Has this school trip broke any regulations/laws?

[emma16]

I would appreciate some help here please, my 5 year old daughter went on a trip with 2 other classes from her school on Friday to a wood which I was initially concerned about as we go there ourselves on a Sunday etc for walks & have never seen any facilities there.
I raised my concerns with her teacher the week before they were due to go, to which she hardly knew anything of the trip & when i arrived at home time another teacher i know told me that she'd been there & there were facilities, and 'as if' they'd take 3 classes of kids somewhere where there wasnt!
I wasn't pretty hot about this trip seeing as they've waited until the middle of November to do it, and as any genuinely concerned parent, I was worried about how cold my daughter would be seeing as they were leaving just after 9am & not returning to school until 3.15pm.

Off she went anyway, but when my husband picked her up from the woods car park the first thing she said to him was 'im so thirst daddy & my head really hurts'. He brought her home & we found out that they had not taken their water bottle's with them & she'd had nothing to drink whatsoever all day, despite being active for 5 hours walking & doing activities.
We also found out that there were no toilets provided & her & 3 of her friends were taken by some assistant she doesn't know to wee behind a tree out in a public wood!!!
She also told us, when questioned by us, they never went in any buildings & were outside all day. They'd sat on little stools under a sheet to eat their pack lunchs.

Now some of you on here will think i'm over reacting no doubt & appreciate it if all you want to say is a snide comment about my over bearing parenting, but, in my opinion i feel they have done wrong.
I have made several enquiries with other people & as far as they know, there are no facilities whatsoever up at this wood, which my husband & I are going to visit this morning to find the country ranger & ask him himself.

If there aren't this means that no risk assessment could have been carried out, those teachers lied to my face after voicing my concerns, they let my daughter go without any fluids for over 5 hours despite being active & came home ill & with a headache, they let some stranger to her pull her pants down in a public wood to wee, and they gave them no form of shelter/heating for even a short period of time just to warm them up before going back out again.
Is any of this ok, does anyone with some knowledge actually know? From a parents point of view there's all sorts wrong with it. If there were facilities why did they choose not to use them?

[QuintessentialShadows]

rabbitstew, on the contrary, whether you are in the arctic or Britain, it is sensible to own clothes, and dress up for the weather and the climate you live in.

You dont need snow suits to play out in November in Britain, you would boil. It would however be sensible to have merino (or other technical) base layer, a fleece and breathable rain gear, along with good water tight walking boots or insulated wellies.

Why do people not own, or know how to dress appropriately for the climate they live in so as not to freeze?

[mrz]

rabbitstew you have been following me! They don't wear many clothes up here even when it's snowing.
Yes they cope perfectly well when they leave the kindergarten for more traditional schools.

[mrz]

www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1334827/Why-dont-Newcastle-girls-EVER-dress-weather-One-proud-Geordie-explains.html

[WorrySighWorrySigh]

It would however be sensible to have merino (or other technical) base layer, a fleece and breathable rain gear, along with good water tight walking boots or insulated wellies.

I wonder how many families at my DCs primary school (35% FSM entitlement) would be able to meet these exacting standards?

Why arent children properly dressed for the weather? Because an awful lot of parents are struggling to make ends meet. They cant afford to have these 'sensible' clothes for the one day that the school decides to spend the day in the woods. They make do with cheap thin coats from the bargain end of the supermarket range or hand-me-downs from family and friends.

[QuintessentialShadows]

"They cant afford to have these 'sensible' clothes for the one day that the school decides to spend the day in the woods."

But is that not just terrible? British kids are so far removed from nature they dont even own clothes to spend time outdoors!

Are everybody just going to music classes, and activities and indoors entertainment with their parents?

Dont answer that. Of course they are/do.

[rabbitstew]

Quintessential - base layer, fleece, insulated wellies or walking boots and breathable rain gear may be OK for adults who can keep it for years, but gets pretty expensive buying it new every year for kids as they grow. The cheapest stuff does not tend to be insulated or breathable. The Geordie way saves all that hassle.

[rabbitstew]

QuintessentialShadows - do you really think children on FSM are on a constant round of music classes and indoor entertainment?

[QuintessentialShadows]

but rabbitstew, look, you know how to dress for the climate here! What is your problem with what I am saying then?!

[ClayDavis]

Doesn't need to be massively expensive Worry. After all we don't need the snow suit here. I'm going to disagree with Quit slightly and say you don't need a merino baselayer. My cheap thermals do the job well enough. Any T-shirts I layer on top come from Primark for a couple of quid each if that. I think the fleece was cheap from there too. Not sure where I picked up the waterproofs but I doubt they were very expensive. Second hand might also be an option.

It won't be within the reach of everyone but it certainly doesn't need to be expensive.

[QuintessentialShadows]

Note that I say " It would however be sensible to have merino (or other technical) base layer, " So not necessarily merino.

