Tell MNHQ what you think of the idea of us campaigning with BEAR for changes in food packaging

[MichelleMumsnet]

Three weeks ago, BEAR asked Mumsnetters for their views on a number of questions about what mattered to them when it came to buying snacks for their children’s lunchboxes. Over 900 of you responded (thank you!), and the research showed that 9 in 10 respondents are concerned about the amounts of highly processed ingredients in children’s fruit snacks, and that over half were unclear about what fruit snacks counted towards their child’s 5-a-day. What came through most strongly was that 3 in 4 want fruit juice concentrates to be declared on front-of-pack. BEAR's explanation of concentrates is that they 'are fruit juices that have been boiled at a high temperature down to a syrup, removing water and flavour, and then reconstituted later adding water and flavour packs, stripping out a lot of fibre and leaving more processed fruit sugars’.

The labelling of concentrates on front of pack is already compulsory on fruit juice packaging in the UK www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/192357/fruit-juice-si-20130425.pdf, but this doesn't apply to fruit snacks. BEAR wants to change that, and is lobbying the Department of Health (DoH) to address this. BEAR has asked if Mumsnet would like to co-sign the letter that will go to the DoH demanding this change.
So, we'd like you to let us know what you think. Should Mumsnet get behind a change in packaging that means that it’s compulsory for fruit concentrates to be declared on the front of pack?

Everyone who shares their opinions on this thread will be entered into a prize draw to win a £300 Love2Shop voucher!

Thanks
MNHQ

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

Perhaps BEAR should campaign for the "traffic light" labelling of food to be mandatory? I feel that would be more useful..

[MrPorky]

Why would Bear do that when all their products would be red for sugar and contain very little in the way of other nutrients?

What the hell does "gently baked" mean if we're talking about clear labelling?

[specialsubject]

sugar-peddlers. MN fell into the same trap with the brownie recipe last week, 'no added refined sugars' does not mean 'stuffed with sugar because it has lots of dried fruit in it'.

give your kid an apple, a banana or something and be done with it. Far less packaging and processing too, better for the planet.

sorry MN, this is low-science twerpery of the highest order.

[MrPorky]

I agree specialsubject. If MN really want to help parents understand better what they're feeding DC, they should end this association altogether.

As PP said, it's quite simple, if it needs labelling, it's highly unlikely it's "good" food. If you want to give your DC something healthy and nutritious, give them actual food. If you want to give them a convenient sweet sugary treat, give them haribo, save your money and stop kidding yourself you're being "good".

What is the difference really, between concentrated juices and drying gently baking fruit to concentrate the sugars?

[OTheHugeManatee]

Bit cynical about any 'healthy eating' campaign pushed by a food manufacturer, sorry. I think the association would just a whiff of product placement. Food labelling is a good cause but it's a no from me based on the associations of the campaign.

[AuntieStella]

"and the research showed that 9 in 10 respondents are concerned about the amounts of highly processed ingredients in children’s fruit snacks"

Was this something that respondents actually volunteered? Or was it from a limited selection of possibilities?

I do not think MN should be doing anything of this sort with a manufacturer.

But if enough MNers want identifiable steps taken, surely MNHQ has enough clout to join in a consultation as a free-standing, independent entity.

[specialsubject]

I should clarify that I am not against selling sweet snacks! What I am against is selling them as anything other than sweet snacks.

fruit does of course contain other nutrients that aren't in jelly babies.

[G1veMeStrength]

My DC love Yo Yo Bears and I opened this thread hoping you were going to ditch the pointless wasteful cards!

I'd never kid myself fruit snacks are healthy but I think for growing active kids they are fine - same as I think about sweets tbh. But I buy fruit juice from concentrate as it is so much cheaper. So what do I know.

My DC are healthy - they have energy, they don't look overweight, they sleep well, they eat veg, they do well at school, they do sport, they have glossy hair and wet noses. I've never looked at details on labels just gone by common sense.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

Was this something that respondents actually volunteered? Or was it from a limited selection of possibilities?

