Moving on from pil anger

[ledkr]

Hi all,i never thought about posting on here for advice but here goes.
Some of you maybe aware of my story but ill try to be brief.
I had dd 7 months ago,my 5th and dh's first baby. Pils live away and when visit arent helpfull and quite demanding even when i was heavily pg.
As the birth approached i discussed with dh about them being able to vist after the birth (elective section) but that i didnt want them staying overnightuntill at least the following weekend.
Dh aggreed and told pils towards the end of the pg.

I was due to have her on the mon which was great as pils couldnt come till the following weekend due to work.I had her earlier on the Thursay and so told dh they could visit in hospital as pil were understandably reluctant to wait until the following weekend.

They live 2 hrs awat so stayed on the Friday night then could visit at 3 the folloing day,i was going to come home after the visit which ended at 7.

They went off into town and then arrived at the hospital late at 5!
Then stayed but didnt leave so i started getting ready to leave,still sat there,i even had to ask them to go outside the cutain whilst mw checked me.

I was crying and said to the mw,i just felt tired and wanted to go home,mw sadi to pils "i think she just needs some peace and quiet" Mil said "yes we will just see them home safely and leave them in peace"

We all left the hospital at 8 I had to wrestlre my baby off her to dress her and she told dh and fil to walk on ahead with baby as i was slow.

They arrived at the house just before us,were inside with slippers on and blow up bed still up from preveious night.

I had told dd1 that when i came home we could have fish and chips and cuddle up on sofa with new baby.

Without me knowing Mil asked dh if she should get take away and i said well i had promised dd that we could have some but that we had planned on having our first night home as just us,(as he had pointed out repeatedly) Mil then said they may as well stay as it was late (her fault not ours)
Dh again said that they could come next weekend but t the moment we wanted to be on our own and that i needed time to recover form op and get to know baby.

Mil then stormed into the kitchen ranting to fil that "we have to go,we will have to eat in the car" Dh offered a snadwhich and she screamed "a sandwhich? we need more than a sandwhich we are hungry"
I was still sat on the sofa holding baby with my coat and boots on.
Dh lookd as if he was going to collapse so i said "just make them something to eat"

I then went to my friends down the rd with dd1 and 2 to have a cry.

Got back at 9 and they stayed until gone 10 watching tv even tho it was clear we wanted them to go.
Left reluctantly and we were up getting bottles sterilised and prepared until 11pm.

The next day baby was rushed into hospital with cleft palate,jaundice and pneumnia and pils came no where near us,didnt even call me to see how i was feeling.

The problem is now that i cant get past this.Much as i try i cant like pils and am angry with them and dh for it all. I feel i was denied my homecoming and dh and i will never have another child.
They still come to stay and do nothing apart from ask when the next meal is and dont do a thing with the baby.

It may sound ridiculous but i am struggling to move on from this,i have had some pnd which isnt necessarily due to this,dh is very guilty and blames himself for not being more forcefull but i dont see why he should have to be,he made himself clear and that should be enough.

I dread them coming and just feel hatefull towrads them.

How do i get past this as i know i have to for everyones sake and i dont want to go thru life with this anger.

Sorry its long.

[GetAwayFromHerYouBitch]

I remember your story ledkr.

Just want to add my support. No words of wisdom, but I do feel for you

[ledkr]

Thanks.They managed not to come last night,dd was overwhelmed from all the visiting so im glad we stuck to our guns.

[WhoseGotMyEyebrows]

Sorry about my huge rant.

[ledkr]

No i love to hear others rant,at times i have felt a hatred previously reserved for my ex h.
Tis not helped by the fact they are so bloody formal and boring,not passionate about anything and devoid of any emotion. Completely unlike me.All they want to do is sit around drinking tea or coffee or eating. We have to plan dinner at lunchtime and breakfast takes hours.
Cereal than a long shower then coffee and toast,my friend says its as if they think they are on holiday.
Because im more common down to earth i cant be myself at all around them so visits are strained for me,when they come i feel as if ive not had a weekend. They also dont know when to leave. One sunday they were still sat here at 7pm.Dh asked them when they were going,they replied "after dinner" I had cooked a roast lunch!!

