Ive been worried about dd at school for a year and finally it sounds like school are too.

[VivaLeBeaver]

The head of year has rung and left a message saying she's worried about dd concerning how happy dd is and regarding problems dd is having with other kids.

I'm surprised she's rung to be honest as these problems have been going on for a year and I spoke to the HOY (same teacher) last year who seemed quite dismissive and made me feel I was been all PFB about it.

Dd seems to have a couple of friends who she gets on ok with but apart from that there seems to be quite a few girls who take pleasure in been nasty towards her. Dd was unhappy in Yr 7 a lot of the time, saying she spent quite a bit of time alone, etc. not just that but people were been low key nasty towards her every day, name calling, saying she's a geek, that she's weird, etc.


The constant name calling is getting her down and I worry about how its affecting her confidence. She was crying last week - not even over a specific incident and said she didn't feel safe but couldn't tell me why. I obv talk things over with her, give her little pep talks. I've bought her all the books about girls and friendships, etc.

She came home from school on Monday saying boys had been talking and laughing about her on the bus. Then Tuesday someone shoved a desk into her stomach on purpose and someone else threw a chair at her. This is in lessons, dd says the teacher is oblivious! Then more name calling in the next lesson.

When I speak to the HOY about it what should I be expecting her to say/do to try and sort the situation? Could I ask about counselling for dd as I am quite worried about how down she is. Would this be a CAHMs referral or could they do something in school.

Honestly I read in the news about girls who have committed suicide due to low level bullying like this over years and it frightens me.

[VivaLeBeaver]

That's interesting, I hadn't looked into it in that much detail. Hadn't thought of looking at the high achievers independently. I suppose if they get more lower grade students to start with they'll get worse exam results. Thanks.

[HmmAnOxfordComma]

No worries. Just more food for thought.

It's best to see what school can suggest to sort it out (if that's what dd wants to do); but good to know exactly what other options you have if necessary.

We have y8 parents eve this week so I'll know more about just how happy we are by the end of the week

[VivaLeBeaver]

Hmmm, have just spoken to the mum of the boy who has left dd's school for the other one.

He left for exactly the same problems. Constant, daily nastiness and name calling. Mum says the HOY basically did bugger all. Said she couldn't do anything unless the boy told her at the time of an incident. Is that realistic when it happens in every lesson?

She said the same to me last year that dd had to tell her stuff. But dd says when she did tell her that she felt brushed off.

Do you think its reasonable that dd keeps a record/log of it all rather than go and tell her every single time? Even dd would feel silly going and saying well X said whatever. On its own its no big deal, but its the bigger picture of that repeated over and over, every day.

[Goldmandra]

Do you think its reasonable that dd keeps a record/log of it all rather than go and tell her every single time?

I think that's perfect. You can request a meeting with HOY, Head of Pastoral Care if that's someone different and class tutor, then take the log in and make it very clear that the incidents are unacceptable.

Don't accept anything less than a very clear plan that you feel with address the problem swiftly and effectively.

Also ask for a copy of the school's equal opportunities/equality, behaviour management and bullying policies and call your local Parent Partnership service for advice.

[HmmAnOxfordComma]

Yes, definitely, get her to keep a log. Looks more accurate and helps to get a clear picture in all of your minds just how bad it is. Might also persuade dd that her friends aren't really being very friendly, either (if that is the case).

Honestly, it just wouldn't be tolerated at our school. Those girls would be in constant isolation. Except they wouldn't, because they wouldn't be able to get away with a lot of it in the first place. If the classes are well behaved and working, there's only a little of the very snidey behaviour they'd be able to fit in.

Poor dd. She shouldn't have to put up with it.

[HmmAnOxfordComma]

Sorry - that was meant as the school I work in, not ds's school.

[VivaLeBeaver]

Thanks everyone. Will update tomorrow after speaking to the school.

[VivaLeBeaver]

Right, have spoken to the HOY and don't think it went well. Honestly I'm so shit at this stuff.

Some other girls had told the HOY about the chair throwing incident, she says its the first time she realised there was a problem. I told her that dd hadn't told her about it as dd didnt feel the HOY would be interested. The HOY says she finds that hurtful and is shocked and wants to assure me that she's taking it very seriously. She can't think why dd would feel that way, I told her its due to her been uninterested last year.....she can't remember dd coming to her last year.

