19 yr old daughter just failed first year at uni - studies terminated - what can we do? (long -sorry)!

[bebemoose]

My daughter was distraught and said she didnt know why she had failed as her marks were OK. Turns out when we (secretly) checked her emails that she had actually been warned that her grades and attendance were bad in January, and that if they didnt improve, her attendance would be taken into account when deciding whether to allow her to continue into the second year. I'm assuming that this is what has happened. I havent taken that up with her yet as she has been at work both days and I dont want to upset her and make her lose her job.

I want to see someone at the uni to discuss how her marks for the year only average 35%, which I dont wish to challenge, just have them explained. I have rung every day since we found out on Tuesday and been passed around from pillar to post, with no one being able to arrange for us to see the correct person.

We have just paid £600 rent for her first quarter in her accommodation for next year, and have absolutely no idea what to do with her if she cant carry on in uni as this is the one thing she really wanted to do. She was ill quite a lot this year - as in she often rang and said she wasnt well, but nothing she can substantiate as an excuse. She was diagnosed as dyslexic (through the uni) towards the end of term, so I was wondering whether to try mitigating circumstances, as she would have been given extra time to do the work if they had known at the beginning of the year - but this still doesnt excuse the poor attendance, so not sure if this is worthwhile pursuing.

She seems to have put it all to the back of her mind and is now (after the initial crying on Tuesday) all happiness and behaving as if nothing is wrong. (I'm sure she is just putting on a brave face as she woks on a checkout and has to be nice to customers.) I, by contrast, am crying, not able to sleep, think about it constantly and am basically completely stressed by it all.

I know we need to see her tutor to ask whether she has any options at that uni, like repeating the first year or transferring to another course, but I can't even get hold of her to book an appt (obviously because they are so busy).

I dont really know what I am asking here - maybe just how do I get through this - I was already very stressed as my older daughter is getting married in September and we have lots of organising for that, I run a Scout and a Guide uniform shop and do the website for my local cat charity. I also work almost full time and, although married, do not have a good relationship with my husband - think separate lives in the same house. And I'm so cross that this has ruined my older daughter's day - as on the same day she graduated with a first, and any celebrations were just cancelled.

Maybe instead of trying to see someone and get her back on another course and fighting this, we should just walk away and try again in another year or so, when she is older and wiser? I cant decide if that would be the less stressful route. I cant actually think straight. Sorry this is so long - I needed to put it all down.

[EldritchCleavage]

They have been denied access to a marking scheme with assignment weightings so they didnt know which ones to spend more time on. (The class actually asked for a marking scheme and were told that they couldnt have it as they would be 'chasing marks'.)

I wouldn't put this forward in any submissions you make, OP. You cannot use as an argument the fact that your DD wanted to know which things she could coast on and which to take seriously. The answer about chasing marks was effectively saying the same. She had to do ALL her assignments conscientiously. I have to say I would not have dreamt of asking for a marking scheme. The very idea of selective effort indicates to me your DD was either not coping or not committed.

I know it is hard to hear, but speaking as someone who takes a lot of trainees just out of uni, I am also reading between the lines and wondering if your DD has just not been engaging with the work, and with her tutors. I do sympathise, because I had a very very hard first year at university myself.

[FamiliesShareGerms]

OP, I'm sorry you're going through a tough time. But sorry, you aren't getting the full picture here. Maybe your younger daughter has felt under pressure to shine because she has a super brainy big sister who has clearly got the hang of university (ie to get a first) and didn't want to let you down by admitting she hasn't done what she needed to do? Maybe she is genuinely struggling with the course or institution and one or other isn't right for her? Maybe something else... But unis hate to throw students out (it impacts on their rankings, and they lose the tuition fees), so it really is a last resort action.

But you need to sit down and have an honest, no blame conversation with her about what happened this year and what she wants to do next. Then she has to go away and do whatever (speak to tutor; try to get deposit back on accommodation; apply for a new course / Uni; look for a job...) with your support in the background.

[LRDtheFeministDragon]

I agree the OP is probably not getting the full story here (and incidentally, there's nothing especially wrong with adult children not giving all the details to parents, but that's another story right now). But I would guess the daughter may not be deliberately lying so I want to say that in case the OP feels upset/goes in all guns blazing.

I don't have much experience teaching yet, but what I have noticed and what we got extensive guidance about during training sessions was that university students quite often have the wrong expectations about what's their responsibility to find out or follow up.

• A student should find out for themselves which events - classes, lectures, seminars, lab work, whatever - are mandatory and how attendance will be assessed.
  

• A student should know what is the approved means of recording sick days (phone may be fine, but in writing is usually the rule).
  

• A student should find out what to do about extensive illness. Illness is obviously not her fault, but if the rule is that she needs a doctor's note for more than x many days sick, she needs to do that. Maybe she isn't counting sick days as missing attendance and the university is?
  

