Me and my sister are at breaking point over her treatment of my nephew.

[AlmostToiletTrained]

Hi everyone.

I am a lurking occasional poster who could really do with some help. Or advice, or a kick up the backside?I?m not sure which to be honest. I didn't really know where to put this, so figured relationships was as good a place as any given the subject! Please feel free to move this if you think it would be better elsewhere.

This is probably going to be a long one, so than in advance if you make it to the end, I?ll try and keep it as brief as possible.

My sister and her partner had a baby almost three years ago. He is a complete joy. The problem is, they just have no interest. Neither of them work (not that this makes them bad people-just setting the scene) but sit around all day doing not much except for the baby?s dad smoking weed pretty much constantly. Their house is a health hazard, the little one?s bedroom is full of dirty nappies. I could go into more detail but not sure it's completely necessary to make my point.

My DP and I have our nephew as much as possible-we both work Monday-Friday but without fail pick him up every Friday and return him on Sunday evening. He comes on holiday with us and basically spends as much time as possible with us. I?m biased I know, but he is a relatively easy kid, and I love him so much. I dread Sunday evenings and taking him home. He also spends a LOT of time at a family friend?s house, to the point where my sister and her DP can go for two weeks without seeing him, as the family friend will have him when DP and I are at work, then we will take over Friday-Sunday.

I have tried everything I can think of to kick their arses into gear, but as much as I love my sister, my priority is now that little boy. Some of the things he comes out with now he can communicate better are heart-breaking.

I don?t know what to do. I feel so stuck. I don?t want to kick up so much of a fuss that they take him away from me-but I know this is so selfish I?m cringing just typing it. I also can?t sit by any longer and do nothing. Please someone point me in a direction that might help. I?m lost and just want to make things better him and I feel like I need someone from the outside looking in to help me decide what to do as I?m so confused and can?t see straight because I?m in the thick of it.

This is way more concise than I thought it would be-and thanks in advance for any replies and I?m sorry if I don?t reply for a while as I?m a wee bit busy this evening. I will be back as soon as I can, as I say, I?m a long time lurker and can't keep away!

[yamsareyammy]

I think they will too MrsDeVere.
Cant exactly say why, but for possible various reasons.
They may want control, bloody mindedness, irritation with the op, shame, etc.

[zippey]

Hello, and apologies in advance if some of this stuff has been said before. You sound like a really nice person, and it is great that DN has people with his interest at heart. Its heartbreaking to hear of the things he has been saying.

Maybe your sister and her DP will be okay in letting you take DN on. I think its important to try and get the extended family onside with you as well, so having an informal discussion with them about the situation and what is best for DN. I would also make it clear that your sister and DP could have as much access as possible as well to DN.

That's one scenario. Another part of me says you should take another route, because what happens if they have another child? Do you look after them as well? It sounds as if your sister and DP are pretty immature or going through hard times, but DN should be number one priority.

Good luck.

[Twirlyhot]

They might be happy enough not to see him for two weeks at a time but if he was officially not living with them they'd lose money.

[Want2bSupermum]

Reading through peoples responses, I would agree that you need to get other family members involved. If the end goal is for you to have custody of your nephew then it might be an idea to have an agreement drawn up using a solicitor. I don't know if you need to go through social services. If you get SS involved it will only put up their backs as they will be labelled as bad parents. While they are bad parents, labelling them as such might result in your nephew being stuck in a horrible environment.

[MadameDefarge]

I think it would be a good idea to talk to the folk on the adoption board. There is a little boy who is attached to his parents, however crap they might be. any adoption needs to be managed very carefully. Just whisking him away would be catastrophic. You need support in managing the process, if that is what ends up happening. Any court or SS would take a very dim view of an informal adoption because the needs of the child come first. I think you might kind of already think of him as yours anyway, which simply is not the case. Some counselling might help you sort out your feelings and find a way forward which is best for dn.

Talk to ss. be matter of fact. express your concerns, and out of that will arise the fact you already have care of him a great deal, as do another couple. then see how it unfolds. they need not know where the concern came from. And once dn is on the radar, they won't be able to play silly buggers, hopefully. maybe they will step up and get their act together, which would be the best outcome for dn. If not, the other options will be considered in due course. Remember you might well have your own baby in a couple of years, and it might change things and not for the better.

[yamsareyammy]

Wasnt going to link this, but think I had better, since posters are saying about informal arrangements, and I am not sure that what they are saying is all factually correct.

<a class="break-all" href="http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20130401151715/www.education.gov.uk/publications/eOrderingDownload/Family%20and%20Friends%20Care.pdf" rel="nofollow noindex" target="_blank">webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20130401151715/www.education.gov.uk/publications/eOrderingDownload/Family%20and%20Friends%20Care.pdf

I dont understand it all fully, but I think the link is informal arrangements, but still with some local authority involvement.

Obviously dont know which route the op may go down, but I would hate for others to be lurking and reading, and they themselves read wrong information on here, on such an important issue. Which has such important legal and family ramifications.

