Puppy Support Group 2

[DuchessDarty]

A continuation of this:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/the_doghouse/3600375-Young-Puppy-Support-Group

All age of puppies (and owners ) welcome

[BiteyMcBiteFace]

Thank you for you kind words @Biteyshark @Kateinlondon and @Keepsmiling1 The trainer/behaviourist who runs our obedience classes came and visited on Friday afternoon after we were let down by the previous lady. Hopefully this will be the turning point, as she gave us ways of dealing with the biting and has suggested that she needs even more sleep and I was overstimulating her with too much 'doing stuff'. She said she just needs to 'be' and less is more. I think I was trying to entertain her the whole time she was awake and it was getting too much for her and her teething has made her even more grouchy. Shes just coming up 21 weeks and you can see the new teeth coming through and pushing against the puppy ones She also said I need to breathe and not get so stressed about it. Hard when everything you've been wearing has holes from the grabby bitey cow She also showed us how to practice a settle down in the lounge and it was quite interesting to see how she demonstrated it. Something to keep plugging away at I think. She was so bitey I wondered if there was something wrong with her, but she put our minds at rest and said there was nothing at all about her that gave her cause for concern.

@Grassynoel Sorry but your posts just make me chuckle so much. I'm sure it's not so funny when you're having food stolen though

[Grassynoel]

I'm glad BiteyMcBiteFace, we all need a chuckle with the little terrors we've brought on ourselves!

Interesting point on them possibly being overtired! I know in the last thread someone said forced crating worked when their pup was overtired. Our fella probably doesn't sleep enough. He sleeps most of the night but only a little during the day as he's too busy wreaking havoc round the joint.

Today he ran into the kitchen and gave a bark. I thought what fresh hell so I went out and he was sitting at his food bowl and looking pointedly from the bowl to the press where his food is kept. I fed him and he ate it all. I was well impressed. This leads me to the conclusion that he is clever, as suspected, and is an all-round champion piss-taking bollocks at the best of times.

[BiteyShark]

I think it makes a world of difference when you get a good 1-1 trainer. So glad your trainer put your mind to rest BiteyMcBiteFace as it's hard when your tired, stressed and in the thick of it.

BiteyDog was a real git when he was over stimulated and I could have almost set my watch by him in the evenings when he turned from cocker puppy into a cockerdile

[Girliefriendlikescake]

We're just back from a stressful walk, we went on along a quiet field and dpup was off lead, saw a couple coming along with their two dogs which were on lead and before we could get our dog back he had raced up to them.

Lots of shouting from the couple that their dog wasn't friendly and both dd and I were desperately trying to grab our puppy. Unfortunately the other dog had a go at him, dpup yelped so I think he probably did get bitten although we can't see where 😕

It was totally our fault for not getting him on the lead quick enough but we were all a bit traumatised. The other dog that bit him was a tiny sausage dog!!!

Think we will all be a bit more cautious with when he is off lead again and we def need to work harder at his recall.

[namechanged984630]

I feel the same @Keepsmiling1 and our puppies are the same age. It is such a source of anxiety for me.

I'm interested in the trainer's "settle down" routine @BiteyMcBiteFace if you'll tell us?!

[SunnyUpNorth]

I’d be very interested in the settle too please! Did you just get them over for an hour? Do you mind me asking how much you paid? I’m talking to a trainer tomorrow about a 1-2-1 session and not sure what to expect re cost.

@Grassynoel are you Irish? There’s a lot of Irish-isms in your posts!

Totally echo everyone’s claustrophobia and concerns. We didn’t get our pup til he was 12 weeks so I think not having that first four weeks of wees etc helped.
I’m just desperate to be able to leave mine for longer and then I think I will feel less restricted. I’m surprised I’m not feeling a lot worse about it all actually. I think it’s because it reminds me so much of having a baby but on fast forward so I know (I hope!) we will be out of the feeling trapped phase soon. I’m clinging to the fact that he is mostly super chilled and a very good boy so I feel we have the bones of a good boy so I’m just hoping we don’t ruin him!

We had our final puppy class tonight and it was a different guy covering the class. He was very good but what they both have in common is constantly reiterating that you shouldn’t overindulge or mollycoddle the dogs. They said they need to know who is in charge and who makes the decisions. They both said that now our dogs are a bit older (most in the class are now around 17-18 weeks) we need to stop praising them and treating them so much when they do something as they need to start learning that’s just an expected level of behaviour.

[Keepsmiling1]

It's so nice to hear that other people feel the same as I do (I know how selfish that sounds!) I hope that in a couple of weeks we will all be feeling better.

I'm interested in the settle too. We have been to 2 puppy classes and they talk about the settle. We have a mat and they suggest dropping treats all over it when pup isn't looking so they then spend time finding them and associate it with a nice treat. SmileyPup loves the treats but as soon as they're gone he's off so not much settling!

We have had 2 poos inside today! I have come to my mums with DDs for the night to give myself a break and left pup with DH. I definitely need some time away!

[Girliefriendlikescake]

Are all of you still not telling off when they toilet inside? I'm finding my patience is wearing really thin, he has wee'd inside twice today and I think it's because it's slightly raining so he doesn't want to go out 🙄

If i see him do it I do say NO quite loudly 😬 I know that's against most of the advice but I seriously feel like he should know better by now!!

