But what if it is the other way round?

[sufferingtoo]

Namechanged as my DP knows my username. Long time lurker, occasional poster and definitely don't live under a bridge!

Finally got up the courage to post whilst reading a current thread about anger management and did not want to hijack it.

My current situation is almost exactly the same as the OP in that thread. When my DP gets annoyed or something is not going their way they get consumed with rage - there is no violence - just rage and then an extended period of sniping and comments to belittle me.

Our DC is only 4 and I am worried how this will affect him in the future.

The real sting in the tail is that I am DH and the problem is with DW.

For instance we had a very minor disagreement on Sat night that should have resulted in a 5 min husband/wife row at most.

For me it resulted in the standard intensely angry tirade of abuse about how rubbish I am, how she had wasted her life with me, etc. She literally looked like she is going to explode with anger. Sunday was complete scilence except for continued snide comments, Monday not much better and we almost had a civil conversation last night. I did asked "how am I meant to live like this" and got told "don't! just leave!".

Going on past form she will be nice as pie by this evening or tomorrow morning and it will be like it never happened.

Don't get me wrong - I have my failings (as we all do) but I don't think I deserve this.

The advice on here about taking the DC's and getting a better life is all well and good when aimed at the female partner but what can the father do? My plan seems to be to suck it up, protect my DC from it and get us both through this, while trying to get her to realise what she is doing and hopefully improve the situation.

Before you ask - it does seem she was treated much like this as a child - talks about how her parents always put her down etc.

Any advice on how to manage the situation would be gratefully appreciated.

[LurcioLovesFrankie]

Joan - if you read back, you will see that what we actually said was that he might be trying to find ways of staying in an untenable relationship because he was frightened that that might be the outcome, and we have tried to reassure him that this is not the automatic outcome, and given resources (Families need fathers was suggested) to check out where he stands. It is (given the fact that something like 9 out of 10 RP are female) a not unreasonable worry, and he does need reassurance and an open discussion of the issue, together with suggestions on how to get shared custody if he goes down the separation route (sorry for talking about you in the 3rd person, OP).

[fromparistoberlin]

It is absolutely possible for an abuser to stop being abusive

i do agree with that that OP.

I think some practical (yet not dramatic actions) are:

call mankind
keep a diary
dont accept behaviour, remove yourself and child when she does it
call her on it
and try to talk to her, if she wont talk, wont accept there is an issue then you need to make some decisions

and if she 100% blames it on you and refuses to engage then she IS abusive in my very humble opinion

[apermanentheadache]

I am completely with the people who think it is ridiculous to excuse this behaviour and attribute it to some mystery medical condition. There may be something medical going on, who knows, but unless it is something like dementia or psychosis you would surely expect some self-awareness and insight on the part of OP's partner.

[BitOutOfPractice]

If a woman had come on here, saying she was being verbally abused on a regular basis, and someone suggested it ws because of some mental or physical health reason they would be howled down and told to stop making excuses for the abuser and that that was not the woman's responsibility but the abuser's. If it is because of some mental or physical health condition, the abuser needs to take responsibility for it and get some help / treatment. The double standards really do these boards a disservice, they really do

FWIW my uncle was verbally and physically abused by his DW for years. Eventually she started on the kids too. It ws because she was a vile abusive person. No excuses. Just that. She scared the bejeezus out of me as a kid. Both of her children (my cousins) still suffered into adulthood as a result of what they suffered and witnessed. OP take heed

[Lazyjaney]

This is an unacceptable situation OP, ignore the apologists here. If the sexes were reversed they'd be telling you to LTB.

However, I suspect walking off with the kids is not an option unless you are very well prepared, so I think you have to lay your plans carefully. See a lawyer, speak to organisations' that help, go on support websites etc.

In the interim see if there is anything you can do in case it is illness/treatable etc, but you must see this as Plan B.

[joanofarchitrave]

Sorry Lurcio, I should have said that I completely agree with what you and Attila wrote. I was thinking of two other posts I believe, but really should have scrolled back to check more closely. Sorry OP.

[AtSea1979]

Sorry haven't read whole thread but sounds to me like PMT. She needs to get this addressed, keep a diary so you can see if there is a monthly pattern.

[rainbowsmiles]

Nobody is excusing anything.

The OP had not told us whether his wife apologises or recognises her behaviour is wrong. I've said all along this is key.