• She should email to clarify about the conflicting attendance reports. It is her responsibility to set the record straight if she believes she was emailed in error.
  

• She should know what grades count as 'good'. What does a B, C, or F correlate to in terms of the percentage mark scheme?
  

These are all things that a lot of students will complain about, saying 'but no one told me!' or 'but I didn't know to do that!'. She needs to know. If she gets back next year, it might help to go to the disability resource centre and ask if someone could go through the rules with her - it may be realy hard if you're dyslexic to go through a long, often badly-formatted document like most university rulebooks, but she could at least take responsibility for getting someone to help her work through it.

Last thing ... you say 'the whole class repeatedly asked for a marking scheme with assignment weightings which was actually denied them - as they would be 'chasing marks'.'

This does seem a little rude to me, to be honest. It does depend on the context, but the class are effectively saying 'do more work - I don't trust your marking, teacher'. I would bet that - hidden in that same rulebook - there will be guidance on assessment procedures. Students may be used to A-Level style tickboxes. This may not apply at university. It's not necessarily fair to demand it.

[LRDtheFeministDragon]

Sorry, that was so monster I obviously cross-posted with people who said it much better.

[Lancelottie]

Cory -- thanks, won't hijack further at the moment, but you may well be right that it'll be unrealistic to expect him to cope with important aspects of university life. Remembering to eat, for instance...
He's so intelligent and able in all the less important ways, though .

[cory]

It is very hard, isn't it, Lancelottie?

I have a 15yo dd who, though obviously well equipped with brains, hasn't at the moment got the emotional or even the physical stamina to cope even with secondary school. All I can do is try my best to help her to become independent and trust that she will find her niche when she needs to. But it may need the whole family being prepared to think out of the box.

Sorry, OP- hi-jack.

[Sabriel]

Our DS1 dropped out of uni in his first year. He'd been ill (he said) and had just stopped going to class. DH had a meeting with the tutor (and DS obviously) to see what the best course of action was and it transpired there was no evidence of work ie he hadn't handed anything in. He came home, went out to work and went back the next year but still couldn't manage and had to accept it wasn't going to happen.

He's now 24 and about to start an apprenticeship. He's been working in the same job all these years and living independently. It is hard but at some point they do have to grow up. Of course, school now demands so much input from parents that it's very difficult to suddenly be told you are now surplus.

Ds2 has just finished his 3rd year of uni and got a shock when they rang to say he'd failed his final exams. But those extra years make a difference and by the time he told us he'd already spoken to his tutor and the disability unit at his uni, had rung several other unis to see if he could transfer there and had sorted out himself what he wanted to do. He just told us what he was going to do, rather than ask for our help.

I understand completely that feeling of wanting to srt it out for your DC but as the others have said she'll probably have to suck this up, work for a year and perhaps apply next year once she's grown up a bit. You don't say how far away from home she was but in our DS1's case he was right at the far end of the country and it was just too far when it all started to go wrong. Had he been close enough to pop home when he first got ill there might have been a different outcome.

[nkf]

Plenty of good advice. Please please take your graduating daughter out somewhere nice.

[mirry2]

Bebemouse I think you have been getting a hard time on this thread. You must be very worried about your dd. Some children take longer than others to grow up and assert themselves. I wouldn't say boo to a goose until I was well into my 30s.

[albertswearengen]

I do feel for your daughter it is really scary when things start to wrong at Uni- when you miss a few lectures and then a few assignments and then you daren't go back to the tutorials because you missed too many or didn't hand in assignments and are too scared to talk to your tutor. The whole thing snowballs until it is one big stressful mess - I have known quite a few people in my long university career where this has happened. They told their parents all sorts of rubbish because they were too embarrassed to admit they messed up somewhere along the way.
Often they managed in certain modules but in others where it was a bit hard or boring things went wrong fairly easily.
One of my flatmates convinced us and his parents that he was doing fine right up until the exam results and it turns out he had basically given up 6 months before and hadn't been near the University. He left and started again 2 years later and got his degree easily.

[prettysunset]

mirry2- I also think that Bebemoose has been given a hard time on this thread. WTF is wrong with caring for your 'adult' child? If more parents showed support and interest in their children post 18 maybe we would not have such messed up late teen and early twenty somethings in the UK today! What's the alternative? Should Bebemoose kick her out of the house now and let her become another statistic, sitting on street corners getting asbos?

I think that Bebemoose has had some excellent advice here but we cannot judge each case by virue of age. I left for uni at 18 never having even used the washing machine (or made my own bed!) and instantly thrived, we are not all cut from the same cloth.

Much has been made of the missed celebrations for the DD1's 1st class degree...FFS! I'm sure the OP is beating herself up enough for not celebrating this without a bunch of bored harpies goading her! Always troubles me when people respond to post like this in a negative way- The OP must think she has inadvertently posted on IABU!

