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Relationships

AIBU or IHBU about how to 'contribute financially'?

52 replies

Butterflyface · 31/10/2014 09:45

Basically, since I met DH, we've always just thrown all the money into the pot, paid the bills from whichever account, and we've never had much left over to even really think about. To start with, I was working (full school hours), and we had tax credits and CHB for my two children. No maintenance (from prick XP) for ages. Then after I had DC3 with DH, I had a chronic illness develop so since then I've been financially reliant on him - I was working very pt from home, but money from that was negligible (but I still spent it all on food/stuff for the kids or the house). And we still had CTC & CHB. I couldn't claim ESA/IB/IS because DH's wages were too high, but we always had the approach that, being a couple, we just threw everything at the house, and didn't think about him having 'his' money, or me having 'mine. We always said that we didn't understand couples who did this, as it implied to us that they were always thinking about themselves as being separate people, and therefore always had a tiny piece of doubt that they would be staying in the relationship forever.
Roll on to this year, and finally, thankfully, I seem to have made a vast improvement health wise since the end of August. In early Sep, our financial situation changed so that we were going to be down by £500 odd a month. So, although I have huge doubts as to whether I'm actually physically up to having a job, I've gone and got myself a FT office job. I've told Social Services this, and am expecting a reassessment of my direct Payments, and am expecting them to say that I will need to pay for my 10 hours of care a week. Completely fair.
I've budgeted for paying CSA and CHB for my two older children, and so am going through carefully the budget, allowing for a second car, child care for when DH has to work away from home etc.
So, DH says that he wants me to pay for half the bills. While this seems fair, he earns twice what I do, so he'll be left with ten times more than I will at the end of the month. Apart from anything else, I'm really sad that he wants 'his' share and 'my' share - I had seen it all as one big smelting pot from which we both just shared at the end. I have absolutely no problem with paying a fair share towards the bills, I just feel it should be proportionate - 2/3 to 1/3. But it's also thrown up issues like - what do we do about apportioning childcare when it's for him going away that we'll need it? (He works from home, so will be doing all the school runs.)
I just feel a bit sad that he obviously doesn't think that I've contributed either financially or 'in kind' over the last 7 years. And I do actually feel that he now has the attitude that our relationship isn't going to last forever. He says he just wants me to pay some money to him 'to take the pressure off his bank account', but it's my account that's in the minuses at the moment while we bridge the gap between losing the money and me earning some. I was the one who got the loan to help us get 2 new cars (our old one got condemned at it's MOT), and I'm also upset that we're having 'separate' cars, where he pays for his travel and I pay for mine (even though his travel is more expensive than mine). It's not about the amounts of money, it's about the psychology behind it.
Please someone tell me I'm not being the shit one about this, but I just don't know. I know his family probably think I've just been sponging off him all these years, but they obviously don't see what contributions I've made (although they've been state-paid ones, and my meagre earnings, iyswim.)
WDID?

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Vivacia · 31/10/2014 12:46

I'd be worried that this is the tip of the iceberg. You need to sit down, put everything on the table and go through plans together.

If you get any more of this "DB and SiL" shit, pointedly ask him, "How much has DB paid SiL for providing all of that childcare for their child?".

I also think you need to be clear what you will do if he refuses to sit and discuss it.

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BuilderMammy · 31/10/2014 12:47

That may be what BIL and SIL do, but it's not what lots of other people do. DH and I, for example, have never paid shares of things; everything goes into one account and we pay for what's necessary out of that. So why are BIL and SIL suddenly the most desirable role models?

I'm sorry, but I think he's being a bit of a thoughtless git.

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Vivacia · 31/10/2014 12:48

Also, can we just confirm that you are married (and not just using 'DH' as shorthand)? And why did the car loans go in your name only?

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Quitelikely · 31/10/2014 12:49

Do you think he has issues with what he sees as paying for your dcs that aren't his?

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CleanLinesSharpEdges · 31/10/2014 12:50

I'm curious to know why no maintenance from your ex? Are you doing anything about this?

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Butterflyface · 31/10/2014 12:58

We are married - and I know he's quite resentful that my XP didn't pay any maintenance for years, ripped us off of all the equity from the old flat, meaning that we didn't get anything when we sold it, and has basically forced this situation because he's persuaded the two older dc's to live with him, and therefore XP is getting the CTC and I'm paying the children their CHB now.
I have a feeling that DH has obviously mentioned my getting a job to his DB, and his DB said 'Well, you know what you need to do now, don't you? She has to pay her fair share, like SIL does'. I don't know this, but it just feels like it. Tbh, I can see his families' perspective - DH has been paying for everything for the last 7 years, and I do need to make sure I'm paying my fair share - I'm just not convinced that doing it 50/50 is fair, especially not now everyone else has posted.
To answer the question about how much he earns - it's almost double what I will be earning, so that's why I suggested 2/3 to a 1/3.

