4 months too young for sleep training?

[SKP86]

Hi all,

My DS is 17 weeks and I’ve tried sleep training him for the past 3 weeks and it’s just not working as well as I’d hope. He started sleeping through the night, but now wakes a few times and finds it hard to self settle.

I used to rock him to sleep but now put him in his crib and let him sleep on his own. Sometimes he sucks on his hand and falls asleep, otherwise times he gets frustrated and just cries and cries until I have to hold him again and then put him in his crib when he’s fallen asleep. Today he was crying for 40 minutes and I thought sod that, I felt like a terrible mum!

Nap times are bad as we go through this process 3 or 4 times a day and it’s exhausting. It takes ages putting him to sleep and he only naps for 45 minutes at a time.

My question is, will it get better and am I pressuring him too early? I am aware of awake windows so put him down before he gets overtired.

Thank you!!

[SKP86]

I can see from all the responses here that he’s too young, so I won’t be so hard on myself and him. You might want to do a google search yourselves and see the amount of info that says the crying out method has no attachment or long term effects for the baby. I’m not a monster!! It’s upsetting that people can be so harsh with their words

[Megan2018]

I have never left DD to cry. Never. And she is 17 months. I can’t contemplate how you could even think to do that to a tiny baby. Barbaric. Poor bloody child

[AnneLovesGilbert]

www.bellybelly.com.au/baby-sleep/cry-it-out/

[firesidetartan]

You might want to do a google search yourselves and see the amount of info that says the crying out method has no attachment or long term effects for the baby.

I have never really patented by google. I just listen to my babies.

[WineInTheWillows]

@SKP86

I can see from all the responses here that he’s too young, so I won’t be so hard on myself and him. You might want to do a google search yourselves and see the amount of info that says the crying out method has no attachment or long term effects for the baby. I’m not a monster!! It’s upsetting that people can be so harsh with their words

You can find a lot of 'information' to support anything on the Internet, OP. Climate change is a myth, vaccines cause autism, the planet is secretly run by lizard people... it's all got info to support it online. You've got to use a bit of critical thinking and be careful what information you trust.

[SKP86]

Ok lesson learnt. Thank you all for your responses. I’ll go with my instinct and stop googling.

I love my baby and wouldn’t do anything to harm him. I give him lots of cuddles and he’s very content, though I don’t need to justify it

[CescaNicole]

I don't necessarily agree that it is too young to sleep train in general, as you say there are plenty of online articles that state 4-6 months is the sweet spot for sleep training. However, seeing as you are trying it with not much success, in my opinion it's too young for your baby specifically - they are not quite ready developmentally to learn how to self soothe. Every baby is completely different though. As you said you didn't have these issues with your daughter.

I did Ferber method (intervals) sleep training with my 1st at 8 months old and it worked perfectly within 2 nights. I have a second baby now who is 20 weeks old, but I don't think she's anywhere near ready to be sleep trained just yet. I may try her at 6 months ish once we have started weaning. But at the moment she needs to be rocked to sleep for naps, and fed back to sleep during the night. She only naps for 20 mins at a time 😅
I would love a 45 min nap!!

Give it a few more weeks or another month or so and do what you have to do to get some sleep, then try again to see if it helps or not. Everything is trial and error and everything is always a phase.
Good Luck!

[Nahna]

Absolutely barbaric. There is significant research to illustrate that this is harmful, in terms of attachment. Please meet your baby's most basic needs.

[DicklessWonder]

@SKP86

Ok before you all criticise me for being a terrible mother, there is a lot of info online that advocates sleep training at 4 months. Also I didn’t leave him to cry continuously for 40 minutes, I went in at intervals to soothe him. It’s called the extinction method! It doesn’t make me heartless, I just wanted him to learn to self soothe, which he often does by sucking his hand. I cannot continue to rock him to sleep as he is getting bigger and it’s tiring.

I am more focussing on daytime naps. I don’t leave him to cry at night, as he would wake the whole house up. I have no option but to pick him up then.

I have a daughter who didn’t have these issues, which is why I am reaching out for advice.

He doesn’t have “issues” - he’s a perfectly normal brand new baby. Any issues are yours. Of course you’re tired. He’s no more likely to learn to self settle at this age than he is to tap dance.

Which kosher resources are advocating “the extinction method” at 4 months? (Ironic that, as human babies are the same now as they were when we lived in caves. Letting them cry would have led to them being eaten by predators, leading to the extinction of the human race. Which is why it doesn’t work now either.)