[WhoseGotMyEyebrows]

Blimey!

[mummytime]

Okay first can I give you lots of sympathy.
But can I ask if you've considered getting some counselling to really work through it? Whilst talking here might help, I do feel that there could be lots of things tied up in this (for instance your babies ill health afterwards). A good counsellor can help you untie the knots and get things straight in your mind, so enabling you to set clear boundaries on your PILs. If you talk to your GP he may be able to get you some counselling or at least recommend a good one.

[ledkr]

yes,it would probably be usefull as i feel i go on about it to my friends.
I will ask gp this week. Thanks.

[veryworriedme]

Ledkr, I don't have anything helpful to say but just wanted to say poor you, how awful. Thanks for referring to this thread - it has made me a bit more aware of potential problems. Can't get over the sandwich bit - your mil has something missing in the compassion department.

[2rebecca]

If they are visiting you then surely the meals are done your way?
Perhaps the reason thatyou dread their visits so much is that you pander to them too much. I would have breakfast as you normally do, making clear that in your house you have a quick breakfast and then clear up and get on with other stuff (or whatever you do) and do an evening meal as you normally do. If you were visiting them then you would expect to fall in with their meal plans, but if they visit you then they should fall in with your meal plans.
Start planning outings for when they come so the day can't revolve around meals, and clear up the breakfast pots after cereal making clear you don't want to spend all day in the kitchen. Difficult if you've always pandered to them in the past but I do feel that if people visit me then meal times are on my schedule, obviously making allowances for small children who may eat at different times and food preferences.

[ledkr]

rebecca when i first met them i was obviously the perfect hostess and as i only had a 5yr old and i love cooking so turned out lovely meals ect. The problem i think was that they enjoyed themselves too much,i had a spare room right next to a bathroom and they really enjoyed themselves.
Reality hit home when i had avery difficult pg,i had a nt scan in Harley st and they pressed very hard causing my tummy to hurt loads the next day,this coincided with a visit and they were thrown as i didnt move.Fil particularly kept asking when meals would be but i liked them at that point and just ignored him and referred to the chippy,looking back now they did nothing to help or had any sympathy.
This went on thru the pg and that was when i queried the upcoming birth as could fortell problems.

In the mornings when they stay they get up around 9 and have coffees/I have usually been up ages and have had bfast and am showering whilst baby sleeps so i leave dh to it. Fil has about 2 massive bowls of mixed cereals and by the time i come down are onto drinks again.About 11 they start on the toast and then about 12.30 are asking if they can make sandwhiches. I used to do a big lunch but fil was so greedy cutting huge chunks of cheese and grabbing the last slice of bread.
After lunch arounf 3 they have cake which they go off and buy (and take home if any left) haha then about 5 they ask what is for dinner?
We dont eat untill late at the weekend cos i like to get the baby to bed and have a civilised dinner for once.We dont go out as they never offer to pay and we end up spending a fortune.
I know i have to take control and have ben over the last few visits.Last time i went out and had my hair done and then at bathtime i suggested mil bath baby as she never sees her,she did and seemed to enjoy it.
I told them at lunchtime i was cooking later too.

They are very thick skinned tho. One Sunday when dd was 5 weeks.they had been there since the Friday and we had told them that they would need to go on the Sunday as my friends were coming to cook me lunch and see the baby-all arranged before they asked to visit.
Dh went to work at midday and remeinded them they needed to get going as i had friends coming.
They sat there untill 4 o,clock.I didnt offer drinks and hardly spoke and kept looking out of the window for my friends.
It was very awkward as my friends didnt feel as if they could start cooking with them here as it seemed rude not to offer any and there wasnt enough.You would have had to be very stupid to not pick up on the atmosphere,i am convinced mil did it on purpose to show who is boss.
Dh was fuming as he had for once been very assertive.

[WhoseGotMyEyebrows]

2rebecca Completely agree with that. If you've always done it their way it will take some balls at first, so head down just get on with it!

