its with sadness that i realise - my son is just a first class arse.

[ThatVikRinA22]

yes he has SN but there is only so much i can take. He is coming up to 21 years old.

he has stolen from us 3 times now, the last just a month ago when he took my bank card and took large sums of money from my already overdrawn bank account.

he treats the house like a hotel.

he turns up at meal times and spends the rest of the time in his room

he sleeps until 3pm most days and stays up most of the night

he wont do his student finance application for his 3rd year at uni - the one where he would move out - which i need him to do as i need the break.

his room is so filthy that when he does go (if??) to uni i will have to throw away the carpet and gut it.

he works part time from home but has run up debt which he refuses to address

he did not buy either myself or my husband anything for our birthdays - even with prompting - it was DH birthday last month - i kept saying have you got your dad anything at all? he kept saying yes, yes, yes, but it never made an appearance - when i ask him now he just storms out of the room

ive tried to talk to him today again about his student finance application but he just gets up and storms off.

yes he has SN. But i did not raise him to be like this, i did not raise him to steal and lie and think only of himself ever, i raised him to be polite and helpful and have manners and to know right from wrong.

during the past few years he has proved himself simply to be not very nice.

[colditz]

Connexions will deal with him until he's 24, iirc. It may help to get them involved, they are all about next steps and career advice. That is, if the wanky government hasn't closed them down as unprofitable endeavours.

[Miggsie]

It sounds like he is talking a lot as he has never suffered the consequences of anything bad he has done.

He probably does think things will just magically happen even if he does nothing.

AS people are entirely capable of understanding cause and effect. If you have said something 100 times there is no point saying it again as saying it 100 times has had as much effect as saying it once.
Get into the habit of saying something once.
State things in terms of "if you do X, Y will happen. Can you cope with Y?"

Stop being there to "save" him. You probably are over protective and he's got used to you bailing him out. you need to find a way of letting him run up against his own problems, not trying to head them off.

This is very difficult as you need to be dispassionate about things happening to your child. It may be worth you pointing out to him that if he does not fill in his form and go to university you will expect him to get a job until he does go. If you can, tell him once he has a job he can pay back all the money he stole from you.

Then don't engage further, let him think about it, and don't change your position.

This is much harder to do than type.

[ThatVikRinA22]

i know and i have actually said that - and i mean it. i cannot keep him. i have said this and i mean it. ive told him he either goes to uni in sept or he gets a job and moves on.

i have asked him why he is not doing the student finance and why he seems unbothered about his final year.

he says he feels unmotivated.
he says his part time job is getting him down as it feels like he is scamming people. then he starts crying.

and i am back to square one.

he just asked for a hug.

[colditz]

Fill it in for him, just ease him over that transition. Transition can be really hard for people with as.

[GurlwiththeFrothyCurl]

Vicar, have huge empathy for you. We are in a similar situation here in that DS1 is on the autistic spectrum, he is 22 going on 10 but is not as intelligent as your son. He has mild learning difficulties and could not take any exams at school but has done things like NVQs since he left. There is now very little out there for him since our local council closed everything for young adults with "mild" disabilities - all his work placements and training have been closed and all the staff made redundant. He has had a short term part time job, but is not having any luck getting any more work and so now has very little to do to keep busy.

Most of the time, he is pretty nice to be with, but has huge melt-downs from time to time where he is violent and aggressive to us both. We despair for his future, with no means of supporting himself but no help from any agencies as they are all being closed around here. There is no way he could fend for himself as he has huge issues with money and cannot understand numbers - can see him getting conned very easily.

But sometimes, we are so tired of having to parent a real man/child when he gets so aggressive with us. We are driven to tears and it puts such a strain on our marriage. I think he will be with us until we die and I am so frightened thinking about what will happen to him when that time comes :(

Sorry that I can't offer any solutions, such sympathy and some understanding.

[ThatVikRinA22]

thank you gurl - and much sympathy to you too. It is so so hard, he came home, and i went up to talk to him.

he curled up in a foetal position on his bed.
then he cried.
then he said he feels like his job is scamming people and he hates it. (he is a computer programmer for an internet marketer)
he said he feels unmotivated
and then wanted a hug, just like a little boy - and he is a little boy. a little boy who is almost 21.

how could i ever turn my back on him really? i couldnt.
i told him that i love him but he makes it very hard for me to love him sometimes.

he knows. he knows when he is being an arse. and he feels terrible about it, but it doesnt stop.

the best outcome for us all here is that he goes to do his final year at uni, that we continue to support him but it would give us all some much needed breathing space.

he actually has put more effort into finding out that uni would sub the shortfall on the accommodation than just doing the bloody form....

he has however promised to do it over the next couple of days - he says there is one question he doesnt understand and despite my telling him how to answer he is insisting on phoning them.

i think on some level there is a reluctance to change.
its scary. he will be living away, with other people, without us there.
i think he is scared.
and when he is scared he buries his head in the sand and pretends it will all go away.
i want to help him, but this has to happen or i will go mad and he will not get his degree.
and if he wants to work for someone else who he thinks has more scruples he needs to do it.