[SunnyUpNorth]

I have read and heard that you absolutely must not tell them off when they go inside. You can praise and make a fuss when they go outside but you complete ignore it when they go inside. Even getting cross is giving them a response and they don’t really know what a telling off means. Especially if they have done it a few seconds/minutes before and have no idea what you’re talking about. Plus apparently it can just make them do it in secret indoors.

[BiteyShark]

Girlie when my puppy was a bit older but still struggling with toileting and I saw him about to pee or in mid pee I would make an 'ah' noise, grab him and run out into the garden then praise him outside. I think that helped because he got praise but the noise initially just stopped him mid pee rather than a telling off which he wouldn't understand. Yes sometimes the pee went over me or the house but it helped him realise that actually peeing is ok but in the garden.

[Egg]

Hi all. Please may I join??? Picked up new puppy yesterday who is 9 weeks old. We already have a 6 year old dog so I thought I knew what I was doing but no! It has pelted with rain continuously since we got him so taking him out for toilet training is tedious. It’s pitch black and absolutely bucketing down and he’s so small he’ll really feel that rain! My big girl doesn’t like him and runs away from him ☹️

[yodl]

I know they advise you not to tell puppy off when he´s relieving himself inside but at one point I have still done it with both of my dogs. I just got fed up with it and couldn´t help myself.
My first dog was about 4 months old when I lost it :D And that was the last time she ever weed inside.
With our current puppy I told him a firm NO about five days ago when I caught him in the middle of it, he was 11 weeks old then. The result was he started to give some kind of understandable signals when he needs to go. He sits close to the door and looks at me or runs to me and whines.
So telling him off kind of worked for us.

I´ve managed to move up on my anxiety level. I can´t fall asleep and I wake up way too early listening if our pup is destructing our house downstairs or not. They sleep together in the hallway as I probably have told before so now I´m convinced that they ruin our house while we are asleep. They haven´t done a thing yet tbh but I just can´t help myself. I feel as if I´ll never sleep again and it makes me even more anxious :(

[BiteyMcBiteFace]

Oh no Girliefriendlikescake I hope your little one is ok. What a shock for all of you We are currently still sticking to a long line, as I don't yet trust her to recall if she saw something more interesting.

I think it's inevitable at some point that you will shout when you see them toileting inside yet again. It's human nature to get fed up with mopping up pee every day

For those who were interested in the settle technique I was shown. The trainer used a blanket/mat and a shortish lead. She asked her lay on the blanket and gave a treat. When she got up she asked her again and gave a treat and when she got up again she just used the lead to stop her wandering off. She said that she knows what is expected of her and it's just waiting for her to offer it without having to keep on saying it. Obviously she can't go anywhere and after a bit of tantruming she laid on the blanket. Obviously they're not going to settle straight away for a long period, so you keep having to repeat the exercise every day, but the idea is eventually they understand that they have to settle there. She said if she has a total paddy about it and starts biting and jumping she is to be put in her crate for a few minutes and try again. After 3 of 4 times of that, if she still won't offer a settle, then she stays crated. The idea is that all that is on offer is settle on the mat, or be crated - no other option - and eventually they will realise that it's better to be out and settled than crated. That's the theory anyway. Biteypup is starting to get it, but she doesn't settle for long so we'll have to keep trying to extend the period with a view that hopefully we'll be able to go to a pub and she'll settle when told. Yeah right!

Keepsmiling1 You lucky thing - a night away! What I wouldn't give for a bit of respite

[EastLon]

Can I join too? I am so relieved this thread exists. I feel like an awful person. We’ve had our 8 week old puppy three days and I swing between adoring him and wondering what the hell I have done.

We’re not even attempting to toilet train to outside yet only onto puppy pads since we’re in an apartment (he’s a breed that should adapt to that well) and he isn’t fully vaccinated yet so I don’t want him sniffing around out in the ungated front garden. The first night we crated him and he cried and cried and I let him out every hour for the toilet. Then I went to a pet boutique to try and get something to comfort him and they told me it is cruel to try and teach him to hold it in so young and it’ll be months til he can hold it even a few hours (he’s a small breed), so now we have a puppy pen around the crate and there’s a puppy pad the other end. Which is better. But I still slept (a little bit at least) on the sofa near him because of his separation anxiety.

I knew it would be hard work. And it’s not that it’s harder than I thought it would be as such... I expected it to be tough but I feel so tired and emotional.

And when he won’t stop nipping at my feet I feel so annoyed at him and then so guilty at being annoyed because he is just a tiny baby and he didn’t ask to come and live with me (I don’t show him that I am annoyed, just make a noise to show him when he goes too hard like they say to).

Anyway. This is tough. It makes me feel so much better to know I am normal and that it gets better and just because he is nipping he won’t turn into a demon dog. I feel like there is so much contradictory information out there that whatever I do I am doing it wrong 😔

[Grassynoel]

@SunnyUpNorth yes I'm Irish.