[BeHappyAndSmile]

That’s bad advice. Trying to get a 4 month old (3 months when she started) to “self settle” is never going to work. There are other ways to try and rest without leaving a distressed few months old baby to cry by itself. Persisting with it won’t work either. Babies are designed to wake at night and won’t have read any parenting books or apps

Please show me where I said to persist or leave a distressed baby? If you read it I said re approach in a few weeks if it doesn't work (which she already knows it's not as she's been doing it). I just wanted to show some support before the poor woman got piled on. The 4 month regression is HARD. I'm in the middle of it now so I fully appreciate how bloody hard it is. And there may well be other ways to rest but if she's so tired she would potentially fall asleep with the baby in a dangerous situation then some times you've got to do what you've got to do.

[Yellowtopaz]

Went in? Isn’t he sleeping in your room still?

[Thatwentbadly]

@SKP86

I can see from all the responses here that he’s too young, so I won’t be so hard on myself and him. You might want to do a google search yourselves and see the amount of info that says the crying out method has no attachment or long term effects for the baby. I’m not a monster!! It’s upsetting that people can be so harsh with their words

I’ve yet to find a single peer review study which says leaving a baby to cry for 3 x 30 mins a day doesn’t impact on their brain development. There is lots of evidence which suggests the opposite would be true but it works unethical to carry out such a research study. Do let me know if you find one.

[RWK29]

This thread has made me so sad to read 😓 my DS is the same age and the thought of him crying over anything for 40 minutes makes me feel sick 😓 nevermind me letting him do it without comforting him.

Why does he need to be sleep trained now @SKP86? Is it purely because you’re exhausted? 🤔
Until 2 weeks ago my DS wouldn’t nap anywhere except on me or in a moving pram. If I put him down during the day for naps he would last 10 minutes then cry and be overtired and it would be horrible. So he napped on me or napped while I carried him around the house doing chores with one hand 😅 or once a day I’d take him out for a walk in the pram to give my arms a rest! Is it exhausting? Of course it is!! He was 8lb 11oz at birth so carrying him around all day isn’t very comfortable - especially given the fact that my pelvis split at the end of my pregnancy and is still causing me a lot of pain, but it’s what he needs 🤷🏻‍♀️ As far as I’m concerned baby’s needs come first 🤷🏻‍♀️

Our “sleep training” at the moment involves DS being put down in his bedside crib for daytime naps rather than being held. We’re doing things very gradually so he doesn’t get distressed so I’ll rock him to sleep then put him down when sleepy but just awake then I’ll hold his hand until he falls asleep. I then stay with him and resettle when he wakes. If he starts getting distressed and won’t resettle easily we just go back to napping on Mummy for the rest of that nap. He’s managing an hours nap now only having to be resettled once 😊 is it perfect? Absolutely not but he’ll get there!! He also wakes in the night for feeds and is awake for an hour each time. 10.30pm, 2.30am then wake up at 7am for the day. Which I think is pretty normal at his age?!

[MaMaD1990]

I wouldn't worry too much about people's attitudes on here OP, it's just what you get on MN. For what it's worth, I did sleep training for mine at a young age and it's luckily worked out for us. If it's naps you're worried about, aside from trying to get little one down with the usual methods, some babies just don't nap well (mine included). I always told myself I didn't care if they only slept 20 minutes at a time in the day, as long as they slept a decent amount at night! I would also check if they're teething or a sleep regression (which are awful) because they can be a factor for terrible naps and sleep, but do end after around 6ish weeks. You're not a bad mum at all, just trying to make it through. You do what feels right and try not to let the negative comments get you down - plenty of people sleep train at this age and it's nothing to kick yourself about. Motherhood with a small baby is all about survival!

[vickyq1983]

Yes that is totally normal for that age. I think some young babies sleep through, but the majority do not. One of mine fed twice in the night until 8 months and then just suddenly stopped and the other was 18 months and we did have to do some gentle sleep training but we never left him for more than five minutes at a time. He was feeding up to 4 times a night and it had become habit more than hunger.

I don't get why people think their tiny babies are going to sleep through the night? The thought of leaving a baby that small crying for so long is heartbreaking.

[Indecisivelurcher]

Extinction techniques / controlled crying can be effective but advice is not before 6m. There is also not much point sleep training during the 4m sleep regression as everything is to buggery then. If you want to do something then gentler techniques like pick up put down are more age appropriate. I suggest you speak to your health visitor.

[GoodCow]

My DD was a good sleeper, my baby DS is definitely not so I understand how you feel!