[WhoseGotMyEyebrows]

Sorry x post.

Wow is your FIL very large? Sounds like they never stop eating.

What happened in the end with your friends? Did they cook for you? I suppose you could have tried saying (or your friends) "oh sorry didn't realise you were going to be here, there isn't enough food for you as well". I know though that it's much harder when you're in the situation.

[Tianc]

Your mother is smack on. You're sending completely the wrong message by making excuses.

I think you and DH need to set those boundaries up and then communicate them to the ILs. Firmly. Nicely if you like, but firmly.

I too am at the "spending 2 days trying to persuade them not to visit." DH needs to learn to say "No", and that be the end of it. In fact, while you may get a lot out of counselling to deal with your anger, I can't help feeling your family would benefit most if it was DH who had the counselling, to rethink the dynamic of who is in charge of his life/home - himself or his parents. The thing that really stood out from your birth threads was that you yourself understood, expected and were prepared for what would happen with ILs, and DH blew it by being utterly unable to say no to his parents (specifically his mother?).

If you can crack that one, maybe that would help with putting to bed your entirely justified anger about the past. Because surely continuing to deal with the same ongoing IL behaviour isn't doing any good at all to your "letting go".

[Tianc]

Sorry, x-post.

[GetAwayFromHerYouBitch]

I think it is a terrible shame that you have to set such boundaries - seems to me they've shown their true colours when the chips are down. But you will feel better if you start to see them as deficient in the empathy department and needing things spelled out to them.

I also second counselling. I think it will make you feel so much better. And sessions with your DH too, as Tianc says

[2rebecca]

I'm not sure they are thick skinned, more that they have a total lack of emotional intelligence, very little empathy and are poor at picking up nonverbal signals.
In some ways they seem thin skinned, in taking everything personally.

It does sound as though strong verbal signals are necessary, not giving them the silent treatment and looking out of the window, they either don't pick those signs up or choose to ignore them.

"please can you leave by 2pm" "sorry but could you go now, I told you I have people coming this afternoon and I'd like to have a bit of time to myself before they arrive" and clear instructions like that are necessary.

You are presuming they are as intuitive as you are.
They obviously aren't, spell everything out to them.

[ledkr]

do you know what?you are right,i am going to be much more assertive,in many ways im the same as dh in that i dont want to upset anyone.
It has been suggested by a very experienced friend that they maybe on the spectrum,as the being unable to read non verbals is the problem.The day my friends were coming i was stomping about the house clearly irritated and parctically ignored them for ages,fil said "is it ok to make some coffees?" i said a blunt ok and didnt accept one.
At lunchtime he said "is it ok to make some sandwhiches?" i replied *well ok,if ive got any bread left?",id have been off like a shot.
They are avery close extended family and get together loads for birthdays etc,i mean most weeks. The partners of bil and sil seem to get trampled on as well,ive been with pil when they decide on a whim to vist sil and her dp on a bank holiday.They were in pj's in the dark probably having a dvd/shagging day but we all trapsed in,her dp went off quickly after,neither bil or sil partners attend all the family functions very often either,i have a feeling im not alone.
We had a romantic weeknd away once and they turned up twice in 5 days-dh's fault they knew where we were,i was in the hot tub in a bikini and they just stood there staring at me.I made several attempts to get them to move on "have alook around the lodge its lovely-still stood there,i had to get out under their gaze.
They came again the next day and then on the third they rang to ay they were coming again. I opened some wine,stripped off,lit a fag and hopped into the tub,told dh they could come but i was on holiday and would act accordingly-he rang and told them not to come.

[waterrat]

Ledkr - you are a saint for putting up with them! But I think perhaps that as you say, you have been using techniques on them that would make sense to you - but they are not people who think like you. It's that difference between askers and guessers isn't it.

Key to it is being prepared to accept them being upset sometimes, but staying calm and polite and never backing down. I think that if someone like your DH grows up in this environment it must be really crushing, and give him a deep fear of upsetting them - you then pick up on that and internalise the fear of 'upsetting mum ' . But as long as you are being reasonable and polite - then their upsetness has to be something they deal with - and you simply dont waste time or energy worrying about it.