I emphasised its the ongoing name calling and excluding which is upsetting dd more. I asked if there was counselling available and said that dd says she feels unsafe at school and has talked about killing herself. She never actually answered the counselling question.

She is ringing me back later though. She's going to start an investigation today and will be getting parents in. Not sure what other sanctions yet, i guess she needs to do the investigation first.

I asked for a copy of the bullying policy and she says its on the website so will look for that later.

HOY says she will get this stopped and is taking it very seriously. But I know that's what she told the mum of the boy who left due to been bullied and then never followed it through.

HOY gets one chance and then I'm going to the headmaster.

[HSMMaCM]

I took my DD out of a school where she was bullied and I'm sure she learned more in the less good school, simply because she was happy there. Find out all the options and see if you can move her anywhere. (DD's current school is very strict and therefore bullying is not tolerated on any level)

[VivaLeBeaver]

Ok, have found the policy on the web, it doesn't say much.


. A definition of Bullying

Bullying can take many forms. It may be physical, verbal, psychological or increasingly electronic i.e. via mobile phones or the internet (cyber). Whatever its manifestation it can be described as the illegitimate use of power by an individual or group over another. Bullying is the systematic, targeted, deliberate and on-going abuse/humiliation of others. By its very nature it produces a climate of unhappiness, fear and secrecy. In the worst case scenarios students have taken their own lives.

We recognise that from time to time students, often friends, will disagree with each other and may ‘fall-out’. We accept that this may not be pleasant and we will work with students to help them resolve these issues. However, we will not treat these fall outs as bullying issues unless they are ‘systematic, targeted, deliberate and on-going situations’

Prevention.

There are a number of strategies that can be employed to help to prevent bullying. These include:

• Actively promoting the policy via displays and via the Student Planner.
• Raise awareness of the issue in the whole school community
• Give guidelines for student behaviour
• Give a strategy that will be employed to tackle the problem
• Ensure that where ever possible students are actively supervised by staff especially in areas that can be ‘hidden’ e.g. on the school field & corridors.
• Conduct regular staff & student reviews to ensure that the policy is understood and is actively tackling any problem.



Intervention.

The aim of prevention is to set out guidelines. The expectation is that whilst all cases will be different there are certain steps that will be taken in each case. In dealing with bullying issues the support of parents is paramount. When intervening in bullying situations aggressive action towards the bully does not solve the problem. Assertive and fair action does.

Guidelines for Parents, Staff and Students are provided as schedules to this policy document. Parent Guidelines will be published and highlighted via the school newsletter on a regular basis. Staff Guidelines will be included in the Staff Handbook. Student Guidelines will be displayed in Tutor Rooms and are included in all Student Planners. The School PSHE Programme will at regular intervals raise awareness of this policy and all associated aspects of bullying.

[VivaLeBeaver]

Ah, have found an attachment which says a bit more


Responsibility of Head of Year/PLA/LG

• Interview the student(s) concerned
• Determine the extent of the problem
• Contact the parent(s) of the student concerned to ascertain if they have spotted any change in behaviour etc
• Make a written record of the incident
• Ensure support for the student who is being bullied; this should include help with strategies to deal with bullying situations; assurance of access to staff support
• Take the necessary action to deal with the ‘bully’ in accordance with the school discipline policy.

(In instances where the Form Tutor or LG member are dealing with the issue, the Head of Year must be informed).


Responsibilities of Leadership Group

• To act as other staff in the prevention of bullying
• Respond to necessary measure which may prevent the incidence of bullying in school
• Give support to Pastoral Teams in dealing with issues which have not improved despite intervention
• Issue should be placed on Pastoral Board Agenda at least annually in order to monitor progress of policy and its effectiveness.

[TantrumsAndBalloons]

I took my dd out of school in year 8 and went to an out of borough school with far worse GCSE results. I think it was 42% 5 A-c

But the school took a great deal of interest in students well being. In ensuring they were safe and happy and dealing with issues as soon as they arose.

Dd took 3 GCSEs a year early, last year. She got 3 As. And she is predicted another 11 A*-As this year.