All I'm saying is it might be pmt. It happens once a month. It comes from nowhere and disappears the same way. She has no reason to feel unhappy or upset at husband. It Is a possibility people.

Even if it turns out she does have pmt it would still be described as abusive behaviour. But at least there may be a way to deal with it.

[BitOutOfPractice]

If there is a medical cause, she needs to address is and stop abusing her husband.

Abusive partners often apologise, beg forgiveness, promise it will never happen again...

And it doesn't disappear. It goes on for days and days. It's just not on

[livingzuid]

I am completely with the people who think it is ridiculous to excuse this behaviour and attribute it to some mystery medical condition. There may be something medical going on, who knows, but unless it is something like dementia or psychosis you would surely expect some self-awareness and insight on the part of OP's partner.*

No one is excusing behaviour. But undiagnosed a mental illness can wreak havoc. Your other part of your statement is also incorrect. There are numerous conditions that have a negative impact on behaviour. You only need to see the mental health board for examples of what people are struggling with.

Sorry op for the derail. It is apparent that you want to try to find a solution. There are some good suggestions here. But if she is sick in some way then she must acknowledge that she needs help and actively get professional support.

If she is a bully then you need to acknowledge you live with an abuser and take steps to protect you and your dc.

For me there is not enough info but clearly you are very unhappy and need to discuss this with her soon. Her reaction will be telling. Either way if she refuses to acknowledge the severity of her behaviour and is dismissive of your concerns then you need to consider what is best for you and your dc. Living with what you have now is not an option.

[badbaldingballerina123]

I don't agree with the ill thing at all , but there's an eAsy way to test this theory Op.

Next time she's ranting and is on the verge of exploding, go to the bathroom and set the alarm on your phone for ten minutes. Set the tone of the alarm to your usual ring tone. Let the alarm go off mid rant and say it's your friend , parents , or someone else she respects. answer the call briefly. See if she is so ill and out of control that she wants anyone else to hear her ranting.

My ex h was an abusive arsehole and would regularly rant at me , he had no point to make so would do the character assassination . I call it the list. On and on he would go until he had purged himself of his frustration or bad mood . When called on it he would claim he couldn't help it because he was so mad blah blah.

One time he was literally throwing things round the kitchen ranting . As I walked from the kitchen to the living room I passed the front door and knocked loudly on it. A completely calm nice Dh appeared to answer it despite the fact two seconds earlier he was so out of control.

Goes to show.

[anapitt]

I put up with similar shit for 16 years and got out of it last year.I am so ok I can't even tell you . ( I am a woman and shoulder ALL the financial responsibility for the family )

last month a mutual friend said " Mr Anapitt is a jekyl and Hyde"

Just like that it all fell into place. So glad not to be there. it's not ok to be like your wife/ my ex

[AmazingJumper]

The one difference I see in the way people are responding re this being from a man is that there are a lot more people saying about your DW that 'people can change, maybe she's just stressed'.

People hardly ever say that when someone's DH goes off on rages.

[Clouddancer]

The only reason I would say look at the dynamics of the marriage first is that I was in a very unhappy marriage, where latterly I shouted. It was not how I was before and it was the thing which made me think, what is going on here? I learnt to breathe through the flashpoints, stay calm, and then I could respond rationally. I started to recognise the control and the bullying, which was making me unable to breathe.

NOT saying the OP is like my ex. Just that if you are in an abusive relationship, you have three choices, you respond, you submit, or you leave. The dynamics are such that you don't see clearly what is going on, you feel like you are losing your mind.

Extrapolating from that, I could see a situation where the situation is a response to deep unhappiness on her part. This could be ascertained by talking, making changes (maybe a job? maybe he helps more?), going to counselling. Maybe that helps, if it doesn't, then he has time to seek legal advice and think about separation.

I fully accept that women can be abusers, my mother did enormous damage to her dc, incl. me, by similar behaviour to the OPs wife. But my father absolved himself of responsibility by drinking. A lot here depends on what happens next. FWIW, I do think nothing my dad did would have made my mum happy. On the other hand, who defines happy? They are still rocking on in their crazy, dysfunctional marriage 40 odd years later, they just have dc that don't speak much to them.

My only final point, is that I kind of wonder why he is posting on a forum he knows his wife uses. Is he not worried about her reaction if she sees it? I hope they both manage to sort it out one way or the other.

[Meerka]

It's not a bad idea to go to the doctor's just to check out if there is a biological cause or exacerbating factor. At least rule it out.

