it will be two nights. Now settle down and go to sleep". Shut the door, walk away.

This isn't going to work overnight, but if you handle it calmly and carry through the next day they'll soon get the message.

[Mistigri]

You can't MAKE children sleep, but you can make it the best option by making staying awake less attractive.

Are they putting the light on? Take out the bulb. Remove toys from their room. Make sure there is nothing to do, no reason to get out of bed and crash around.

When dd did this and disturbed her brother, I very occasionally got her up and had her sit with nothing to do somewhere I could keep an eye on her. She quickly decided that going to bed and going back to sleep was preferable.

Finally, while I don't agree with punishing children for not sleeping, losing privileges for waking other people is perfectly acceptable!

[Pancake2015]

I will try and stick to that for a couple of weeks. Im just going to have to remind myself to take a lot of deep breaths before i go to tell them when they do wake. I can see its me who is the problem at the minute with how badly im not handling it.

Thank you all.

I love the names by the way ha. I have no idea how you even pronounce ulysses?

Hopefully i will find the will power to get me through this...and im hoping im able to find an hour or 7 to catch up on some sleep. Wishful thinking!