Primary-school places shortfall: what's happening where you live?

[HelenMumsnet]

Hello.

It's headline news today that one in five primary schools are now full or near capacity.

And, with 240,000 new primary-school places needed for 2014, the National Audit Office is saying the Department of Education "faces a real challenge... there are indications of strain on school places".

We were wondering how you all feel about this? Do you have a child due to start primary school in September? Are you aware of a shortage of places in your area? What steps are your local council taking to make school places available to all those who need one?

Please do let us know.

[MrsJamin]

Reading's shit hit the fan last year - lots of parents received a letter saying "I'm sorry we cannot allocate your child a place yet"- causing a lot of stress that their child would not have a school place come September. In the end they were given places just under 2 miles away - so they have long bus routes and you feel really sorry for them. The radius to get in on distance is very tiny so some were just caught in a black hole where any 4 year olds in a few particular roads didn't get a place - they were 0.25-0.35 miles from 3 schools. It was shocking, a true postcode lottery. The council seem a bit more organised this year but it remains to be seen whether they will send similar letters out this year. Thankfully DS1 is now in a good school and DS2 is assured entry under siblings being the priority to admit. The council reckon the reasons are not just estate building and immigration but also families who traditionally would have moved out to larger houses (they are mostly small 2/3 bed terraces), haven't done so because of the housing market. In West Reading we hope to get a new free school at Secondary because the council are unable to create a new school- they had to ask parents to apply for a free school - the system is ridiculous now.

[BumpingFuglies]

We are in South Lincolnshire. When my SDC moved here with me, we could not get a reception place anywhere close - there are 2 primaries in the town, plus about 6 nearby village schools. There were Year 4 places available for DSS1. The LEA offered us a local place for DSS1 and a reception place for DSS2 10 miles away. Completely unworkable. Both DSS now go to school 10 miles away by taxi. Not ideal but at least they are together.

We are in an area where there has been a huge program of building new houses and a strong immigrant population. NONE of our services or schools have been expanded to cope. It's now driving locals out of the area, which is a shame.

[BoffinMum]

Merry, they are making up their own transport rules there, and are obliged to pay. They'd back down immediately if someone stood their ground and involved the MP.

[BoffinMum]

TalkinPeace, state maintained community schools, south Cambridge fringe. Masses of new houses being built and developers are funding the new schools.

[tilder]

This thread does worry me. At the moment we live in a rural area with several good and undersubscribed schools. The concern is lack of children.

We are currently looking to move to an area with lots of church schools but as atheist it is not overly appealing plus they are changing admission requirementa to include church attendance. I have looked at catchment areas for schools but have no idea if the maps reflect reality. When I phone the schools they just tell me to look at the areas online. How do I find out about the actual catchments?.

[MothershipG]

tidler Not sure about where you are but in most places schools do not handle admissions themselves and it's all down to the LEA so you need to be calling your council's admissions office. They should be able to tell you where you can find admissions criteria and the furthest places offered for the last round of admissions. Obviously they can't tell you how that may change in the future but it will give you a starting point.

[PlasticLentilWeaver]

We moved in year last summer, due to DH new job, and the LA offered us nothing. No place at all. Hours of phone calls, I found a half empty school about 10 miles away in a different LA that DS could have a place at. But, it was in special measures, hence half empty. It also fed into a junior school in same situation.

We are in the very fortunate position that after some careful calculations and extreme belt tightening, we could go independent. It wasn't in the life plan, but giving our children stability was, so we decided this was a better choice than having to move school again if a place came up on a waiting list. I completely recognise that this is not an option for most people. That aside, it isn't the solution to the bigger problem either.

[blackeyedsusan]

tilder, I think you have to find out the furthest admission last year to give you an estimate, then take a bit off that...

[RubyGates]

I thought I had it bad when DS1 was due to start secondary school 12 years ago and the borough had a 70 place shortfall. He was offered a place at a failing school about as far away from us as it was possible to be eventually.

We declined the place and got him into the newly-branded 'Islington Arts and Media Academy" (two boroughs over, but an easier journey) which was great until it all the old "problem children" were readmitted, their funding slashed, and their educational ethos squashed. We were lucky to get him into Cranbrook in Kent as a boarder at 13 plus. It was a nightmare.