Sometimes you have to look beyond the results. Not all schools are a good fit for every child. They can have an outstanding ofsted rating, fantastic GCSE results and look fantastic on paper. But if your child is unhappy, all that doesn't matter because they won't get the best out of the school, they won't reach their full potential

I would honestly look into the other school a bit more. Forget the results, look at the school itself, it's pastoral care,it's bullying policy. My DDs school looks shit on paper but it isn't.

[Phineyj]

In your place I would appeal for the grammar again (as well as pursuing the other things you are doing). I teach in a grammar and we have a great many girls like your DD. We come down on any bullying like a ton of bricks. There are also a lot of clubs girls can do at lunch if they don't have people to hang around with. Obviously I don't know if the grammar near you is similar, but there is likely to be a better group of potential friends for her there. Your poor DD. I hope you can get her some counselling before/if she changes schools so she can make a fresh start.

[HmmAnOxfordComma]

Some other thoughts:

Just looking a bit more at the 'other' school's website - they do set for many subjects in KS3 such as English (lots of schools don't set for English) so that's good potentially for dd.

They had 2 students get 13 A/A*s last year and some others mentioned who got 9/10.

They do do two languages. But they don't (currently) offer triple science at GCSE, only single and applied.

Their sixth form is small. Options more limited than at other schools mentioned so far? But dd could move for sixth form.

Does dd have any friends still in the village at 'your' grammar? If so, that could well help her to settle and be the best solution - if you could get another appeal.

Or a fresh start where she knows nobody could also work.

Was thinking of suggesting a taxi to the bus stop for the 'other' grammar (with places) for the days when you are working late/early which wouldn't cost as much as independent fees (!) but it would make a very long day for her. Probably not the best option.

Asked ds last night if the girls in his year seem to get on well and are a friendly bunch - his very limited observations (thanks to his Asperger's) were not helpful 'yes, they all seem nice in my class!' but I will keep ears and eyes to the ground over the next few days. They are set for every subject at ds's school except technology. And have very small form groups (12/13) which could be a good thing - could be bad (no nastiness that the tutor doesn't instantly spot - but a smaller pool of potential friends?)

Good luck with more investigations/thoughts today.

[Goldmandra]

Write a summary of what was discussed in the meeting and what action the HOY has agreed to take. Email the summary to her with reminders about anything on the bullying policy you feel should be done but hasn't been mentioned, e.g. exactly how and when your DD can approach staff for support. Make it fairly detailed because, if unchallenged, this becomes formal evidence if this escalates.

Ask about counselling again.

At the end of the email give her a timescale in which you'd like her to get back to you with the results of her investigation and details of what action will be taken.

Don't accept being treated like the other parent. Make it clear at all times that they have a responsibility to your DD and you expect them to live up to it.

[WynkenBlynkenandNod]

Excellent advice from Goldmandra. Follow up everything to with an email outlining your conversation and what was agreed. I failed to do that and when I was applying for DS to go to the other Middle school I realised the Head had made sure it was all over the phone so no written record.

We had the whole thing with the Head about DD and friends not aporoaching him when incidents happened. I said they didn't as felt he wouldn't do anything and he lost his cool and kind of shouted 'well they don't know me then'. He would only deal with major things and a lot if low level bullying went on.

One boy was blocking DD's way somewhere. We told the Head. He said he had spoken to him and he was 'absolutely mortified she could think that. He's a lovely boy, very upset, expecting parents to ring in actually'. The lovely boy then got cocky and rammed DD with a chair and as her friends saw Head had to act. There were clearly big problems with the school and to my huge delight he resigned just as I was applying for DS and a lovely new one has come. He has his work cut out though and once a culture of low level bullying gets established it takes time to improve.

If I were you now I would keep at the school and I would now ask for a meeting with HOY and Head, taking a friend to take notes. Your DD is scared for her safety and has talked of killing herself. This needs to be taken very seriously by the school. Use words like safeguarding issue, Duty of care.

As well as that I'd try to get her a space somewhere else to give maximum options. DD first talked about her current school a few years ago and I screeched that she wasn't going there. But I listened around and found people whose children had gone through, had done well and were really happy there. They are way behind our catchment upper in results they set and there are a couple of children there who tried the Grammar and hated it plus I have serveral friends who have children who look set to come out with high grades. DD's grades have hugely improved now she is happy.

When she first started she was really happy as her new friends wait for her after class and that had never happened before. I nearly cried when she said that.