DS was at his worst at 4 months old when it came to naps/night sleep. Sodding regression! It lasted about 3 weeks and I think I cried most of it from tiredness!

For naps, as soon as he starts to wake up and it's it been a long enough nap, I'd go in and cuddle him back to sleep. Just so he gets used to that length of sleep. Then you can try the pick up/put down method after a while.

Does he still feed at night. DS went back to 2 bottles at this age to get him back to sleep. I slowly reduced the amount of the 2nd (not needed) bottle after a week until he didn't need it anymore. You can try the pick up/put down method again at night. Does he have a dummy?

You'll find a way that works for you both, it's hard when you gave 2 kids to consider though. DS is 9 months now, still not the best sleeper but better

[MsChatterbox]

The times that he sucked his fists to sleep just means that he was the perfect amount of full, tired and comforted to be able to do that. Sometimes when you put him down he won't feel that way and will need the extra comfort and that is OK. I know 45 minute naps are tiring, my baby mainly naps for 30 minutes too. All naps are in my arms. I have a toddler so this means plonking myself on the couch for these naps and toddler watches TV! Baby will get there. Its exhausting in the mean time just give all the cuddles... They'll soon be pushing you away!

[OverTheRainbow88]

@SKP86

As a first time mum the advice is confusing sometimes, don’t be harsh on yourself.

My friend ‘sleep trained’ all her 4 children from this age, it didn’t involve allowing crying until they fell asleep, but she were in their cots, swaddled, white noise and she rubbed their tummies until they fell asleep. All 4 children have slept like a dream since about 12 weeks. I can’t comment on sleep too much as both mine have been disasters.

[Buttercupcup]

Rather than sleep training try building a ‘routine’ that promotes nap times. Try an app like huckleberry or look up the awake window for your baby's age. This was a real game changer for my baby Feed as soon as wake up, play time etc then when getting towards the end of the awake window nappy change and into cot/pram/on me with comforter and dummy and she goes off quickly most of the time. We started this around 4.5 months. If I tried too early she was under tired and if she is awake too long overtired and has to be boobed/rocked/patted/shushed/lunged/sprinkles with fairy dust for an age to get off to sleep! Also bloody sleep regressions we just have to accept and think ‘this will pass’ while keeping to a loose routine and having a lot of tea and cake.

[ManicPixie]

@Thatwentbadly

Far too young. It’s not recommended before 12 months. For the vast majority sleep training isn’t necessary at all. Can I ask why you are doing this?

To get a half decent night's sleep for the first time in months, presumably. Odd question really.

[ManicPixie]

OP - There's a lot of preciousness on this forum when it comes to sleep training, as you've just discovered. All I say to those people is: if you've never been desperate enough to try it at the baby stage consider yourself lucky.

Not all sleep training involves cry-it-out, which isn't something I'd ever advocate, but the blanket refusal by some to entertain any form of it is bizarre.

[Ashlee0304]

Oh god give this mum a break, some of you are acting like she's doing the worst thing in the world. She's just trying to find her way with two kids.
She's not leaving her 17 week baby to cry alone for 40 mins and another comment about oh he's not in your room still?! Some babies don't settle as well in the room with you! Mine sure didn't. It's whatever's best for the baby. There are so many ways to monitor baby when they are asleep and are super safe.
Op. Please don't think everyone is here to criticise. Women should support women and if you haven't got anything nice to say, don't say anything at all!!
Your little one will get there soon enough. Good luck!

[Firstimer703]

If he's tired, you should be able to get him to settle. I found movement and music worked a treat. Yours sounds too young for a jumperoo but loud (enough) music might do it or loads of talking to him. I would pick my baby back up if he was crying but keep trying to resettle. It was 10/15 mins at first but I didn't give up and that paid off. I'm a Gina Ford fan myself! And he was 4 months when I started. He sleeps when I put him down now.

[TomHardyAndMe]

@Ashlee0304

Oh god give this mum a break, some of you are acting like she's doing the worst thing in the world. She's just trying to find her way with two kids.
She's not leaving her 17 week baby to cry alone for 40 mins and another comment about oh he's not in your room still?! Some babies don't settle as well in the room with you! Mine sure didn't. It's whatever's best for the baby. There are so many ways to monitor baby when they are asleep and are super safe.
Op. Please don't think everyone is here to criticise. Women should support women and if you haven't got anything nice to say, don't say anything at all!!
Your little one will get there soon enough. Good luck!

Dare we ask where the other parent is?