A thread for 8+ Westminster, St Paul's, Sussex House, Kings etc

[user8957365]

Merry Christmas!
Just the small matter of getting through the 8+ exams and wondered if there are other parents out there who might be interested in joining this thread.
Did any of your sons sit Kings in December? How did they find it? Apparently only 14 places going - gulp!
How are you preparing for St Paul's etc? If they are parents who have already been through the process and can offer any advice it will be very gratefully received.
Cheers

[Onebusymother1]

Indeed 😁😁😁
Do you know whether they mix up the classes with the current Y3? I think so as I believe each boy is paired with a buddy .
My son is so excited but I think it’s mainly because of the giant playground and football at break time. X

[heffalump12]

Interested in the comment below re birth months.

Does anyone know if SP/WUS/KCS are full of autumn birthday boys? Or is there a fair adjustment for birth month? At 6 I would expect this to make a difference still.

I have a three year old DS with an offer at a pre prep which sends 50% of its boys to these three schools, but wondering whether it's worth pursuing for my spring born or whether he's better off at a different school which will prepare for 13+.

[hhks]

heffalump12 , I would say summer boys are at disadvantage clearly. I heard from various sources that those schools all prefer bigger boys, as maturity is a key factor in their definition of learnability.
I agree with the argument that all boys invited for interview should have already passed the written exams, but summer boys need to work a lot harder than the autumn boys to reach the same standard. 8-10 months extra preparation time is huge in this race.
50% to the top three? WCPS?

[heffalump12]

Yep. Big bias towards KCS obviously.

Not sure if it's worth the pressure if he's going to be at such a disadvantage just due to birth month.

[hhks]

Spring is not too bad, there are July and August boys even.

Two things I didn't like about WCPS,

1. there is no lunch.
   
2. there is no second chance. you have to leave at 7+, as the school doesn't have year 3. if failed, you will find yourself in a very awkward situation where you need to find a school to study one term before 8+.
   
   But obviously all families in WCPS believed their boys will make it!

[heffalump12]

Thanks hhks!

I know, no lunch .

I think I'll only get my head around WCPS if there is a bankable and practical alternative at 7+, and unfortunately it seems most of the alternatives are a coach journey away for us. Oh well we still have a couple of months to mull it over.

Congrats to all those with offers on this thread, and fingers crossed for waiting list movement.

[Onebusymother1]

HHKs I agree completely. You get boys have a much tougher ride especially at 7+ when the difference in maturity and intellect can be vast between a summer born and autumn born baby. Slightly better at 8+ and by 11+ I think the gap has pretty much narrowed but not completely eradicated.
Some schools like St Paul’s and Kings adjust the reasoning paper because they recognise this gap in intellectual maturity and they want to identify boys with potential but sadly no slack is cut for maths paper. WUS incidentally do not age adjust at all.

My son is at a pre prep that is probably the largest feeder into SP and WU in London. It is interesting to note that all the boys (my son included) offered WUS this year were Sept or Oct born except one boy but the boys offered Kings and SP had a wide range of birth months. Interestingly none of the Sept born boys offered WUS also got SP. Same scenario at 7+ autumn babies fared better at WUS.

Ps What does WCPS stand for?

[Onebusymother1]

Younger boys have a tougher ride

[hhks]

from my experience, adjustment on reasoning paper is pointless, as all those highly intelligent boys would be working on reasoning paper 2-3 years ahead of their age, which would be more than enough to cover the exam.
however English should be highly adjusted. reading ability, comprehension inference ability, vocabulary all grow largely with age. Writing ability in particular, younger boys writes simpler stories, and uses easier vocabularies. Sadly schools do not take that into account.

[hhks]

Onebusymother1 , I guess your boy comes from one of the two big brands? :))

[Roseredvelvet]

Onebusymother1 my boy is also football mad! I believe the classes are mixed and they do some kind of PGL teambuilding at the beginning of term to help integrate the new intake. Ds is a March baby and was emotionally too young to have sat the 7+. He's at a prep school which only preps for 11+ & it was hard enough getting him to do any work for 8+.

[Roseredvelvet]

hhks ds had never seen a reasoning paper prior to last summer and we only used bond books to age 8-9.

[Onebusymother1]

I think any adjustment is better than none but I also know SP and Kings genuinely consider these factors more than WUS. My younger son is a July baby and for him I won’t even attempt to sit the 7+ , will wait for 8+. I agree English is the biggest differentiator you can easily tell from a piece of composition how mature the child is, equally comprehension and interpretation of the text. Really tough on younger boys, I worry for my little one coming through. Don’t understand why some schools don’t realise they are missing out on a huge talent pool by dismissing younger boys.

Yes, one of the big brands but say no more I don’t want to oust my sons!!

[Onebusymother1]

Roserdvelvet thanks for the info! Busy first term ahead in Sept.

[Oooocrikeyitscold]

Really interesting comments on WCPS, my son is summer born and think we will pull him out of the selection process and opt for an 11 plus school. Plus it kind of feels like we are ‘putting all eggs in one basket’. His 2! Very difficult to tell where he is academically

[heffalump12]

Yes I suppose it is to some extent true for all boys/children regardless of birth month that age 3-4, when choosing prep schools, it's quite hard to tell what they're like academically. And it's hard to separate innate ability from stuff they happen to have been taught because they have older siblings or enthusiastic pre-school teachers/parents.

So a school that goes to 11 or 13 seems a safer bet, alongside maybe extra work at home for 7 or 8+.

[Huixiao]

Drinking coffee, I know one Chinese boy choose SPJ instead kings. Hope can help you son.
Good luck!

