Our primary school says if children need medicine at specific times 'pop' in & DIY

[wonkywillow]

Surely this penalises busy working parents, with occupations where they can't just 'pop' in? Or a parent who simply has other pressing commitments..

Can schools actually do this? They seem to be negating their responsibilities towards providing education and support for children with long term medical conditions that require regular medication.

[wonkywillow]

ex, at only 9, I can easily imagine how difficult this condition is to come to terms with. I remembering hearing someone speak publicly about how the medication makes them feel. They didn't like it. Medication is often reserved for school hours to avoid overdosing on it.

[wonkywillow]

Changed, what makes you say this. Do you have evidence of a ruling? From what I have read, from the D of E, schools are duty bound to make provision for the administering of medication to their pupils who require it.

[TinaMena]

It is a parent's responsibility to medicate their child not a school's.
The school shouldn't pick and chose what it is responsible for. If they have children on site, then they need to make arrangements for their care.

[Earslaps]

Our school just asks for a form to be filled in and they will then administer medicine as required.

Ds has recently been diagnosed with ADHD and we're getting used to remembering to take it. Unlike the boy above he is more than happy to have it as he likes how he can concentrate with it. He takes it at breakfast time.

We have forgotten a couple of times on 'those' mornings. The school said they were more than happy for us to keep a few tablets there just in case we forget at home one day. I just need to fill in form and call them if they need to give him one. They will be kept in the locked cabinet and counted in and out.

[exLtEveDallas]

That may well be the case wonky, I sure you are right, but it still doesn't mean anyone on staff is required to administer the medicine the child needs. Especially not after the parent went after them so viciously.

[exLtEveDallas]

And wonky, that gov doc says it is not generally acceptable practice to
that doesn't make it a ruling, more of an advisory.

If a HT has no-one on staff willing to administer and if the union says it cannot be added to an existing job description then the HT either has to: wait for a member of staff to leave and change the replacements job description before they start, or employ someone solely to administer - and who would want a job like that?

[wonkywillow]

and who would want a job like that?

HCPs deal with these issues all the time.

And wonky, that gov doc says it is not generally acceptable practice to
that doesn't make it a ruling, more of an advisory.

A school would have to have very good reason not to comply with the statutory guidance advise. Not having a very good reason would reflect extremely badly upon the school in question.

[BackforGood]

School liaise with the school nursing team to ensure provision is available.

Ha Ha Ha Ha.
Which school Nursing team is this exactly ? The poor understaffed nurses covering so many schools they only actually get to go to CP meetings and to issue the occasional vacinations when there is a 'push' on a particular vaccine, leaving them no time to do anything else they wish they could do, and schools would love them to do, I presume.

Schools apply for additional and emergency funding when they are spending over the stated threshold on additional medical needs in order to cater for them
Schools used to be able to do this, then the Gvmnt decided it wanted to break up Local Authorities altogether, and LAs were no longer allowed to direct the funding for SEN/D to the schools the children with SEN/D were actually attending, but they had to put all funds into schools in the first place, regardless of where the children were attending - yeah - go figure the logic. If you can get the LA to issue an EHCP, and if that EHCP deems it will cost more than £6K to meet the child's needs, then you can get top up funding, but children requiring medication won't necessarily fall into that category.

The reason most teachers won't take on the responsibility of having to issue medication at set times in the day, is - apart from the obvious point of not being medically trained - the fact that they don't get a period in the day when they are not doing several other things, juggling to keep all the balls in the air at one time. There is no way when I was in school I could commit to remembering to administer medication at a set time each day, and be able to do it. Administering an epi-pen is not comparable at all - that is dealing with an emergency as and when it happens - part and parcel of being a first aider. Keep in mind that First aiders at work aren't allowed to administer medicines even to competent and coherent adults.

[FitBitFanClub]

schools are duty bound to make provision for the administering of medication to their pupils who require it.

Could that not include asking the parent to come in and administer it?

I had a child last year who had a very severe medical condition. We all needed several training sessions in order to be skilled enough to concoct the potion (yes, not "just a tablet or 5ml spoonful), and it had to be given at 10 to 12 each day. Not 10 past or 20 to; bang on (nightmare time of the day in terms of busy-ness in class). We also had to assess if a top-up was required at any other point in the day, according to the child's "look" or spirits. Huge responsibility.