Now I'm facing the same prospect again with DS2's primary. I have no desire to send him to any of the local schools, they are all over-subscribed, bursting at the seams, and struggling.

The council are adding bulge classes, building on the last few remaining bits of green, and (officially) denying that there's a problem. It's horrid and depressing.
It was obvious when DS2 was born that the midwifery services were over-stretched, which must surely translate to : will need more schools in 4/5 years time. But instead the council has built more and more housing, and more and more large families have moved into the area. Where's the logic in that?

If OH is employed by September we will either homeschool (I'll give up work), or send DS2 to the local private Christian Academy (£240 per month) (Strange curriculum but nice teachers and children) . If OH is still unemployed then we'll have to seriously think about moving into a "shed" in the IL's garden, just to be near some decent primaries with capacity.

[WhereMyMilk]

Rural midlands village here. village school 3form entry. it's stuffed to the rafters with most classes at 31/32 pupils.

Couldn't get DD into village school, despite being able to See it from house-stressful appeals gone through before she got in...

Now bastard local council have decided that a developer can build an extra 300 houses on edge of village (protests were ignored) and nothing else will be provided for (school, GP, library etc) Stupid old woman councillor said it would be alright, they could put extra chairs in the classroom! WTAF?

[MerryCouthyMows]

BoffinMum - you and I both know that, but it doesn't stop them from trying. One mum I know September just gone was offered a Primary that was 7.1 miles away as the crow flies for her 4yo, and was originally given no help with the transport despite being unable to drive. She was in bits, as the earliest bus to that village (we are in a town and she was offered an outlying village school due to lack of places) doesn't get to the school till 9.05am...

I ended up helping her fight the transport Dept of our LA and they now provide a Taxi - but she isn't allowed to go in the taxi and has to send her 4yo (July birthday) in the taxi. Parents evenings are horrendous for her.

[MsPickle]

I'm another Lambeth person and was horrified to learn that last year there were 500 children without places as no application was submitted for them. Add that number into the mix already discussed up thread...

[Mirage]

Actually,LaQueen your post had me nodding.We too have had loads of people from London move up here,who previously sent their children to private schools,and now are delighted to find an Outstanding school on their doorstep.It got to the point that every other week,the DDs would come home and announce a new child had joined their class and they came from London.Then there are a lot of pupils who were pulled out of the local preps and sent to the village primary and the parents in the nearby town who drive their children out here every day.It is madness.

[gazzalw]

We are in SW London and live in a Borough with quite a marked geographical divide between the haves and have-nots. This has traditionally meant there's always been a pressure on places in the wealthier part of the Borough because historically that's where the best-performing schools have been.

We had problems getting our DS (now 12) into our preferred choice school or even our closest one, in a birth-dip year, even when previously he would have got into both. DW being aware of trends etc..., asked the 'population boom' question of the Council and it was flatly denied. Of course this is the time when there was a big influx of Polish people, some with small children. Surprise, surprise, DS's primary school was the first in the Borough to expand to accommodate the extra demand for places. And now just about all of the schools, with the exception of some of the high-achieving faith schools, have expanded and some have additional bulge classes too.

For DS's school it has meant that it has transformed from a very cosy, small school where everyone knew everyone into an entirely different school. The teachers are fantastic but there isn't the same friendly atmosphere and tribalism in the playground at drop-off/pick up is rife in a way that it never was before! Also, because it's stuck between a rock and a hard place, being neither one of the highly desirable (in social terms) nor one of the undesirable schools, it has a huge catchment area which spans virtually the whole Borough.

The 'outstanding' school in the area which is now the most sought after one in mid-Borough is transforming into a three form entry school and has already had to acquire park land to do so.

There are also schools using annexes a walk away from the main school. Not entirely satisfactory.

There has for years been talk of another school on the affluent side of the Borough but by the time the Council gives it the go-ahead no doubt the birth rate will be dipping.

Mindful of what's happened with primary schools, DW asked about increased secondary school provision (which will need to kick in for the 2014/15 intake) and was told by a Council Official "we have it in hand" but we have not noticed that secondary schools are being 'grown' to accommodate the looming expanded intakes.

The trouble is that by and large it seems that Councils operate reactively rather than pro-actively. I suspect this is as much down to economics as localised, ideological political war-mongering. But it's just not right.