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Butterflyface · 31/10/2014 13:00

CLSE - XP didn't pay anything for 5 years (50/50 shared parenting) then as it changed, we went to the CSA so that he paid a fair share. Now the DC's are living mostly with him, I'm expecting to pay XP maintenance. Again, from 'my' money.

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Darkesteyes · 31/10/2014 18:58

Hmmm Im wondering if hes recently incurred an expense he doesnt want you to know about. Simply because hes moving goalposts suddenly after a considerable length of time.

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independentfriend · 31/10/2014 19:40

Actually, see para 76 of www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/208323/Fairer_Charging_Guidance_final_2013-06-20_rc.pdf - income from earnings is disregarded when calculating your contribution to social care services.

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SolidGoldBrass · 31/10/2014 19:42

I think the root of this may be his resentment of the way your XP has behaved. He may feel (even though this may not be the truth) that he has been obliged to support your DC for years while you let your XP get away with contributing nothing, and now he's going to be running at even more of a loss while your XP is still allowed to get away with contributing no money.

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kusmile · 31/10/2014 19:48

He is being unreasonable given your income differences, but it sounds like he could have just said it without really thinking through the implications of splitting expenses. It sounds like he's resentful that he's paid more towards bills and doesn't want to see you getting more personal spending money without getting some benefit himself. Did he assume that you wouldn't contribute more?

As he's now reluctant to discuss it (perhaps because he realises it was unreasonable/mean), you could just leave it and see if he brings it up again when he's had more time to think about it, he might have a more reasonable view on how to do a fair split, or perhaps he'll just let it go.

As others have suggested, a joint bank account that you both pay into for bills would be a good idea. You could both pay in a certain percent of your income, or work out amounts that you'll pay into it each month.

I think his reluctance to discuss it is more worrying than his initial request to split the bills.

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knittingdad · 31/10/2014 20:38

There's no one best way about how to deal with finances in a couple relationship. The important thing is that however it is arranged is decided by the couple together, after discussion, and is something that both people are happy with.

If he's not happy with your previous arrangement then he's not being unreasonable to ask for a change, but equally if you would not be comfortable with that change then you're not being unreasonable in not wanting to simply agree to it.

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Joysmum · 31/10/2014 20:52

I don't do joint accounts, and have been on MN long enough to be glad I don't. All that concerns us is that disposable income is equal, no that bills are paid from a joint account.

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holeinmyheart · 01/11/2014 00:01

You have contributed a great deal to your family that can be measured in monetary terms.
You have sacrificed yourself ( body/ career ) to have children, that is what women do. You must also have prepared meals, washed, cooked, cleaned and provided emotional comfort to the whole family and probably had sex when you didn't feel like it, to ensure your husband felt happy.
I am afraid that he is hiding something.
Dammit ! you have been ill. How dare he behave like he is when you are struggling to get better.
I don't want you to look at his bank statements but I think you will have to insist, as why is he behaving so out of character. Doesn't he have any hard copies lying about.
I just hope it is not what I think it is.
Please let us know what happens. Xx

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Butterflyface · 01/11/2014 07:54

Thank you all - we've had a busy afternoon/evening/night with the kids and Hallowe'en, so everything's been put on the back burner. I think a lot of it is yes, he's just worried I thought I would have all the disposable income in my account and not contribute more than I already do, and yes, I don't think he really thought about what he was saying - he's agreed that we do need a joint account - perhaps turning his into a joint one might be easier than setting up a new one as there'll be less to transfer, but essentially he knows now that of course I'll be contributing more - I'm not sure when we're going to get the time to sit down and talk about this properly - dc's 3 and 4 are on the AS, so they're pretty full on, but hopefully tonight we can sit down and talk about it. He is exhausted at the moment, having come back from two trips abroad last week, and his junior has just left and the work won't replace him, so he's doing two people's jobs as well. I think a lot of this is just stress and tiredness and him not being very good at communicating!
That web page was really helpful - thank you if! I'll let you all know what he says!

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Vivacia · 01/11/2014 08:48

Sounds as though you've got a plan Butterfly. I think it's absolutely vital that you do discuss this sooner rather than later, and when things are calm (money-wise!).

I would start up a new account as the joint one though. I think that the symbolism is important.

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Matildathecat · 01/11/2014 12:21

OP, if you have care needs that high can you not claim PIP? It's not means tested and supposed to enable the sick or disabled to live independently ie work wherever possible.

I'm guessing your DH is suddenly envisaging a lot more money coming in simply because you will be ft and ignoring the fact that you will also be losing income. He will soon enough see the truth of the situation. Just contribute what you can and view as reasonable. Which is, of course, One Pot.