Then, whether something biological is found or not, it needs sorting for the OP's sake and for his son's sake.

Anythign that can help tackling this behaviour is a good idea.

[Hissy]

Another one here that's so glad you posted sufferingtoo.

I hope it helps you feel less alone. Mankind will help too.

None of any of this is your fault, you have done nothing wrong.

Ultimately you will have to face up to the fact that you do deserve better, and that there literally is no excuse for anyone to mistreat anyone else.

You really do need to consider that living with someone like this is harmful to all exposed to it. I strongly urge you NOT to leave any children behind, as they need normal parents, not abusive ones.

I don't think she'll ever change, nor will she ever seek help, because she is getting what she wants; to roar at and belittle her partner and terrify all those exposed to her outbursts.

The longer the dc stay in this, the greater the chance of them suffering exactly as you are in their adult relationships. Or worse: becoming an abuser like her.

This is the reason I left my ex. My son was happier within days, and is thriving. As am i.

I know hundreds of people who have left situations like yours, and not one of them ever regretted it.

You are the best chance your kids have. Please get them out of this.

[Lazyjaney]

^^
it's much more difficult for men to get kids out of these situations, so OP will need a lot more advice and careful planning than a woman would.

Get thee to a solicitor OP.

[Bewilderedotcom]

OP appears to be doing something very common when living with someone who is intermittently explosively abusive.

That is blocking out these times and living with 'good' times. After all it's 4 days out of 26 that this happens and if you can block those 4 days you can kid yourself (but only for a limited time) that things will change for the better, and after all, it wasn't THAT bad, was it?

To live like this saps your self esteem, damages your children and can affect future relationships.

You CANNOT live with this, you CANNOT sort it out on your own. There are only two options. Sort the problem out by getting professional help so that the W understands and stops her abusive behaviour, or leave.

[FaceDirectionOfTravel]

I am interested to read this as I fear that one of my (male) friends is in an abusive marriage. The dynamics are the same as with a male abuser in terms of power, control, being 'allowed' to do things, money, appearances, etc. Awful. But there is not much to be done from the outside except keep inviting him out, try keep in touch (ideally without having to see how W), etc.

Be brave OP. You are a person with rights who deserves respect.

[FaceDirectionOfTravel]

Oh, and I was awful to my husband while I had PTSD, also had an awful childhood etc, but I was very keen to try to get help for myself, could tell things weren't right, wanted to be a better person. When my husband would say, 'Please don't speak to me like that' I knew he was right, I knew I was unwell. Standing up to me was important for my recovery.

[FaceDirectionOfTravel]

Oh, and I was awful to my husband while I had PTSD, also had an awful childhood etc, but I was very keen to try to get help for myself, could tell things weren't right, wanted to be a better person. When my husband would say, 'Please don't speak to me like that' I knew he was right, I knew I was unwell. Standing up to me was important for my recovery.

[sufferingtoo]

Again thanks for the replys and thoughts. Long hard think last night and have decided best way ahead is to:

Start to keep a diary - looking for routines in the anger. I know a lot of you do not think it could be medical but I would never forgive myself if it was and I did not at least look into it.

I definitely think I am going to confront her as well - I personally think writing to her is best - it gives her time to think it through before responding(even if for a few minutes). As suggested I will see what the response is and if she even acknowledges that it is not acceptable.

Finally I will get myself prepared to finally call her on it - the answer to "well leave!" will be "that is what I intend to do".

These things are not resolved in a day and I now need to work through the next stages. Oh and don't worry DC comes first and I would never leave him too suffer!!

Finally there was a comment about posting if DW uses forum. She does not use MN but she does know my normal nick and I did not want to take any chance at all.

[rainbowsmiles]

Sufferingto, regardless of the reason your wife should not be treating you like this. I think a letter is a good idea but please be very clear that you are drawing a line. That the behaviour has to stop.

It really should be her who is bending over backwards to fix things.

I wish you the best of luck.

[Meerka]

suffering you sound a thoughtful and caring man. I really hope some of the feedback here can help.

A very leading question: do you still love her? (don't answer here, just posing the question!)


All the best

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

I do hope you talked to Mankind yesterday.

Be careful as to the location where this diary is or will be kept; if she finds it then all hell could break loose.

If she rips that letter up then you also have your answer as to what she thinks.

I would personally give myself a set time limit re your wife e.g two months and stick to it. She is not your project to figure out or just as importantly yours to rescue and or save from herself .