Does anyone have figures for people in prison for consensual sex with similarly aged but underage partners?

[SardineQueen]

Just looking at another thread on here and a lot of people saying they know young men who are in prison / on the sex offenders register for consensual sex - the ages being talked about are 15 and 17.

Also someone saying that in young offenders institutes there are a of young people in there for similarly aged consensual sex.

This seems unlikely to me but I have no figures to go on so I don't really know. Does anyone have any stats on this?

Thanks.

[Prolesworth]

I'd be amazed if there were any teenage boys/men in prison for having consensual sex with a 15 year old. I spoke to the police about a man in his early 20s who was (imo) preying on my 14 year old daughter and, although the police did interview him and said to me afterwards that they could understand my concern (he was an absolute creep) and that they wouldn't want him anywhere near their daughters, without a complaint from my DD they said they could do nothing. Which I found and still find shocking.

[FallenCaryatid]

'You seem to be saying that girls can have boys put in prison for getting them pregnant. Where do you live, Afghanistan?!!'

Ireland. What happened to the Romeo and Juliet law?

[SardineQueen]

But we don't live in Ireland either

[SardineQueen]

Proles how awful. I hope it turned out OK in the end. Is DD OK?

There was another thread on here where a mother was at her wits end with an older drug addict who her DD wouldn't stay away from and the police said there was nothing they could do.

In cases where these is a big difference in maturity or suggestions of a wonky power balance I would expect the police to do something. But they don't.

[scurryfunge]

The police would make referrals to other agencies who are better placed to support the family, so it's not always a question of " doing nothing".

[SardineQueen]

The question is will action be taken regarding the law in the event of consensual sex between eg a 15yo and a 17yo.

The answer is that the law says it is not interested in these cases.

[SardineQueen]

If you read the OP and first post again you will see what the conversation is about.

TBH I would not expect referrals to be made in the case of a 15yo and a 17yo having consensual sex. I guess if a parent pushed and pushed they might get something. From what I can see SS are left to try and sort things out at a stage where I would expect the police to be involved.

[FallenCaryatid]

I'm not in Ireland, Maryz is. It's just that the response of
'Where do you live, Afghanistan?!!' seemed a bit stereotypical and therefore limited.
As if only places like that would be so restrictive.

[scurryfunge]

My response was in relation to your comment about the police not doing anything because there was nothing to investigate without confirmation from the girl herself. If there are issues over maturity, etc then that is not a police matter. The police quite rightly do not pursue teenage relationships that are consensual. They will investigate to a point in order to ensure the teen is safe but beyond that, it is not down to them to parent.

[SardineQueen]

Maryz is not on this thread
Ireland is a very different place to the UK
It is a place "like that" in matters relating to religion, and sex
As is Northern Ireland to an extent, which shares most of our laws but notably not the one on abortion, which is a constant source of anger and upset to many people

However this thread is about the UK.

[wem]

I generally agree with what you are saying SardineQueen, but I want to make one point - in law, a 15 year old isn't having consensual sex. That's what the age of consent means, she/he is deemed not old enough to give consent. It still stands that they don't intend to prosecute similarly aged teenagers, which I agree with, but to call it consensual sex is not legally accurate, and muddies the waters of who can give consent, which isn't helpful in other areas, e.g. drunkeness and incapacity.

[SardineQueen]

"They will investigate to a point in order to ensure the teen is safe"

Two examples on this thread at least where that has not happened.
It is not a police matter full stop.
If a parent wishes to involve agencies I guess they can but again with a consensual relationship between a 15yo and a 17 yo I can't see much happening.

So many people have a really odd view of what goes on, which seems very out of touch with reality. Services are pressed. They have enough on their plate with really serious situations to be spending time sitting down with a cheerful 15yo because their parents said so

[SardineQueen]

wem that is incorrect.

The law says that consent cannot be given, if the child is under 13.

[wem]

Really? Sorry, I wasn't sure as I typed it, and knew there was another cut off at 13. Why is 16 called 'the age of consent' then?

[wem]

I'd say this paragraph:

"Although the age of consent remains at 16, the law is not intended to prosecute mutually agreed teenage sexual activity between two young people of a similar age, unless it involves abuse or exploitation."

recognises that having sex with a 15 year old is still a crime, just not one they intend to prosecute 17 year olds for.

[wem]

It's the difference in language between 'mutually agreed' and 'consensual'

A falling-over-drunk woman could agree to sex, but I think we'd all say she wasn't able to give proper consent.

Sorry, this is off on a tangent.

[chocladoodle]

'A pregnancy does not magically render consensual sex, non-consensual'

Of course it doesn't and to say that it does is ridiculous.

Pregnancy however is a true indicator that a girl has had sex and this pregnancy would no doubt bring attention from alot of sources.
Whether or not at this point the parents push for the girl to make a statement to the police is a decision that the family would have to make. You seem to find that anyone wanting to do that as unbelievable, but it does happen. I'm sure some parents of pregnant teenagers would like some action taken against the boy involved. In reality however it rarely happens. It would require the girl to make a complaint and this is usually where the procedure falls down.