[Rowingthebigboat]

I’ve come to this thread rather late but I hope I can be of use. My son sat all the schools mentioned at 7+ a few years ago and was offered WUS, SP and KCJ. We chose WUS. For parents stressing because you don’t have your first choice all I can say is be positive, accept the school you do have and go with it. My son’s friends are at various schools and there isn’t a single one who is unhappy where he is. If you are waitlisted hold on tight. Every year the list moves at all the schools, even at WUS and SP but it depends of course how high up the list you are. SP is the toughest one to move as they over offer and have a large waiting list. WUS never over offer and have only a very small waiting list, tiniest margins at this stage - just bad luck - if waitlisted pretty likely you will get in.

I will try and give honest account without sounding too biased!

• WU is a school for highly academic boys, at least 20% of boys there are considered “gifted”. If your child is not in that kind of league stay away, he will have a miserable time during what should be his freedom years.
  
• WU do not make special allowances for summer babies, older boys fare better during the admissions process but not exclusively so. My son’s class has a couple of summer born boys and actually they are amongst the brightest!
  
• Comments about the Head of juniors “recruiting boys in her own image” are a little silly. The Master has ultimate say on admissions and will check every boy’s attributes and Head’s reference carefully before offering. If she didn’t make a good impression on parents it’s not a huge surprise. Current parents don’t find her particularly impressive either but rest assured her influence on your son’s education will be short lived - she is one of the year 4 class teachers. Before you know it the year is up and your son moves on.
  

-WU is making a conscious effort to admit a small number of boys who are not exceptionally clever but can contribute in other ways to School life eg sport. The thinking being the school has enough geeks and needs more jocks. This is a pet project of the current new (ish) Head, the idea is popular with some parents but most are against it. whilst I can accept there will therefore be boys whose offers to WU will come as a surprise, rest assured these boys are still in a small minority and many cannot go the distance to successfully transfer to the Great School. They are conspicuous from the obvious gap in intellectual ability compared to their classmates and personally I don’t believe it is in their interest to be at such a highly academic school in the first place. If your son is in that category perhaps consider your position carefully before accepting a place.

For any parent with WU and multiple offers having difficulty choosing, just be true to yourself. If your son lives for learning, is genuinely and I mean genuinely happy to spend his evenings getting stuck into chunky and interesting homework instead of watching TV, loves the company of other boffins, doesn’t mind moving from likely the cleverest boy in his current class to just another boy or quite possibly the least clever, WU sounds like a very good fit! When we got to this point in the process we explained to our son briefly what each school is about, we narrowed it down to our 2 top schools then let him choose! Children have a sixth sense about these things more than we sometimes give them credit for.

Sent from my iPad

[drinkingcoffee]

Onebusymother1 congratulations on finally making your decision! SP is an excellent school and I am sure your son will be very happy. Thank you so much for thinking to tell me - have you now released your place at WUS?
Huixiao thank you too. I am starting to feel better, last week things felt desperate. I would be deliriously happy if we get either WUS and Kings.
Rowingtheboat - very helpful comments, thanks for sharing that. My son is very bright, comfortably ahead of all his classmates. As you say, could have come down to the tiniest of margins and he was ill the morning of the interviews at WU and not at his best at all. He must have done really well in the exams to be waitlisted.

[hhks]

Rowingthebigboat, thank you for the post. a lot of information to take away. TBH, I don't know how to tell whether a 6 or 7 yo boy is "gifted", as I don't see my boy as genius, and I don't see any other boys with multiple offers genius either. yes, they are bright boys, and a lot of them very "hardworking" at a young age. I believe a lot of those achievements are due to how they spent their time at home the year leading to the exam, and their personality. I believe 11+ is a fairer place for boys to compete when they have learnt more complex concepts which requires more intelligence to digest and they mature more. However the current system makes 11+ super competitive with over 1000 people fighting for limited places. Just to think about it makes my stomach cramp.
Anyway, time to take a long break, and wish all our boys thrive at whatever schools they are going to.

[hhks]

drinkingcoffee, I truly hope you will see movement soon, please do let us know if there's good news. I know two families going to SPJ and giving up KCS. but don't know anyone giving up WUS from my circle yet. We are also on a RL for another school, I can imagine the anxiety if we hadn't have a firm offer already. Hope to see you in September at school gate. :)

[parkavenue1234]

I know a boy from our school who is today giving up his place at WUS and SP in favour of Sussex House because both parents want their son to go to Eton at 13+.
Hope that helps some of you!

[Oooocrikeyitscold]

Drinking coffee-wishing your son all the best. Remember though Whilst these are brilliant schools I’m 100% sure your son will thrive at another school even if he doesn’t get into one of those two.

[OptimysticMom]

Drinkingcoffee, thank you very much for the clarification on 'reserve/wait' list. Good luck to your little man.
Onebusymother1 WCPS: Wimbledon Common Prep School, the (considered) feeder to KCJS.
Interesting, folks here (& lots of my friends) don't have many +ve things to say about Squirrels/WCPS (boys not allowed to talk during lunch!!), but still send their LOs there.
The love of learning comes from the right environment; so glad we declined their offer at 4. The pressure is intense I hear/have seen...

"Younger boys have a tougher ride." Spot on, yes.

Hhks, I think the families thought "the school" would prepare their sons- you can't know completely what a kid can achieve at 4 yrs old- (& yet everyone I know at WCPS has private tutors for their child!!- astounding)!

[grindel]

A spring born boy will not be disadvantaged. There are plenty of spring and summer boys at KCS, but probably outweighed by the winter borns - although I think the HM would say statistically the boys who enter are more likely to have birthdays in these months anyway!

50% is also overstating it a bit I think. Even in the very best years it's a bit less than that.

If you are choosing a school that goes to 13+ then make sure it isn't one that won't support you at 11+ if that's your plan - there are plenty who would like to insist you stay to 13 and who knows what the senior schools will be preferring then?