@Girliefriendlikescake I hope puppy isn't traumatised by his experience. Poor little pet. Probably worse for you though. I feel the same thinking he should know better by now.

Not too bad here today. Only one poo and about 6 wees to bloody mop up. He did go to the door once to be let out for a poo though so we live in hope.

The rain is a head melter isn't it? No way will my fella go out in it, especially when it's heavy.

[Snoopdogowner]

Rain, digging, mud, yuk! Kitchen floor covered in old towels which pup likes to also chew on 🙄. Puppy school tonight. Hope he doesn't show us up and shit on the floor or something equally as embarrassing!

[Keepsmiling1]

@yodl how are you feeling now? Anxiety is horrible. I never realised that's what I had - I thought I was just a worrier but recently I've realised it's more than that.

@BiteyMcBiteFace I know it was just what I needed. It was so nice not to have to get up early to take him out for a wee or listen to him cry when I was getting ready in the morning. Back to reality today though!

[Girliefriendlikescake]

Welcome east

Thanks for all the kind words, dpup was fine today on his walk but we didn't really see any other dogs! It is so hard to keep being patient with the toilet training, we've had him 7 weeks today and seem to be getting more accidents than ever 😩 I did ignore the wee in the kitchen this morning though 😉

[DuchessDarty]

With my kids long past toddler stage, I thought my days of worrying about a small creature's bowel movements were over, but no. Nor did I think that I'd actually want to see a dog poo again after finding one in my shoe the other day.

But the shoeshitter DartyPup hasn't down a poo all day which is not like her and I'm hoping she's OK. She's also been sleeping about 10 hours overnight without having a wee - is it normal that she's able to last that long?!

@BiteyMcBiteFace interesting your trainer said that less is more in terms of entertaining your puppy - that's certainly been my experience. Between getting DartyPup when she was 8 weeks old until she was about 3 months old, I was focused on her and she kind of ran the day's routine (I work from home, but wasn't doing much work as DartyPup needed a lot of attention). But then my child got sick which dominated the summer, and DartyPup really had to take a back seat. I was still around - even more so in fact - but didn't have the mental, emotional or physical time energy to do much training or focused playing. And you know what, it's been a good thing. We've got into some bad habits - like a certain puppy sleeping on my bed despite me vowing she wouldn't ... - and I dropped the ball with the training somewhat. But I've realised that as long as i'm there in the house she's perfectly happy just chilling. I've realised how much sleep she actually needs. I get a lot of comments when she's out or being 'borrowed' by people about how calm and confident she is, and I do think that her just learning to 'be' when near me is part of it.

I had a little chuckle to myself the other week when I was on a phonecall in the kitchen and saw DartyPup going up the stairs. Really unusual for her to do that - she usually stays in the same room as me or the one next door no matter where I am. When I finished my call, I went up to the top floor and there she was on our bed, asleep. She'd taken herself upstairs for a nap. I felt that my baby had really grown up and now was independent and confident enough to do her own thing, proud sob.

[EastLon]

Thank you.

And ha! In my suggested ads today was a blacklight to spot accidents. I’m pretty sure my whole living room laminate is covered in eastpup’s urine at this point and would light up like a Christmas tree 😂

[Bayby]

Well today’s the day!

We pick her this afternoon. It’s definitely bittersweet, but I’m very excited!

[yodl]

Welcome, newbies! You´ve come to the right place, this thread is so helpful!
And good luck @Bayby!

@Keepsmiling1 it´s getting worse with the anxiety. I lost my ability to sleep well when our twins were born. I´m extremely light sleeper and wake up very easily but it´s gotten much more worse since we brought our puppy home. Before that I woke up but fell back asleep quickly when I realized that our twins are asleep and fine. I didn´t have to go and check them out, just listened for a second and if everything was quiet I fell back asleep. But that´s not the case anymore. Today I woke up at 5.30 AM and was awake for 40 minutes. Then slept for a second and woke up again at 6.40 AM. After that there was no point of falling asleep again since I had to get up at 7.
Our puppy was up at 5.30 as well. He was downstairs playing with our older dog and I heard every sound they made.

Our older dog used to sleep longer than we did. I had to wake her. Now our puppy wakes her. And they play loudly. They roll around and roll themselves against the doors etc. Our twins wake up earlier than usual as well as a result. And then they´re tired during the day. But they have to sleep well as they have to go to school five days a week.
I think I still have to crate train the puppy although I had decided not to. But I can´t see him sleeping longer any time soon when he roams around freely. What do others suggest? Should I crate him?

[DuchessDarty]

@EastLon at lighting up like a Christmas tree. I dread to think what I’d see if I used it in our house after 4 months of puppy ownership. Best to be in denial.

[DuchessDarty]

@Bayby very very exciting, hope all goes well!

[Alsohuman]

So pleased to have found this thread. We picked our JRT up on Saturday, she’s nine weeks tomorrow. Between sleep deprivation and the incessant nibbling (she bit my finger quite hard this morning), I’m swinging between adoring her and wishing she wasn’t here. She reliably wees outside but poos wherever the fancy takes her.

I’ve convinced myself that, once she’s had her second vaccinations and we can get her into a routine of being walked, life will improve. Am I right?