If my recollection is correct this "research" was a MN survey, and the specific question was "are you concerned about the amounts of highly processed ingredients in children's snacks"

So not a neutral question by any means, I didn't complete the survey eventually as its sole purpose was obviously to create "research" that would paint Bear in a positive light

[MrPorky]

"I should clarify that I am not against selling sweet snacks! smile What I am against is selling them as anything other than sweet snacks."

That's exactly my position too. My issue with BEAR is that they're selling sugary snacks as health food and trying to occupy some high moral ground over food labelling

[purplepandas]

I would support this.

[Elliecherry]

Sure, its not a bad thing to see on a label so I would support.
I'm more interested in seeing labels saying how many teaspoons of sugar there are in products though.

[MrsHathaway]

low-science twerpery of the highest order

Perfectly expressed.

[MichelleMumsnet]

Morning MNers

Thanks for all the contributions so far. Bear have asked us to post up the following in response to some of the points that have been made - as ever, do please let us know what you think.

"What do you mean when you say that BEAR snacks are ‘gently baked’?
To make BEAR snacks, we take the ripe fruit, peel it, chop it, blend it as you would a puree at home (without any heating or any other messing about), and then put it on baking trays. These trays are put into traditional baking ovens, and baked overnight at 42 degrees centigrade slowly, overnight. We then roll the big sheets, and slice them into yoyos, or press them with cookie cutter style shapes for our ‘paws’."

"How are concentrated fruit snacks different?
The fruit juice is taken from the fruit, and then cooked intensely and very quickly at a very high temperature (usually +100 degrees) for a short period of time, down to a paste or syrup. This makes it easier to store/gives it a longer shelf life but unfortunately the fast and harsh process results in a lot of the fibre being stripped out, and leaves more processed fruit sugars- this really affects how the body processes the natural sugar, as without the fibre, the sugars rush into the bloodstream more quickly and can be stored as fat . Water is then added back at a later stage, along with flavour cocktails. Snacks made from concentrates require the use of extrusion machines- these are what are used in confectionary. The fruit juices are poured into the machines, often with gumming or bulking agents, and through further heating and high pressure, shaped snacks are then made. Concentrated fruit snacks are not compliant with the Children’s Food Trust guidelines on what is allowed in school lunchboxes."

"Are BEAR snacks sugary?
BEAR snacks contain sugars that you find in the fruit that we make our products from- we never add any sugar, or use concentrates, gumming agents or similar stuff. A pack of BEAR Yoyos or Paws contains the same sugars as a fresh apple (7.5g for a BEAR snack vs around 10g for an average apple). We deliberately bake using fruits that are naturally lower in sugar- e.g. apples and pears rather than higher sugar fruits such as bananas, and within this pick the less sweet varieties- e.g. baking with granny smiths rather than pink ladies."

"Are fruit snacks bad for my children’s teeth?
Real fruit and fresh baked fruit do contain naturally occurring sugars, so before we launched BEAR we consulted the Head of Paediatric Dentistry at Leeds University- his view was that the impact of our pure fruit and veg snacks on dental health is the same as that of fresh fruit as they’re eaten in one go. When snacks are eaten all in one go, saliva can get to work restoring pH levels. To help maintain dental health, the advice (available on our website) is: 1) eat all your BEAR snacks at once rather than picking on bits over an hour or two. Even better, eat at mealtimes if you can. 2) have a drink of water or milk with a snack. If you choose milk, not only will you be doing bones a favour but it can also help neutralise pH levels in your mouth, cancelling out the effects of sugar. 3) clean your teeth twice a day with fluoride toothpaste. Here’s the info, along with a few more bits that might be useful: www.bearnibbles.co.uk/what-makes-us-different."