Mountain Warehouse sells reasonably priced merino, btw, as well as breathable rain gear. It does not have to cost a lot. I buy my childrens clothes from H&M, and spend £4.99 for a good quality fleece. Uniqlo do reasonable merino and down jackets, etc. H&M have great soft shell jackets which are rain tight and breathable, and also reasonably priced.

[rabbitstew]

Quintessential - I may know, but that doesn't stop me being obnoxious.

[ClayDavis]

I think I read on another thread a few weeks back that Primark do thermals as well. They're probably not very expensive.

I'm not sure about Mountain Warehouse. I'd definitely avoid their fleece lined coat with the removeable lining. It's probably OK if you're somewhere coldish and dry but is not a good choice for UK autumn/winter. Unless you particularly enjoy being layered up and soaked to the skin.

[nocheeseinhouse]

Are sockpuppets permitted here?

[ClayDavis]

Not usually but unless you report MNHQ aren't going to know about it.

[PacificDogwood]

It's more the attitude to coldish weather than the availability or even affordability of clothing IMO. Let's face it, it does not get that cold in Britain, mountain-tops notwithstanding; it's a v moderate climate.

I know how many hardly worn snowsuits/jackets/fleeces I have given to charity shops over the years - they are there, somewhere, going for a quid each

[QuintessentialShadows]

Pacific I think you are right. It seems to me that most of Britain hibernates, in the winter months. It really is not that cold.

It does not stop us enjoying some fabulous walks and the beauty of the British country side and shore, "outside season". We do meet some other hardy walkers, but by not by far as many as in summer.

I prefer autumn walks myself, I love the golden leaves! Went to Keyhaven last weekend for some magnificent coastal scenery. I honestly would suffer if I were to do 8.5 km in blazing summer sun!

[PacificDogwood]

The main problem I'm having with my lot (apart from the fact that they'd quite happily be plugged in to Minecraft from dawn til dusk. And beyond ) is that they are ALL wellie refusers.
Which is a bit of a problem when you live in semi-rural West Scotland...

I love crisp winter days - don't get me wrong, I'd not relish a walk in horizontal rain in January in gale force winds, but sheer temperature alone is not reason to stay in.

[ClayDavis]

My problem is mainly waiting for semi-rural buses that run to their own timetable. If I decided to hibernate because it was cold or wet I'd never get to work.

I'm with you on the walking in autumn or winter though. 10k runs or walks in the sun are not my idea of fun. Perhaps that's my North Eastern genes showing through though.

[QuintessentialShadows]

Have they tried Dock Boots neoprene wellies?

[PacificDogwood]

No, thanks, I'll have a look.

I am not buying another pair of wellies though until they come asking for them.
I have many pairs of wellies unworn by DS1 and 2 which I end up keeping in the vain hope that DS3 or 4 might wear them...
I should just chuck the lot. Or pass them on to Emma and Kate and Charotte

[ChippingInLovesAutumn]

Well, at least the OP wont be cold, with that many pairs of socks she will stay toasty

[SatinSandals]

We got a lot of it from charity shops, jumble sales and hand me downs and just had a huge bag that came out for outdoor activities, you don't want good stuff if you are going to get wet and muddy.
The saddest thing I saw were 2little girls in a dank, drizzly, day in November on a muddy path in the Lake District wearing beautiful pink, embroidered coats with white wool linings! I don't see how they would ever have got them clean had they fallen over. They also had fashion boots on!
I can't help feeling that some of the people who say they can't afford it are just peculiar over second hand and children getting dirty.

[MinesAPintOfTea]

You don't need a "base layer": they need a thin cotton layer (so a basic t shirt/leggings), a warm layer (fleece/jogging bottoms) and a waterproof layer (not necessarily breathable, cheap waterproofs are fine, its all there was for anyone 20 years ago). Oh and a pair of boots, thick socks if they are just wellies. I could get all of that from a supermarket for about £20 for DS and most of it is needed to be able to go to the park in winter.

[WorrySighWorrySigh]

This thread has led me down an interesting and rather sad diversion. I had a look at the range of coats available from my nearest supermarket - ASDA.

Good choice of outdoorsy coats for boys with the cheapest (garish orange) coat being £9

For girls I didnt spot a single outdoorsy, non fashionable coat.

[FrauMoose]

It's odd how hard it is to buy woollen jumpers now - even in charity shops. Maybe we've got addicted to buying machine washable stuff. And fleeces can be warm. I'd also agree that very few people routinely have warm coats - perhaps climate change/a spell of cold winters will change things.

I've used jumble sales, eBay, charity shops and hand-me-downs as a source of warm clothing. I can understand that for some people this isn't acceptable - buying cheap, less adedquate, supermarket gear is seen as the more proper thing to do.

But I imagine the big change has been central heating and the fact that so many journeys are made by car. (Perhaps for children, the provision of more home entertainment, the fact that there are fewer parks and playing fields, and an increased perception of outdoors unsupervised play equalling danger and parental neglect.)