Thread for those who swing widely between wanting to leave and wanting to stay

[FranGoldsmith]

Is anyone else like this?

Sometimes I feel like I'm going mad. We are both age 42, no children, two dogs.

Ours is a sexless marriage. It wasn't at first - we couldn't get enough of each other - but the last time we had sex was February. The time before that was August 2014. Before that, June 2013. Apart from the self-esteem erosion it causes when your husband doesn't fancy you, I'm not that bothered. It's always over in seconds, it's never good for me. I still have a decent libido though. He doesn't.

He has all the traits of passive-aggressive personality disorder and all the traits of obsessive compulsive personality disorder (OCPD: a different disorder to OCD). Sometimes I could scream, he's such a frustrating man to live with. Of course he doesn't accept he may have any kind of disorder. He is perfect, normal, and is right all the time, and I am unreasonable and emotional.

But he's also great company. We're very comfortable together. We like the same things, laugh together, enjoy each other's company (mostly). We like holidays, eating out, going to the cinema, walking the dogs. He adores our dogs. He brings me flowers home from work. He looked after me when I was ill. He works very hard and he's not a lazy man.

More and more I think, this marriage is no good. It's got no emotional depth; it's superficial; we're just friends sharing a house. He shuts down any conversation about anything meaningful, anything about our relationship, but he will talk endlessly about jobs on the house, his work, himself.

I've decided several times I'm going to leave. But then I miss him when he works away, or we laugh together at something, and I change my mind.

Anyone else going through anything similar?

[apintofharpandapacketofdates]

Hi all.

I recognise so much of myself in what you're saying.
I'm almost 1 year on and can honestly say it's better now. ExDH and I get on better than we ever did.

We never had sex
He was v v PA
I spent years in counselling/therapy-type situations
He is a woefully inadequate communicator
He's a bully
He's a misogynist

They're his issues now. No longer mine. I'm not perfect, far from it. However I have had enough of trying to be something he wanted. He was so disingenuous about most things; I'd never have been good enough.

Fuck that. Yes these threads are bloody depressing reading, they strike a chord for a lot of us. I recognise that pain; the aching heart, the melancholy.

Sending strength for whatever you decide....

[apintofharpandapacketofdates]

Thread for those who have left marriages that weren't AWFUL, just unsatisfying (pt. II)
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/2667694-Thread-for-those-who-have-left-marriages-that-werent-AWFUL-just-unsatisfying-pt-II

For additional reference, should it help

[adora1]

He is adamant that we ought to stay together for the kids.

So not for the love and adoration for each other - you should never stay together for the kids, that just highlights what's missing.

[adora1]

I think if you feel dissatisfied and unhappy but have some good times it's really not enough, you are just accepting the crap along with the good, there should not be crap like this in a relationship and personally no way I would accept a sexless relationship - you've got years of this ahead, I'd rather do something about it than carry on pretending the shit doesn't matter, it does, you only get one kick at the ball, you can have all the good stuff without the crap with someone who makes you happy and content.

Just sounds like you are all selling yourselves short to keep the status quo.

[Peonylass]

Me too. Want to leave him at the moment, was very frank about being unhappy and he is making some practical efforts. We do have sex though he struggles with this. His libido is much lower than mine and there were many sexless years. He is adamant that we ought to stay together for the kids.

But he still doesn't meet me halfway. He's still passive aggressive. I still carry him though I am working to disengage. The thing I miss most is conversation. He's not a talker any more and I love ideas, banter.

I have asked him to think about what he wants in life. First time he said fancy car and holidays. The second time he talked about needing more comfortable chairs. Left to his own devices he plays with his phone and watches tv. He's no career aspirations.

What do I want in life? An interesting career, well balanced kids, travel, experiences, cuddles, spiritual growth, friends. To jump from high places, to make a difference. I just don't think we are matched at all and sticking with it feels like having to get into a box

[FranGoldsmith]

Oh MummyB, you too :-( I know exactly what you mean. Mumsnet seems to get right to the root of the problem and opens your eyes, and it's wonderfully supportive. But it's also really bloody depressing to realise this relates to your own very real life.

[MummyBtothree]

to everyone. Apologies if I too seemed to go quiet. Talking about it and reading through everyone else's stories was making me feel even more down. Im on antidepressants and trying my best to pick my mood up a bit. Finding Mumsnet was excellent for me as I don't have any family/friends to talk to about all my crap but sometimes talking about it has the opposite effect and drags me down.

[FranGoldsmith]

Sorry it's been a few days since I posted. Being on here, reading about other people's experiences, was making me feel worse. I could never articulate why I felt like things weren't good with my husband, but having lurked on Relationships for a while, I've started learning about passive-aggressiveness, emotional abuse, learned behaviour, and so on.

