angered by tuition for grammar school 11+

[kelway]

i was curious but does anyone else here feel the same in being frustrated with overly pushy parents who get their offspring heavily tutored (ie 3/4 nights a week after school for at least 2 years before taking the 11+). I constantly hear of girls getting into our local grammar school who were not as clever as other girls in the same class at school but who were overly pushed by their parents. Subsequently it feels like the local grammar school has been almost 'hijacked' by such people who can afford extra tuition. I always understood that grammar schools were for the more gifted student that perhaps had parents that could not afford to send them to a private school. Our local grammar school has become very elitest. i get the impression that the way i feel is pretty standard of most mothers of girls where i live (if your child isn't tutored however bright they are they stand no chance of getting into the local grammar school).

[Quattrocento]

And this question recognition practice takes how long exactly? You could teach that perfectly effectively as a parent with practice papers in four sessions. Ooh look here's that manipulating equations question again ... And ooh look, here's that Venn diagram again.

I haven't forgotten the grammars which don't just test through VR and NVR - that's just totally unfair IMO.

Interesting to see Seeker advocating increasing social inequality ... :)

[bitsyandbetty]

My neighbours are tutoring their kids from age 4 (one is also at a private prep but still does Kumon). This is to get them to pass the 11+ in the next LEA. The World is mad and these kids will pass I am sure as both are bright already but to me it just seems immense pressure and can only lead to disappointment if they do not get all As at A LEvels because the expectations are so high.

[Notevenamouse]

A person could do that Quattro but their child would need to be a fast learner (like your own) and the parent would need to be time rich and well educated themselves.

[seeker]

Eh? Don't get you, quattrocento!

[MollieO]

I know someone who has booked a tutor for her yr 2 child for 11+ tuition. She emailed all of our year to ask for recommendations (some dcs in our year have older siblings). I thought she was joking. The other parents with older siblings have done one hour a week tutoring from yr 5 so one year of tutoring.

We had three practice sessions when I did the 11+. First session I had no idea but the next two I scored very high in the remaining sessions. Don't think I was a fast learner but was definitely grammar school material.

[MollieO]

I'm in favour of selective education. Ds is in pre-prep in a class with a huge ability range. It makes for difficulties for the teacher - reading age spread is 6 yrs.

[seeker]

You don't need selective education to have differentiated education.

[ladysybil]

whats the point of beng angry about this? obviously parents are going to do what is best for their kids as they see fit. and if that means buying lots of plastic tat at christmas, or paying for three years of tuition fees, or six years of piano lessons, then that is what they will do. why be angry at other peoples life choices?

[seeker]

If enough people get angry they system can be changed.

[Quattrocento]

Oh let me guess. We abolish all the remaining grammar schools, so that no child has an opportunity to enjoy an academic education unless their parents can afford it.

I'm not talking from the perspective of self-interest. I have no interest in preservation of grammar schools per se. I do however believe that children should have an opportunity to have a proper academic education and I don't believe that's available in the majority of comprehensive schools.

[toomanyprojects]

We live outside the Bucks catchment but close enough for me to consider it worth my DD taking the 11+. Like others have commented, I did not consider tutoring as I thought it pointless in the long term.

She is bright but struggled with time management with the practise papers.
The first time she only managed to do about half the questions. She did the other papers and I spent a bit of time giving her some tips but we only got the papers in Sept and with three children I just ran out of time to practise with her more before the half term exam.

On the exam days she didn't finish the paper - she wouldn't say by how much but I think about ten questions given how she had got on at home. I think she therefore did very well to end up with 108 but is obviously below below the pass mark of 121 and I was worried how she would react to not passing. Luckily she didn't seem too bothered, but I am sure that with a few sessions of tutoring she would have passed.

I now console myself with the fact that even if she had passed, she probably would not got in as we are outside the catchment.

[SantasSackura]

Quattro, but the grammar school system doesn't help social mobility It just allows those kids who already fare well to fare even better. It got sod all to do with helping innately clever kids from disadvantaged backgrounds

[toomanyprojects]

Can I also comment that the whole process was much more stressful than I had considered - because we were out of county the tests were on two non-consecutive days of the Oct half term which basically meant that half the holiday week was blocked off.

[MollieO]

My concern with comprehensive education is just how selective it can be. If the ability range is so diverse how can all pupils needs be properly catered for? The grammar I went to had streaming and there was a broad range of ability. I think it is an exceptional comprehensive that can cater well for all needs. There aren't any where we live that can do that.

[Bink]

What's the third meaning of sage?

[Quattrocento]

The third meaning of sage sounds like hippy dippy stuff. Or mutant ninja stuff.

Either way, too elliptical for me.

[BoffinMum]

The problem is not that some parents spend money on tuition, it is that many maintained primary schools fail to prepare their pupils adequately for secondary education, and this becomes apparent when pupils fall short on skills like reading the question and checking your answers (which tutors spend a lot of time emphasising).

[Bink]

QC: a propos is seeker's post of 23-Dec-10 23:15:38

[Quattrocento]

Sorry, missed that post

Just asked DD how many meanings there were for the word sage. The response came back three - instantly.

A noun meaning a herb
An adjective meaning wise
A noun meaning a wise person

DD is 12.

There are probably more though aren't there? I thought there was some specific attribution to the 'third meaning' of sage.
Kind of like the third way.

[Notevenamouse]

Isn't she clever

[Quattrocento]

Not particularly

[Notevenamouse]

Oh I'm sorry, I was sure that was the point you were making. You seem so convinced she could not possibly make do with an ordinary education.

[Quattrocento]

Nope. Never said that. I am however convinced that state education is fairly inadequate and fails many of its pupils. If you want to pick a fight, shall we go outside? More edifying, like.

[Quattrocento]

An online dictinary gives 6 meanings for the word sage, whereas the OED (shorter) only gives 5 ...

Anyhow still reckon an 11 YO should be able to come up with 3.