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Butterflyface · 02/11/2014 17:10

I applied for PIP last December - had to write a letter to WTC when we lost all our CTC because DC1 and 2 decided to go and live with their dad and visit us every other weekend. (Another long story!) But essentially, even though the move is supposed to be a trial, it wasn't long before the XP was sending me insulting, verging on abusive texts saying I had to stop claiming tax credits and child benefit or he would inform them. I knew I had a month to inform them, but I just did it anyway, and so, that's the reason why we're now down by about £500 month - basically all our food money. So, while I'm still waiting for PIP for me, and DLA for the younger two boys, we just don't have enough to live off. And if I can work, I want to work. I don't actually know whether I'm really up to it or not, but the only way I'm going to find out is to give it a go.
DH says I'm being silly about the money thing - that he just wants me to pay half the rent and council tax, but I think the issue is more complex than that. As I said previously, it's about the attitude towards the relationship that concerns me. I think (and I think he also thinks as well, but DB has convinced him that the 50/50 separated finances idea is how we 'ought' to do it) that we should have a joint account, we both put our salary in, all the bills come out of that, and then we both have access to whatever's left over.
Ironically, if I pay half the rent and council tax (his suggested way) then I'm left with more disposable income than if I pay for a 1/3rd of all the household bills, and even more than if I were to contribute to things like loans for car/tv/credit cards that are solely in his name, which I would be contributing towards (in a way) if we do the joint account thing. The whole thing is bonkers.
DH just keeps saying there's no point in actually talking about it until there's money to sort out, but seeing as I'm due to start the job on 17th November and he's going away for a week soon after that for work, I think we need to get it sorted as soon as possible.
Thank you all for your patience and kindness - it's greatly valued! :)

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Butterflyface · 02/11/2014 17:11

oh, and I finally had my PIP assessment last week, so I should know the result in the second week of December (hopefully)!

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Butterflyface · 02/11/2014 17:14

If I get the standard rate, (which is pretty unlikely, but you never know!) then I shall definitely get myself a power scooter to have at work. I think I'll be better off driving door-to-door, but having a scooter there I think will help massively - I've contact Access to Work, but no reply yet!

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jollygoose · 02/11/2014 17:22

Sometimes seeing things written down helps to clarify things. I would be inclined to tell him that you have written a thread on mumsnet with many replies and would he like to read them. Hopefully he would be able to see what a knob he is being.

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Butterflyface · 02/11/2014 17:29

It's not like he's demanding that I give him all the money - I can see his pov, I just think he's not expressed it very well and it's come across like it's his DB's pov and attitude, but I don't think he can genuinely see how hurt I am.
He did make a joke about it earlier - he'd made a plate of sandwiches and put them all out to share. He'd gone out to the kitchen to get a drink for DS3, when I called out that I was pinching his last two sandwiches (which I thought were on his plate, rather than the joint plate). So he called out, No, that's fine, they're OUR sandwiches, not MY sandwiches. I just don't think he views it as being that serious, and thinks I've gone and blown it out of proportion.

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ChippingInAutumnLover · 02/11/2014 17:40

I think it's all one big fat mess tbh Grin

So, I think you should say to him that you are not sure if you misunderstood what he was saying or not, but that you need to understand his actual pov because you are very hurt by what you perceive his pov to be and can't believe he would actually feel that way, not after all of these years together.

Then ask him directly if he sees all the money coming in as joint or as his and yours. Don't beat about the bush, just speak clearly and directly. Don't be fobbed off by jokes or being told you are being silly (frankly I'd have lost my temper over that remark alone!) and don't allow him to paper over this crack because you are scared of his answer.

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Vivacia · 02/11/2014 17:41

Do. Not. Tell. Him. About. MN.

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Butterflyface · 02/11/2014 17:58

Halloween Grin Viv, he already knows I posted, that you all think he's being a bit of a knob, and that's what prompted the 'you've blown it out of proportion' comment - which I may well have done, but DH is so laid back about everything usually that he lives horizontally. So the fact that he even said this in this way suggests to me that there is something serious about his comments. He has been supporting me since 2009, when I left to go on mat leave, and because he's always earnt far more than whatever I've contributed in wages/mat. pay/CTC/CHB, and because we lost so much money over shithead xp, I think he (quite rightfully about the XP thing) feels very sore about it.
I'm sure it will just be a case of setting up a joint account and getting my wages put in there, so that he knows my money is going into the 'pot', but until we actually sit down and talk about it, or just do it, I think we'll both be wondering what's going to happen. He's next door in the other room working now, but if I get the opportunity I'll try to talk to him. He just thinks it's a bit irrelevant until the money's coming in, but I'm sitting here budgeting the next six months so that I know exactly how bad my account's going to get before it gets better. Of course it will be fine if I get PIP, but I'm just a bit skeptical still that I'll get it - I was turned down for DLA twice, so I'm a bit jaded.

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