"Aren’t you just trying to pull yourself out from the competition?
Yes! But in a good way hopefully. We founded BEAR back in 2009 because it really frustrated us that there were no snacks available for families that were made from real fruit rather than concentrates. We’ve worked really hard with farmers to create products that don’t use concentrates, sulphites, require added sugar or any other nonsense. We feel it’s really important- not just to us, but to families trying to make informed decisions- that people understand how different foods are made. The childrens’ fruit snacking section of the shops isn’t as carefully regulated as other parts of the store- what we want to do here is ask for that to be addressed. That being said, if you’re still not sure, we’d love to have the chance to talk to you more- it’s a complicated matter, and isn’t always that easy to communicate everything in the short space on a pack. You can always call us too (on 0203 727 9000)."

[MrsHathaway]

"Are fruit snacks bad for my children’s teeth?
Real fruit and fresh baked fruit do contain naturally occurring sugars, so before we launched BEAR we consulted the Head of Paediatric Dentistry at Leeds University- his view was that the impact of our pure fruit and veg snacks on dental health is the same as that of fresh fruit as they’re eaten in one go. When snacks are eaten all in one go, saliva can get to work restoring pH levels. To help maintain dental health, the advice (available on our website) is: 1) eat all your BEAR snacks at once rather than picking on bits over an hour or two. Even better, eat at mealtimes if you can. 2) have a drink of water or milk with a snack. If you choose milk, not only will you be doing bones a favour but it can also help neutralise pH levels in your mouth, cancelling out the effects of sugar. 3) clean your teeth twice a day with fluoride toothpaste. Here’s the info, along with a few more bits that might be useful: //www.bearnibbles.co.uk/what-makes-us-different."

That's a very long-winded way of saying, "Um, yes, but you can mitigate the damage."

[MrsHathaway]

Arse. Bold fail.

[specialsubject]

the post seems to me a long-winded way of saying 'eat an apple - same sugar, less packaging, cheaper and probably tastier!'

[MrPorky]

Plus specialsubject, if you eat the apple you get all the nutrients that are destroyed by the drying and processing gentle baking

[GloGirl]

I feel much better about Bear products and the difference after reading the MN update but I still don't feel the best way to get recognition for the way you do it better is to try and force the government to whip the competition.

Try a 'how it's made' You Tube video instead, show how it is mass produced, how people can make it at home etc. Like and share promotions, make your own Bear sweets kits etc. People will still buy out of convenience. Show Bear working alongside other treats - Eg a special treat for a first trip to the cinema, packing some in your picnic etc. Sales at NT properties etc.

Trying to declare how much better you are because you don't boil your fruit is more convoluted and unlikely to become widespread information.

[Flybygirly29]

I think it's a brilliant idea! sometimes you really have to hunt to find whats in something. I had the no added sugar claim when normally it just means it's pumped with sweetner instead!

[SweetAdeline]

It sounds to me like bear want labelling that compares them to their competitors who make "less healthy" snacks. But more useful labelling for parents would compare both them and their competitors to fresh fruit.

[smurgoftwo]

Yes, please sign it.

If concentrates are considered to be enough of a bad thing that it legally has to go on the fruit juice packs, then I want to know about it when I buy my kids' fruit snacks too.

[Mynameistori]

If fruit juice is doing this already, why wouldn't it be a good thing on fruit snacks too?!

An apple is great- but only if your child will actually eat it. As a Mum who struggles to get her DCs to eat 1, let alone 5 portions a day, I don't massively appreciate some of the stuff that's being said on here. Anything that might help get them to eat more is a good thing to me, if it's done properly, which it sounds like it just might be here.

I think this would be a great move forward!

[MrPorky]

That's the thing though Mynameis. This kind of product allows you to think you're getting more good stuff into dc (for a price) but it's debatable whether you are, by the time the sugar has been concentrated and the nutrients destroyed by processing being slow baked to death

[Mynameistori]

I bake my vegetables at higher temperatures of 42 degrees, so I'm happy that I am giving my DCs snacks that have retained nutrition.