[Rossi24601]

Thanks again everyone for your posts.

It's so hard to know what to do - we don't want to remove him from his parents, ideally, we want them to give a toss about him and buck their ideas up. But, if that's not going to happen - then I think he needs out of there - but of course they need a chance to prove they really are not willing to change.

I phoned them last night to see how he was and found he was at this family friend's house again - he's been there since we dropped him there on Sunday and we'll end up with him at the weekend again.

We've printed out a load of info from the links you've put on here and last night we called NSPCC to see what they thought. They said they'd urge us to ring SS and let them make a full assessment of the situation. They reassured us that SS wouldn't just sweep in and take him into care - but would work with the parents to try and improve the situation.

[yamsareyammy]

I think one of the problems of going down an informal route is that the op could find herself back where she started.
She could take her nephew, her sister changes her mind, or chucks out her partner etc, and suddenly demands her nephew back. This could happen at age 5, 7, 10 or whatever. And there I would have thought, be nothing that the op could do. The child could be very confused and uprooted. And the sister could slip back to her old ways.

Better to have ss involvement in this case, imo.
Maybe the sister will then do things to improve matters for the child, and maybe herself.

[Rossi24601]

If we went to SS, it'd be anonymously - but I think suspicious would be very strong that it was us.

Agree totally with you about informal route - if we did it informally, we would certainly have it all done legally and officially so that nothing could come back and change things in the future.

[Ipsissima]

I believe someone up-thread identified a hidden pitfall, in that one of the motivating factors for the parents may be the CB income.
Tragically, they may well be OK about the child living elsewhere if the money keeps rocking in.It happens a lot where drugs are involved and may well be the stumbling block to any informal arrangement.

It would be illegal for them to continue collecting if the child isn't resident .....but it begs the question as to whether you would be prepared to "pay" to have this child living with you. That said, if you (quite illegally) agree that they can keep collecting, and as far as the world is concerned it is being given to you ....but isn't actually ...................

It wouldn't look good - any way up - but might be the one thing that gains you want you want.

[laeiou]

Have the parents been like this from the child's birth? If so, isn't their health visitor involved?

I would contact the HV in the first instance rather than SS. The HV should know, and should be working with the parents.

Also, if you're serious about having the child long-term then why not rearrange things now so you start having him midweek. You'll have to do this at some point, why not start the planning or actually provide a day or two now ? It'll also give you an insight into the reality of what you're toying with. Will you be able to provide childcare on an informal basis or do your work situations mean that you need official status so you can ccover appointments, time off when the child is ill etc? From what you say, you should be able to suggest some midweek help to the parents.

[MadameDefarge]

the reality is this child would best staying with his parents if they can up their game. For this they clearly need support. encouraging people to sneak a baby into their home by the back door is not going to end well, most especially for this little boy.

Rather than taking dn more, I would suggest maybe some kind of family and friend intervention, with an independent mediator to outline your concerns, and then withdraw from making it so easy for them not to step up.

[cestlavielife]

speak to baaf
www.baaf.org.uk/info/kinship-care-and-special-guardianship

[Rossi24601]

A few responses:

CB income - yes I can fully see that if they realised that CB would disappear, they'd not be so keen to hand him over. But, I'm really hoping this just kicks them into gear and makes them make changes.

Yes, it has been like this since he was very small. We didn't start having him straight away (apart from the odd day), but it's now he has got older that we're with him nearly every weekend (and would be lot more if we didn't have to work in the week). As for Health Visitor - I don't have a clue what they know or think.....I think as he is healthy enough physically and they go to their appointments - they don't know anything of this.

As for midweek care - he would have to go into some kind of childcare in the week - I can't go into too many details on here, but it's not something that would be an issue for us.

MadameDefarge - The ideal is they get themselves into gear and step up as you say. Knowing them though - this isn't likely. We've gone over and over should we just not have him for weekends, let him stay at home but the reality is 1 of 2 things:
1 - Someone else would take him (big family, lots of other people)
2 - He'd stay at home, get shouted at for everything and generally have a rubbish time and be resented.

NatashaBee - Speaking to family friend - we have done this and they agree things are not right. Perhaps we should raise some more serious concerns with him and get them onside - that's a good idea actually. Thanks.

Thanks again for all your replies - we'll keep you all posted.

[laeiou]

A HV or midwives most likely visited them at home when the baby was born. This is to identify exactly what you describe and put support in place. I again suggest you talk to the HV. Just contact the boy's GP surgery if you don't know who the HV is.

[LifeIsSoDifferent]

I really hope you work something out for your DN sake. Poor boy

[lunar1]

I hope you find a way to help your dn, I can't imagine how hard it must be to know what you are sending him back to.

[joblot]

Have you sought legal advice? A special guardianship order may be best. With a core assessment there is no guarantee the sw will conclude this child is being abused/further action by ss is needed. Proving neglect is hard and parents lie which makes things harder. So often there's no further action following a core.

I'd recommend a legal approach