"Why on earth would a 15 yo girl want to involve the police after having consensual sex with her boyfriend?"

Perhaps pressure from her parents and Social Services who believe she is too young and/or immature to be involved in sexual activity and needs protecting.

'You seem to be saying that girls can have boys put in prison for getting them pregnant.'
Did I? I don't think I did say that.

'It is there to protect children and teens from abuse, exploitation and coercion'
Of course that's why the law is there, but I didn't think we were discussing anything other than consensual sex amongs similar aged teenagers. But I stand by that the law, going back many, many years, which has been altered and updated over the decades has always had the protection of young teenage girls in mind and the prevention of them getting pregnant. After all it was always the case that a teenage pregnancy by far disadvantage the girl than it did the boy.

[chocladoodle]

'"They would of course require the 15 yr girls to comply and give statements in order to make a complaint against him"

A complaint of what?
Consensual sex?
Make a complaint?
Of what?
Nice sex?'

To make a complaint to the police basically means that you are reporting a crime to them and as a witness to the crime, a statement would need to be taken highlighting the details of that crime.

If the sex in mutually agreed then the likelyhood of this ever occuring is slim.

If however the parents of the underage girl discover that sex has taken place then they might try and encourage the girl to make a complaint to the police.

Without her cooperation then there can be no proceedings taken against the boy.

[KlickKlackknobsac]

We met a group of ex convicts, two of whom were on life licence. They told us (Post 16 students and teachers) that the law has been changed, and consensual sex between underage (either males or females) or with of age (either male or female) and underage 'children' is STATUTORY rape and SHOULD be investigated, and lead to prosecution. He spent qute a while explaining it to the students (for obvious reasons) and there was a forensic criminal psychologist there who did not contradict. He was very convincing- perhaps that is where the comments on the other thread are coming from?? I must admit I have been telling my students- of course if no complaint is ever made then it will not get that far. As a poster said earlier- the girl may be asked for a statement, which is not the same as making a complaint.
My knowledge of law tells me that what is written in 2003 can be interpreted differently in 2012 as we have the principle of precedent which can alter the usage of law........
Chocladoodle- I am pretty sure that your assertions about the requirement for a complaint (whilst seeming logical) are not correct.

[chocladoodle]

"You really need to read the act."

Perhaps you should have a look over the entire act and stop focusing on the just the one paragraph.

It IS an offence for a 16 yr boy to have sex with a 15 yr girl. The part you keep focusing on states that it is not the intention of the law to jump on and prosecute in all of these situations. Realistically this would never happen. However what it doesn't mean is that it is no longer illegal.

It is still illegal. There are loads of different parts of the act which is relevant to this discussion. I have copied a very small part of it for you.

Having intercourse with an older child
If a person (?A?), who has attained the age of 16 years, with A?s penis, penetrates to any extent, either intending to do so or reckless as to whether there is penetration, the vagina, anus or mouth of a child (?B?), who?
(a) has attained the age of 13 years, but
(b) has not attained the age of 16 years,
then A commits an offence, to be known as the offence of having intercourse with an older child.

[chocladoodle]

KlickKlack - could you explain a little more about why you think that?
obviously in more serious crimes, like murder, an investigation would automatically begin regardless of whether anyone reports it or not. But something like this would definitely need the cooperation of the parties involved unless of course other aspects of exploitation, abuse etc are present.

[chocladoodle]

Another thing that is illegal is in the case when both boy and girl are under 16yrs. The boy would be able to be prosecuted but not the girl. Even though they are both, say, 15 yrs and it was consensual. This goes back to my previous point of protecting the girl more, as she has the most at risk and the greater requirement for protection.

It is a shame that this message has been 'lost' over the years and that even though everyone knows the age of consent is 16 most people seem to think that it doesn't matter anymore. No wonder young girls are feeling more pressure into having sex at younger and younger ages.

[FormSquare]

I'd imagine a 15 year old girl is more dangerous to the lad than vice versa...

Once all those hormones are on the rampage.

[SardineQueen]

"Another thing that is illegal is in the case when both boy and girl are under 16yrs. The boy would be able to be prosecuted but not the girl. "

I don't think this is true.
Please can you link.

And the law is as it stands to protect boys and girls from abuse, coercion, relationships with a problematical power dynamic eg a much older partner.
It is not there to prosecute boys when girls get pregnant. No matter how much you say that, it will not make it true.
You keep saying that girls need to comply and give evidence. Of what? Nice sex? Having sex? Having mutually agreed sex with a similarly aged teen is not something the police are required by law to be interested in. That is what the law say. If they believe that abuse, coercion etc has occured then they can use the appropriate parts to investigate and prosecute. So if a teenager went to the police and made a complaint that something bad had happened, of course they would investigate. Ditto if the report came from another source.

[SardineQueen]

"I'd imagine a 15 year old girl is more dangerous to the lad than vice versa...

Once all those hormones are on the rampage."

What on earth does this mean
There is no doubt that sex is riskier for females than males (in heterosexual relationships) due to higher risk of STDs, risk of pregnancy and birth/abortion.