[GurlwiththeFrothyCurl]

I bet it is about change. My DS does similar things when he is afraid of something new. Luckily for us, he is usually open to some amount of reasoning as he knows that he can't manage without support. His brother is at Uni and DS1 knows that his brother is more intelligent than he is - has known this since they were very small.

What makes me sad is that DS says that he wants a family of his own - he loves babies - but thinks that he will never have one. I hope that someday he can have this, but also fear that we will have to support him so much if he does ever have a relationship. Sadly, DH and I are also very unwell and I am not sure if we could cope!

[ThatVikRinA22]

it is so hard - i think i will always have to support DS on some level. I cant imagine DS with a family although he has had a couple of relationships - though his first was short lived and with an girl in Seattle - and most people know the story there....(he spent his student finance on going to meet her without telling me....and he lost $900 in the process and didnt even tell me he had gone until 3 months later...long story!)
we are in the uk....it scares me to death that he has that level of fearlessness and naivety....

i got really mad with someone at work that i normally respect the other day, who said chuck him out. He isnt a stray and he would not survive without us so its pointless saying it. Its never going to happen. He is my responsibility and i will not turn him out to sure fire failure on the streets.

i need to find a way of working with him, and of supporting him to independence.

[GurlwiththeFrothyCurl]

Oh yes, DH and I have battled over the "chucking him out" scenario. DH often threatens to do this, when DS has driven us to the edge of insanity. However, cross I get, I could never contemplate doing this. How would I sleep at night for worrying about him? He simply could not cope without us to organise everything for him. He cannot understand deferred gratification - all his money would be spent on expensive equipment and he would starve! In many ways, he is a little boy in a man's body.

And really, I don't think that DH actually means it at all - it's just frustration and anger getting the better of him.

[GurlwiththeFrothyCurl]

And I meant to say that I have read your threads about your DS before - the Seattle saga made me !!!

[ThatVikRinA22]

he is such a juxtaposition between capable and totally incapable.

whenever we have these blow ups i end up feeling so sorry for him - he really is just a little boy lost.

i just need a break. i need him to stick to the plan....he needs to get his degree and i need the break that uni will give me.

(provided he doesnt blow all his money in the first week...)

he keeps saying he will pay me back for the money he took. i think if he had the money he would. but he doesnt register the emotional cost of doing what he did.

[GurlwiththeFrothyCurl]

Hope you have had a better day, VicarInaTutu, and that you get the break you need :)

[ThatVikRinA22]

well, he has been out much of today which is unusual - but i have had 2 phonecalls from his credit card company

i can only presume that this means he hasnt paid his bill.

if he doesnt come home soon he will find himself locked out, as i would bet he has no key with him.

im so tired and ive no idea what the answer is. Hope you are ok Gurl....

[GurlwiththeFrothyCurl]

Thanks, Vicar. We are struggling at the moment because DS had an operation on Saturday - only minor, but he is still suffering and making sure that we all are too!

Hope your son came home OK last night. It doesn't get any easier as our children reach adulthood does it? So many people seem to think that they grow out of ASD as you don't hear so much about adults with it. I think it's because families struggle with having their children at home and just get on with it. There seems to be so little out there to support us and when you don't have any support system (our families live 100s of miles away and aren't very supportive anyway) you are one step away from crumbling.

[WetAugust]

Vic

for you

I just complete all DS's forms for him and say "Sign here".

That's the only way he would have got his Student Finance application etc done.

Have you made contact yet with the Uni Disability Students Support office or Student Welfare Office? With his diabilities it's important that Student Welfare are aware of his needs so can support him. It was the Student Welfare Office that contacted Social Services on our behalf to ask for support for DS. A meeting was held to identify his needs and from that he was awarded Direct Payments so a NAS support worker could be paid to help him. The DSO also has it's own funding for making available ad-hoc support.

But to get real long-term support you need to apply for Disabled Students Allowance. That will allow a full asssessment of his needs while at Uni to be undertaken and he may be able to get a non-educational helper, as well as the equipment he needs for dyslexia i.e. laptop and dictaphone.

If he recieves DLA the cost of his Student Accommodation will be paid for via Local Housing Allowance (Housing Benefit).

When he starts at Uni you'lll need to get a Certificate from the Uni showing that's he's a student. You can then use that for student exemption from Council Tax.

Don't forget the TV Licence application too.

It's a huge amount of work filling in all these forms but that's wha I had to do. Still have tp do actually as I've just completed his DLA renewal and about half an hour ago I handed him a pen and said "Sign here".