If people are tough with them, and very very very clear - ie. as someone said, 'okay, so sorry, but you'll have to go now my friends are coming and we've got some personal stuff to talk about, one of them is having a hard time ' etc...or 'gosh, we'll have to be rude and say dont come today, we are busy' ..sugar the pill but be very clear - if after that, they are upset - then you simply let them be. Keep repeating - but sorry, we made it clear. Then stop engaging.

As you said above, taking two days to get a message over is simply you torturing yourself. You say no, no no. No is a complete sentence. Be polite - but don't over justify.

It may help you move forward if you see them as lacking in emotional intelligence rather than cruel. And I think once you are more in control and begin to stop them having things their way, you will find it easier to let the past go.

[ledkr]

Its funny cos i noticed other areas which are alien to me.Dh auntie had breast cancer recently and as a survivor myself i wanted to contact her,dh and his parents were saying oh no its private etc,i wrote to her and she was delighted.They seem to live in lala land and only like the good things and cant deal with anything other than normality.Hence coing no where near the baby when she was very ill and being reluctant to talk about it since.
Its the "reasonableness" i struggle with,ie,should they be able to come more,was i selfish in not wanting them to stay after the birth etc. should they be able to come on our holidays,stay when i have plans?Is it me>Deep down i know i am right but our family is very different so i nevr know for sure.
God im boring myself now.

[GetAwayFromHerYouBitch]

no - you aren't boring. You are just trying to make sense of it. You have to trust your gut. If things don't feel reasonable to you, then they are not reasonable. You have as much right to your feelings as they do to their harrumphing.

[ledkr]

What a great way of putting it. So true. My friend said to me the other week,that it doesnt matter if you are right or wrong,if you dont feel like them coming then thats ok.

[PercyPigPie]

Ledkr - I honestly don't know how you put up with them.

I find the not be able to cope with the bad stuff a bit weird actually - it sounds like they have fairly big issues.

[blackeyedsusan]

so sorry that you have to go through this. I had similar with our wedding preparations, they were a bloody nightmare and overode everything that h and I discussed together. h made it worse because he caved in everytime there was prerssure, and even claimed some of his ideas were mine and he didn't like them after all. going back to read how I can begin to let go several years on. ( think it would have been better if there had not been several more incidents)

[blackeyedsusan]

you were totally being reasonable not wanting them to come after you had had a major operation.

it is the lack of respect. you say what you want/need to happen and they question it/ try and batter down your no, like whiny children. they are probably used to getting their own way every time. one of my ils is used to getting their own way too, and even when something is impossible still keep on about it with h enabling them.

you are fortunate that your h has apologised, and can see he has not been strong enough to stand up to them. he is wrong to completely blame himself. he has been brought up to comply and it must be hard for him. perhaps if he saw it as something that they did to both of you, rather than something he let happen to you it would help him to come to terms with it.

oh and you are not boring, you have started a thread that let's others see that they are not the only ones struggling with letting go, and given others hope that they can get past this.

[ledkr]

I think that is the main problem you know,he understands why i dont want them here at certain times but he actually doesnt mind himself,so where he will be sticking up for me and what i wnt it probably comes across as feeble. He is naturally a very laid back character,never gets stressed but anything and is easy going.It took me alot of getting used to at first as im the opposite.
It did feel good when we spoke about it after and he was upset and guilty for what had happened but totally blames himself which is unfair cos i heard himstand up to them and he was ignored.
Dont even get me going about the wedding-oh alright then.We had booked to get married xmas eve just me and him my 5yr old dd and 2 friends,no outfits just home for xmas after. He felt bad at the last min and so told them,they said they wanted to come,he said no they kept on he gave in. This then meant i had to ask my parents who both are remarried,2 of my sons had work and couldnt get out of it,and we had to dress up and do something afterwards-i think thats when the rot set in,they want to be involved in everything their kids do totally oblivious to the fact they also need time as a family.
Im not sure i give hope tho,i definately havent moved on,i feel a rocky road is ahead.