Fortunately, nothing has ever gone wrong, and the child and parents were absolutely lovely and appreciative. People were willing to take that responsibility, therefore. At any signs of stroppiness or what ExLt encountered, I'm sure volunteers would have been harder to find.

That's why I suggested you tread carefully, OP. You need those staff-members on-side.

[OddBoots]

This is at a time when schools are (according to the BBC today) warning parents that they may have to reduce the hours they are open because they can't afford to run 5 full days per week. I think that will have an effect on working parents too.

[FitBitFanClub]

HCPs deal with these issues all the time.

School staff (teachers or TAs) are not HCPs and presumably never wanted to be (or, you know, they'd be doing it).

[grasspigeons]

To be honest, I am intrigued what 'governing bodies' do when a child has an individual health care plan in place requiring the administering of medicine and no one volunteers to do it. The statutory guidance is clear that arrangements have to be made, that parents cant be compelled and staff cant be required. It really doesn't give any guidance on what alternative arrangements can take place. I've not know it come up in practice as normally a TA or office staff volunteers.

[FitBitFanClub]

In my school, the HT would do it. Assuming she's on the premises.

[wonkywillow]

, and LAs were no longer allowed to direct the funding for SEN/D to the schools the children with SEN/D were actually attending, but they had to put all funds into schools in the first place, regardless of where the children were attending - yeah - go figure the logic.

This was done because schools were, under the old system, able to apply for and retain additional funding with little accountability as to where it was being spent. And this was, notoriously, not on the children who had Statements. So many were applying for additional funding some LAs retained more funding, holding it themselves so they could apply it to Statements, and it was dedelegated away from the schools. There was no more funding given to schools as a whole. The AWPU went down as a result and the threshold of additional needs required for a Statement went down also. Along with more funding being spent on the bureaucracy for all this.

Now schools have to put their 'money where their mouth is' so to speak. They have to spend out of their own budgets for low level additional needs. Accountability is absolutely a requirement to gain any additional funding. No money can be wasted on ineffectual provision.

[Agapanthus1984]

When I was a teacher I wasn't permitted to give any child medication as I'm not a qualified medical professional and therefore not insured to dispense medication. Not even a paracetamol. If a pupil needed medication it was up to parents or carers to organise it themselves because of the legal responsibility.

[wonkywillow]

Could that not include asking the parent to come in and administer it?

No because that would mean the school weren't making provision. The parent would be.

[FitBitFanClub]

When my child needed medication (as she did at various points throughout her school career), I considered it my responsibility as her parent to give it to her. As and when the school agreed to do so (as, fortunately, they did) I was profoundly grateful and appreciative.

[brizzledrizzle]

I often think parents are unaware how very very short of cash schools are.

I think most of us have an idea but to be honest I don't give a damn how short of money they are because a child's right to be safe at school and not to suffer a very serious life threatening medical emergency is more important than anything else. I've seen a child in that state and seen what happens when the school staff have no idea what to do and it's terrifying.

[Naty1]

With the adhd meds surely 9am and 2pm could have been worked around outside school hours providing no before/after clubs.
With more parents working there is a need for sick rooms and school nurses/nit nurses etc more than ever. Ironic really

[FitBitFanClub]

I think most of us have an idea but to be honest I don't give a damn how short of money they are because a child's right to be safe at school and not to suffer a very serious life threatening medical emergency is more important than anything else. I've seen a child in that state and seen what happens when the school staff have no idea what to do and it's terrifying.

Well, that begs the question as to why you'd entrust your child to their care at all, then.

[Dermymc]

The schools are making provision, the provision requires parents (or another adult) to administer the medicine.

The note on the DoE website is clearly advisory guidance, not legal or bound by statute.

If you react like this to school in real life j feel sorry for your dcs teachers!

[wonkywillow]

That's why I suggested you tread carefully, OP. You need those staff-members on-side.

Fit, do you see how this puts a parent, who has to advocate for a child with additional needs, in an impossible position, if a school is not making the provision they are legally bound to provide and which the child is legally entitled to? Beyond being polite, a parent cannot do much more without being complicit with an organisation which is ultimately failing their child.

[Dermymc]

Brizzle you sound delightful.

You should give a damn. Who is going to administer the medicine and face a potential lawsuit from someone like you?

I wouldn't (I am a teacher).

[Dermymc]

Wonky they aren't legally required to....

[wonkywillow]

The schools are making provision, the provision requires parents (or another adult) to administer the medicine.

No, they are not. Can you not see how this is discrimination against the child who requires that medication?