Hope all ends well OP, what is ment for you wont pass you by. Xx

[Chubfuddler]

She asked these bored harpies their opinions. And she hasn't had a hard time.

[JeanBodel]

I really do sympathise, OP.

But from your posts, you aren't coming across well.

You secretly check your daughter's e-mails.
You 'have no idea what to do with her' if she doesn't stay at uni.

You have been given some good advice on how to support your daughter. This might also be an opportunity to examine the relationship you have with her now that she is an adult. Your posts give the impression that you are finding it hard to accept that she is now grown up and independent of you. In your head she still seems to be a child and you still treat her like a child, organise her life, take responsibility for her decisions. I apologise if that is not the case. But if it is, it will do neither of you any good.

Oh, and 'I'm so cross that this has ruined my older daughter's day' - no, you did that. That was your choice. Don't blame that one on your younger daughter.

[UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea]

Pleased to be characterised as a bored harpie. It's a step up from lazy slattern

The OP of course knows her daughter and the situation the best. But the thread is useful in that a lot of people in similar situations, or familiar with University protocol have posted their experience / knowledge.

It's a long way from "let her learn from her own mistakes" to "kick her out to sleep on the streets"

[ClaireBunting]

You don't need to do anything, OP. It is up to your DD to sort out her mess.

[prettysunset]

Chubfuddler. Mincing over which board the OP has posted on...calling it 'telling' isn't a hard time?

[Chubfuddler]

No it isn't.

[prettysunset]

UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea bored harpie is so not a step up! Lazy slattern implies < I hope> some higher purpose than cleaning and MN!

[prettysunset]

Fair enough then Chub- I stand corrected...

[ToothbrushThief]

I feel for you OP. My DD struggled to cope in Yr 1 at uni but with extenuating circumstances.

The outcome was similar, she wanted to leave but didn't want to take responsibility for that decision.

I did not rush in but hid my shock and disappointment. She considered all her options 1) leave uni 2) get job 3) try another course and 4) return a year later.

It was about 2 months after she'd left that she regretted her action in leaving. She has been accepted to return (extenuating circumstances).

The message I'd strongly give is that it will not work if you get her back in.

It's only going to work if she commits to it

[ToothbrushThief]

If you prop her up she'll never learn how uncomfortable life can be.

[MumbleMumm]

I failed Uni fairly spectacularly. Spent 3 years getting drunk, was just not ready for it. I ended up having panic attacks and mild depression.
I phoned my parents to tell them I had quit (I jumped before I was pushed), then immediately sorted myself out a job in a call centre. I never ever expected that my parents help me to sort the mess out. If I wasn't at Uni I would be earning money - in whatever way I could.
12 years later - and I've just gone back to my job in admin after maternity leave - it amused me to find out they'd advertised my mat cover position as needing to be a graduate .

You need to take a step back, give your daughter the best 'I'm really disappointed, now what are you going to do about it' speech and let her develop in to the woman she needs to become to survive as an adult.
You never know - she might surprise you.

[WelshCerys]

OP - take heart from these posts. There are many options open to your DD. With your support and gentle encouragement, she'll be fine. I left Uni after a year and didn't return until I was - well, a lot older, and did pretty well. By then I'd worked, had three kids and done some other bits and pieces of training - went, in the end, to my local Uni and all was good.

Your DD is unlikely to wait that long - but a year or two or more won't hurt - at all.

I agree with a previous post, though. If she wants to go back, she could usefully contact the Dean. If he/she isn't around, it's likely that her letter will be passed to someone who will deal with it. There are so many issues here that perhaps the Dean is the most appropriate person in the first instance.

I slightly disagree with some here - yes, your DD is a young adult and must take responsibility for her decisions but she is very young and clearly has had difficulties. I think, on balance, she should take the lead in communicating with her Uni but when my son was having a hard time re accommodation, nobody at his Uni minded my making general queries. I'm sure a balance will be struck.

To the money you've paid for accommodation - if DD doesn't go back, do all you can to get it back - I'm sure a letter of support from the Uni would help. Hoping that the landlord will be sympathetic - please try.

And have that celebration. You all deserve it.

[difficultpickle]

There is a big difference between caring for an adult child and running their lives for them.

I would have been mortified if my parents had suggested that they contacted my uni tutors. I missed a term through illness but it was left to me to contact the uni and tell them I would be absent (didn't know how long to begin with) and to arrange with friends to get notes (pre computer days).

The only involvement my parents had was dropping and collecting me at the start and end of each year and coming to my graduation ceremony.

[TheProvincialLady]

There is one blessing. My flatmate passed his first year but was kicked out in his second...he didn't tell his parents until they turned up to his graduation ceremony, which he had given them a time and date for They were not happy.