Before I found mumsnet, I thought this was fixable. I bought into his reasonable and calm attitude. But I'm more and more thinking it's not fixable. He's impossible to talk to. He will never ever admit I might have a point. He minimises (there's another term I learnt here) my concerns. He makes himself seem totally rational and reasonable, so I'm left wondering what my problem was in the first place.

It's depressing. I'm feeling very low at the moment. 20 years I've spent with him. If I tell him I want to separate, there's nothing tangible to tell him about why I want to leave. He'll make me seem silly and emotional.

I don't even know if I want to separate anyway. I'm getting on my own nerves. Maybe I'll just hang out on Relationships for a while, get my head in order. I have started thinking about the practicalities of leaving - housing, money and so on. That's a start.

[gingerbreadmanm]

oh gosh daily! sometimes hourly.

i love dp and i think he loves me but we dont get on much. he's not a very nice person at times and very selfish.

we have been through something terrible together though that bonds us even though at times i think he doesnt even understan and it was in the last year. i dont know if it's that that makes me feel like i do right now.

i used to think it was us against the world but ive always been optimistic.

truth is, if i posted half of what he did on here it would be LTB galore but something is still keeping me here.

[svenwhen]

Deleted some words by mistake, it was ment to say
He also ,and I've said it to him on occasions not to do this as it makes me feel bad, throw his eyes up to heaven sighing or else say Don't you want to spend time with me?

[svenwhen]

Frans, mine does that too! Once I found my dress which had been on the clothes line ,lying on the ground after he had been just in the garden. Other occasions my coat thrown on floor or my good black pumps squashed like someone had stood with a heavy boot on them.
He also and I've said it to him on various occasions,if I'm so tired I'm falling asleep on the sofa and we were watching TV in the evening, he'll make me feel so guilty saying Don't you want to spend time with me? Or once as I left the room I heard a bang behind me ,I turned round and he had hit the coffee table and knocked my bag off it, I asked him innocently what had happened but I knew he was mad because I was tired (small kids I'm up everynight at least twice with them) he said oh I pushed it a little and it just fell off.

[FranGoldsmith]

MummyB, sorry to hear you've had such a rotten night. Are you ok? I'm concerned to hear that your husband uses your teenager children to back him up - you must feel very cornered.

[FranGoldsmith]

Hi Darryl. Yes I've started looking into counselling - for me initially, but then I was thinking that one day I'd suggest we go together. I'm not sure about that: I know he'd be very much against it. And I also know he'll twist and manipulate the counseller, and me, so he appears perfectly reasonable.

I stay because we've had many good years and we still have many good times, as well as the bad stuff. He's not all bad. Really, he isn't. Like I said upfront, we're comfortable together, he's great company, and he can also be very very lovely. So when things are good, we can actually have a few weeks of it being really nice between us and I can't imagine not having him in my life. And I miss him when he works away, and then I imagine being an old woman on my own, no children, and regretting letting him go.

Everyone who knows us thinks we're a great couple. They all think he's polite, considerate, kind, helpful. And he is - mostly ... or on the surface. But he's also got this passive-aggressive, obsessive side to him that I've described, which only I see. And then I'm back to thinking, yep I'm going to leave him.

That's what I mean by swinging wildly between wanting to leave and wanting to stay.

[darreldixonishot]

Fran have you thought about counselling? Just for you?
I can sort of see why couples who have children stay in relationships like this but I can't understand why you would put up with it!
You can have a good relationship, with friendship, love, laughs and sex!
You only get one chance at this life, it's not a dress rehearsal!

[MummyBtothree]

Morning all :) well I've had a rotten nights sleep after my dh having one of his 'talks' to me just after I finally got to sit down and have some time to myself. Apparently he and my two teenage sons are concerned that im not coping very well with our youngest son who is 4 and has adhd and wondering if I am making his behaviour worse because of my depression and anxiety issues. Im having counselling at the moment to deal with stuff I went through with my parents and do everything around the house and for our kids, theres no wonder im stressed! . He used to bath our older two kids and give me some time to myself but ds no. 3 came along by suprise and he doesn't lift a damn finger with him. It all gets left to me and im always the bad guy. I was in floods of tears last night, talk about being kicked while you're down and dh got up this morning and gave me a smile & a kiss like everything in life is dandy.

[FranGoldsmith]

svenwhen you've made me think with your comment about when you first met that he seemed to like an argument. My husband lied to me about a couple of things when we were first dating - his relationship with a female friend, who he was going out with, etc.

He always seemed so reasonable and made me feel like I was kicking up a silly fuss at him just trying to 'keep the peace'. But looking back now, I can't believe alarm bells didn't ring that he found lying and untruths so easy.

[FranGoldsmith]

I'm sorry to see there are so many of us who feel like this. It doesn't matter if some of us are in different situations to how this thread started - I'm sure we can all sympathise and offer support.