One thing that helps is if the DWP recognise you as he DWP Appointee and that the Local Authority (for LHA) will deal with you as his Third Party Representative. Just write a letter from him to the LA appointing you as his Third Party Rep and instructing them to send all correspodence to you - then just get him to sign it.

You know that I spend severalhours a week dealing with all DS's written communication, applications etc. It's the only way. If I didn't do it nothing would happen.

It's also worth getting his name on the LA housing waiting list as a vulnerable person while he claims DLA. When he completes his Uni course he may be able to go straight into some form of sheltered accomodation.

Just sort it all out yourself and then pack him off for a year's break.

[ThatVikRinA22]

hi again gurl its nice to "speak" to others in the same boat tbh - as churlish as that sounds! not that i want everyone to share my misery you understand

hi witty - you speak much sense as always.

we have done the DSA thing and he has had his full assessment, and he is also under the disability team within the uni - he has a named advisor. We have done all those meetings....just this last push to get through!

i know i should just do it for him, but following his recent light fingered escapades into my bank account i had to take a monumental step back to save sanity....
that said, i suppose i will have to pick up the reins again and get on with it. He has just about done it to be fair to him - just a couple of questions that he doesnt know how to answer - ive told him the answers but he wont believe me and says he wants to check....

i do think that some of this procrastination is a reluctance for change.
i think he is scared to go.

he has gone out again today, but i will sit with him tomorrow and insist he brings the forms down here to look through....

incidentally i had no idea about housing benefit for uni accommodation - how does this work? how do we sort that? i had no idea he could claim for this....he still gets his DLA...for now.

[GurlwiththeFrothyCurl]

Hi Vicar, I understand totally! Of course, each person with ASD is different, but as parents we share so many of the same worries.

[WetAugust]

LHA is what has now replaced HB.

As he gets DLA he's entitled to LHA to cover the cost of his student acommodation.

See this www.disabilityrightsuk.org/f44.htm you need to read from para 5 onwards.

To claim it you need to ask for an LHA application from your LA. You also need to get a copy of the accommodation agreement from the University once he's signed it. You then send the rental agreement of to the LA with a copy of his DLA award letter.

Why pay for student accommodation when he is entitled to LA?

[ThatVikRinA22]

thanks witty that is most useful. i will get on with it.

[ThatVikRinA22]

Well I did the student finance. But I reckon any min now he will walk out as I've disconnected the Internet.... I went in and asked home to do 2 things tomorrow. 1) clear his windowsill of pots and rubbish and 2) sit with his fad and look again at his money. He said hens only spending £10 a week which isn't true as he is back into his £700 overdraft... When I pointed this out I got told to "piss off" so I've calmly gone and disconnected the router.... He is now hitting things in his room and I expect he will flounce to his friends at any moment... I'm just waiting to lock the door when he dies....
I cannot wait til he goes to uni.

[ThatVikRinA22]

God that should say lock door when he goes.....he is a pita but not that bad!

[ThatVikRinA22]

He has taken all my patio door keys. We are trapped in if anything happens. I can't let dog out. He really is a little shit and I've had enough.

[FallenCaryatid]

Vic, I'm so sorry that you are going through such a tough time right now, but it does sound as if he's terrified about moving on and change, and that he's deliberately pratting around to avoid the scary responsibility of a facing a future that is different in any way to what he knows.
So he's not doing stuff to help the move happen, as well as being disorganised, and that's coming out in the anger and bashing things around, rather than tears and suicidal thoughts of being worthless. I know that my DS was very much like this for several years, but that has improved steadily, the flipside to your DS.
I can't begin to offer you advice, you either give in and concentrate on your own needs, or you continue to support him however you can.
But one thing I can say. Don't blame yourself. Ever. You have done your very best for decades, and if it hasn't worked as well as you hoped, there is nothing more that you could do that you haven't done. Truly there isn't.
So how is it working with your OH taking over the major role of dealing with the next crisis and the one after that?

[ThatVikRinA22]

oh fallen things took a turn for the worse. i started a new thread in desperation

he has failed his 2nd year. no uni. i was up all night, having just come of nights that morning. knackered and emotional was an understatement.

*fallen8 i dont know how to cope with him any more. DH doesnt do crisis. that appears to be my job. on top of the one i have.

[FallenCaryatid]

Well, you know my OH doesn't either, never has.
So if he is going to repeat a year or get a job and still be living at home, you need a breathing space and a bit of free-floating, then you need some house rules, arse-kicking and for everyone to insist that if he's house sharing then he needs to pull his weight and control his anger or he will have to look for accommodation elsewhere. My DS has no paid job, he takes turns with household jobs though.
He mustn't use you as his rage outlet, or hurl his anger at you to avoid facing what is actually wrong. Loving him and being worried about his options doesn't mean he should get away with treating you like shit because he feels that you'd never abandon him.