Have another go at getting her into the Grammar and see what your chances are at the better comp. I know this is all very hard to deal with when you are in the middle of it but hang in there, you are going a good job in difficult circumstances.

[VivaLeBeaver]

Thanks for all the advice. Dd is now adamant she doesn't want to change schools. She's feeling more positive this morning. I'll ask the HOY for a meeting when she rings back.

[Goldmandra]

Just realised your conversation was over the phone, not face to face. This conversation is the first thing you need to confirm by email. Then do the same with future conversations and meetings.

It feels awkward and confrontational but it's actually helpful to everyone because it helps you to clarify any misunderstandings and reminds people to do the things they have agreed to do.

[Alexandrite]

Your poor dd. Does she not want to move because she doesn't believe things could be better elsewhere? Or because she is scared of the unknown? I remember someone posting once to say that a CAMHs psychologist had said off the record that where a child is experiencing sustained bullying by lots of the children, the only thing that really works is to move them. Did you watch Child of Our Time? There was a boy on it who was being bullied like this and the mother moved him and he was so much happier once he moved. I hope things improve for your daughter. She sounds like my daughter and I worry for her when she goes to high school. I plan to move her if this happens, although i know it is easy to say that but harder to do.

[miss600]

Did you know that you can go to the police? intentional harassment, causing alarm or distress to someone is an offense under section 5 of the public order act. You have the right to insist on a caution being issued which would remain on their record for 100 years. Even if they are 13yrs and it happened in school. Maybe you can let the school and relevant parents know this too.

[VivaLeBeaver]

I think she doesn't want to move school as she doesn't want to leave her two friends behind.

I've realised this afternoon the lessons she's getting bullied in are the lessons like music, dt, the ones where they're in their form group rather than streamed. So I asked dd if she wants me to push for a form group change and she's said no even to that because she likes her form tutor. Her two friends are in a different form group and I said I'd do what I could to get her in that form group but she still doesn't want to.

Saying that dd is still off school and currently sniffing about not liking school and not wanting to go back.

The HOY rang me this afternoon to say she's put the girls in isolation and has got one girls parents coming in. I emphasised again the ongoing nastiness and she wants dd to write it all down.

Dd says she doesn't want to talk to any form of counsellor, she'd rather just talk to me. I told her a counsellor might have better advice but she's still not up for it.

Dd has had a phone call from one of the girls who went and told the HOY what was happening. Turns out the girls who stuck up for dd also got put in isolation as they swore when they were telling the story to the HOY, they thought she was taking it very seriously and got a bit excited. So they won't be in a hurry to help again.

[Goldmandra]

That sounds like poor judgement on the HOY's behalf.

Have High Schools lost the ability to issue advice and warnings to pupils these days? They all seem to have this idea that the smallest indiscretion warrants coming down on them like a ton of brick whatever the context.

Give someone a little bit of power......

[VivaLeBeaver]

I know. It doesn't exactly give me much faith in her.

I'm also pissed off about her comment to me this morning. When I to,d her that dd didnt think she'd be interested in what was happening she said that she was really hurt by that. Like she was telling me off for saying it and hurting her feelings.

[VivaLeBeaver]

Miss600, that's a good point that I could get the police involved even for non physical stuff. If its sustained. If someone was repeatedly been nasty to me, calling me a bitch, etc I'd go to the police.

Would they do anything or would they just think I'm insane for getting the police involved? My sisters a copper actually, will speak to her.

[Goldmandra]

When I to,d her that dd didnt think she'd be interested in what was happening she said that she was really hurt by that. Like she was telling me off for saying it and hurting her feelings.

Well yes, when I read that in your other post I though how unprofessional her comment was. She should use that information to reflect on how she could improve her practice, not moan about hurt feelings.

She's not inspiring me with much confidence in her ability to sort this out. You need to do what I said earlier and record all of this to email to her.

Putting the girls in isolation is only a small part of dealing with this. She needs to put things in place to make sure they understand what how severely this will be dealt with in the future and also detail strategies for supporting your DD and supporting her positive peer relationships.

So far she's given them the same sanction she gave other girls for swearing which totally negates the seriousness of their actions.

Have you looked on any of the bullying websites. They may well have sections for parents with advice on how this should be dealt with in schools. I haven't had to deal with bullying for several years but maybe someone else will come along with some good links for you.