A change.. are you ok after your 'talk'?

We're going through a 'superficially polite and nice' phase at the moment. This really struck a chord:

Stbxh has a gift at being polite and yet it is the most unkind of qualities. Hence the term passive aggressive is so apt here.

I often get the feeling that, although my husband is being polite on the surface, inside he is positively brimming with fury. For example, things belonging to me will annoy him - I had some lounge wear type clothes on the floor next to my side of the bed, and he had kicked at them. I noticed they had moved and asked why, and he said, all reasonable and polite tone, that they were in the way of the bedroom door (they weren't: it was a tiny pile of two items tucked next to the bed).

Meanwhile, he always has clothes scattered over our bedroom floor AND the spare room floor. He cannot see the irony in this, and he twists it so I feel like I'm unreasonable for leaving a top and pair of jogging bottoms on the floor. So much so, that I've never done it again, but he continues to have piles of clothes all over both rooms.

[MapleSyrupAndJam]

Can I join too?

Having a rubbish time at the moment. We have three DC who are still tiny, I'm 30 so relatively young. DH and I have had a tough few years with a lot of pressure on our relationship. When we've argued he has disappeared for days at a time. Along with other stuff, namely his refusal to communicate, this has really changed how I feel about him. I do love him but I'm not IN love any more. I'm financially dependent on him too. I keep thinking to myself how great it would be to be single, having fun. But I don't know what to do 🙁 I'm most concerned with my DC being happy. But I'm scared what will happen if we split.

[starsandstripes2016]

well I took myself off for a very small glass of wine and I see that There is an alternative to being down trodden. stbxh is boring and I need to make an effort to find ways of finding my sense of humour and it's certainly not with Mr Nice sitting across the way from me!

[MummyBtothree]

svenwhen - you didn't go on, it seems theres alot of people in our situation. I've got no friends left these days due to my dh getting jealous of anybody else getting a snippet of my time or attention even though he's not interested in me most of the time.

[svenwhen]

Sorry that I went on a bit there!
I only ment to write yes I'm there too !

[svenwhen]

Oh I'm there too. I can't see us being an advertisement for Golden Oldies.
We're late 30s , together since our early 20s and I often look back and think Why did I meet him for coffee, why... didn't I just break it off after the first few dates when I even told him he seemed to enjoy a good argument....why didn't I break it off before we moved in together...before we got married... before we had kids... and yet I'm still here.
We do have good days. He's good with the kids, well when's he's in a good mood. He's works hard and I'm a sahm . We have a laugh and get on well . It really all depends on his mood though. He is controlling and passive aggressive.makes me feel guilty when I meet any friends,which I have very few of left because of the hassle I'm given when I tell him I'm meeting x for coffee. I never go out anymore . He even follows me around the house sometimes if I take too long upstairs for example. It's exhausting and I don't know how how more i can keep going with it.
Then there's days where he's affectionate and jokes and we have fun. It's sad really because like a pp said It's like walking on eggshells. I don't know why I married him some days.
A pp said make plans for when or if it happens do I'm trying to do that. It's makes my heart hurt almost as I love the idea of marriage, I just didn't sign up for this double standard relationship. I know the kids would be so upset and my parents would be at a loss as they love him.

[MummyBtothree]

My dh deals completely with all the finances and because I'm not working it makes it impossible to save anything on the side for when I do want out one day (which I will, believe me but when the kids are older). I too have to deal with all the ringing tax credits and all that pain in the arse. He's actually told me that he's never loved yet hated someone so much before during a row. At first I was shocked but soon realised I feel exactly the same about him.

[mumbathing]

Ha I feel you there! Dh won't do paperwork or forms or deal with finances. That's all my job. We get tax credits so I have to do the annual renewal declaration as he wont. My god trying to get his p60 out of him is like trying to get blood out of stone! He doesn't have. He can't get hold of it. They haven't issued it yet. Can only get it online and don't know the log ins etc etc. Why make it so bloody difficult? You want me to do it but you have to help too!!!! AAARRRGGHH!! Then finally get the info, send it off and I received a letter back saying because Dh did another 3 jobs in the last tax year (agency work whilst between jobs) he earnt more according to tax office then I've declared. So there comes the next argument of "well I didn't earn that much". Erm yes you did! So much hard work for such a simple task

[starsandstripes2016]

Stbxh and I are in the final stages of separating. Reading the posts I see myself in both descriptions - the pained and the one who is the pain in the arse. I literally can count the days until I'm out of here. How does everyone else manage the anger, sadness and feeling of barrenness? I feel I could tear the walls down but am being sooooo self controlled. Stbxh has a gift at being polite and yet it is the most unkind of qualities. Hence the term passive aggressive is so apt here.