Presumably the 2001 Census must have shown some indication of this population boom?

[gallicgirl]

Live in SE Essex. One local council us expanding existing schools, including additional campuses because they don't want to build brand new school. I understand that current government policy means only new schools allowed are academies and free schools. This means the council would bear the cost of building the school then be forced to hand over all control of it.

[MsPickle]

Someone made a point earlier (sorry,on phone so finding it not easy!) that the Ofsted rankings are possibly also partly to blame. That's been running around my head as I suspect there's something in that, not least in the way it's made it 'easier' to move into a catchment for 'your sort of school' if you've the money to do so. Pre publication of those results you had to know an area to know that sort of detail, now a quick google/estate agent link will tell you what you want to know. But as this thread shows schools can change character so fast/economic reasons shift the private/state balance, part of me thinks is it any wonder that LEAs, never known for the speed of response, are struggling to keep up and then add in the local and national politics-how do we fix it? And I mean that as a genuine question; how do we create a system where children can know which school they are going to in reasonable time and have access to decent education?

[MerryCouthyMows]

MsPickle - Surely some of that 500 that didn't submit applications would have been DC's that are going to be HE? If not, why on earth weren't they chased up like they are in my LA?

[tilder]

Thanks guys. I didn't know that (one of the primaries could have told me!). Will try that route. Will also ask about secondary as the only response I have had is that if we are in catchment and our children are at a catchment school they will get a place. Which seemed a bit strange to me.

I guess we will sion be joining the struggle to get children a place at school when older than reception. Joy.

[DuchessofMalfi]

We live in a smallish town in the SW. There are four primary schools in our town, and I've heard that they are all due to be full this September, and possibly oversubscribed.

The school (state primary a couple of miles away) DD goes to was full last year, because there was a large take up of sibling places, but this year there will be some places available. DS should be able to get in. If he doesn't, we'll be struggling to find somewhere for him to go too.

[MerryCouthyMows]

My DS's Primary is so overstretched that almost all classes have between 31-35 DC's in (the older they get, the larger the classes get).

The only TA's that can fit in the classroom are the 1-2-1's that are attached to DC's with statements. Which has led to the school illegally taking DC's OFF SA+ that should still be there due to outside involvement from medical professionals. This means that any DC with SN's that should be getting TA time through an IEP now isn't.

It's not the school's fault, but it means that for those DC's with SN's that require 15 hrs a week help or less that should be on SA /SA+ are being left unable to access education effectively because of space constrictions.

Something NEEDS to be done. But no government is willing to tackle the system effectively. It needs MASSIVE investment to bring the school places to where the DC are, rather than taking the DC's to where the school places are...

And if all schools were expected to be equal, and MADE to be equal, all providing an Oustanding education, all helping DC's with SN's to the same extent, all having the same ways of dealing with bullying, then maybe it would solve the problem.

Because then EVERYONE might be happy to send their DC's to their local school, knowing that their DC would get the same quality of education whether the school was in the middle of a council estate that measures highly on the deprivation index, or if the school was on a leafy suburb.

Why WOULD people accept a substandard education for their DC's and not do everything they can to get their DC's into a better school if the schools aren't equal?

I personally would rather HE than send my DC's to a 4/5/6+ FE primary school. Their SN's would make that far too overwhelming. Ditto a 4-18 school as is being proposed as the school that should become my catchment school.

Each to their own. My DS2 will start to struggle even more next year when their tiny school has to cope with 15 classes when the school was built to hold 3.5 classes originally, and at its maximum expansion, the facilities (not classrooms but halls etc, lunch areas etc, were expanded to hold just 7 classes.

My DS's get just 10 mins for lunch now. And there is talk next year of that dropping even further because a very high percentage of parents pay for hot meals - there is an 85% uptake on hot meals here, in a school that currently has 420 pupils eating in a hall that can't hold more than 90 pupils at a time.

And there will be an EXTRA 30+ next year...

[MerryCouthyMows]

They're doing forest school instead of PE for one lesson a week now to make use of the local Country Park, as the field & hall aren't big enough.

Good idea, but it's been done BECAUSE they haven't the facilities for their current pupils!

[DuchessofMalfi]

I should have added that DS is classed as an out of area sibling so is bumped further down the list for place allocation.