How do ordinary people afford ...

[EbenyZebraScrooge]

good quality furniture, original artwork, water softener systems, anything expensive?

This is not to criticise anybody, rich or poor, spendthrift or frugal.

DH & I are, I think, relatively very financially comfortable. No debts, own house outright, savings...But we see shops full of stuff that is more than we think we can afford -- more than we can justify spending. We will have to save up for a few years to buy some of the things we want (like good quality solid wood furniture).

Most of our current furniture was inherited/gifts, actually. Are there a lot of very wealthy people out there? Do people buy these big things mostly on installment or credit cards? I just can't imagine how most furniture shops/art galleries/whatever stay in business!

[ChristmasCracker]

I would like to double our income to make it around 30k, that seems about right.

[wild]

I am a painter (or was before ds).It's actually easier in a way, and more fun, to come up with original artwork that means something to you if cost is a consideration. Means you make an eduacted choice rather than just go for whatever flavour of the month the gallery may talk you into. Lots of great artists about, do a deal with them directly, or case student shows. I used to share studio in Bromley by Bow the whole building was full of artists of all media happy to negotiate. I love inherited/2nd hand furniture. Not fussed about water softeners, prefer gin. Hate and loathe credit.

[DelGirlsRingAreYouListening]

I've always always hated debt and would sooner have 2/3 jobs (and have in the past) rather than take a loan or credit. I couldn't sleep at night if I had debts all over the place. Lots of people I know do though. One friend is a shopaholic, she sold loads of stuff, alot with the price tag still on on Ebay then went and spent a load more. I just couldn't do it. Not sure where I get it from as none of my family are particularly careful but i've always been the same. Maybe it's cos I was the youngest. I had 3 jobs when I was 12!!!!

[wild]

Do agree ldbird. Its a real safety blanket to feel there is a rainy day fund in the bank even to the point you are tempted to keep it there when it is pouring.

[winnie1]

Would like to point out that people on low(er) incomes work damn hard for their money too. Feel slightly cross at the implication that one only becomes comfortable/well off by working hard when I know many people who are not comfortable or well off and work extremely hard.

[blossomgoodwill]

Winnie1 - I agree totally. There does seem to be a lot of stereotyping on mumsnet lately.

[Flumberrysauce]

My folks have always been 'spend it' types and although my dad earned a 6 figure salary he has never had his current account in the black. Reckon the more he has the more he spends.

Unfortunately me and dp also both rubbish with money. We don't earn anything like that but we have two good salaries, and we never have any money. No credit either mind you - too scared of it after seeing my dad come back from the brink too many times.

~We are sposed to be saving for a deposit for a house but I don't think we will ever buy one at the rate we are saving £0 a month.

[Flumberrysauce]

Trouble is you work just as hard if you earn £10k or £50k really just depends on the value 'they' put on your job.

And anyway working hard will never make you rich! You need some other plan.

Did you see the £27m bank hoist in the news today?

[spacedonkey]

well said flum

[NotQuiteCockney]

I think your idea of how rich you are has to do with your expectations, and what you like to spend. A friend of mine and I, back when I was single, were both convinced I was making much more than him. I felt I had loads of money, no stress, and he was living hand to mouth. At one point, I forget why, we worked out that our takehome pay was the same! But he was from a comfortable background, and had never been poor, while I'd grown up poorer, and spent my student years quite hungry.

I'm quite careful about money, and don't really like spending it, and since I've been with DH, who is similar, I've never had to worry about money. I feel this is because of growing up with money stress, but then my sister grew up in the same house, and isn't anywhere near as cautious!

[wrapmefestively]

Winnie1:

Of course that's the case. I can think of many occupations where hard work and dedication is required (teaching, social work, nursing to name a few), but where the salary is not commensurate with the responsibility and hard graft required!

I think those with 'wealth' generally have worked hard - but have also had a good measure of luck....or are in a job which our market economy values more highly in financial terms (but often isn't a job which necessarily makes a greater contribution to society).... However, neither does that mean we should demonize all wealthy people because they've had some lucky breaks / been in the right place at the right time.

[Flumberrysauce]

Actually what I just said is Bllsht as i get a pretty good salary and I do b*gger all. But I am highly qualified to do it.

[Flumberrysauce]

In my old job I worked like a horse, pay was rubish but I loved it.

[wrapmefestively]

Would you go back to the old job Flum?

[FlashingRudolphNose]

Doesn't it come down to what your priorities are unless you're on a spectacularly low income? For example, my friend's family and our family probably have about the same amount of disposable income after mortgage and bills. They dress their children from Next, Jojo Maman Bebe, Boden etc, have every gadget going (first to get iPod, Blackberry etc), always come back from shopping with "a little something", fridge is permanently groaning with delicious nibbles from M&S and their kids are falling over all the toys they have. But they rely heavily on credit and never take a holiday. We never use credit and don't spend a lot on our kids (am a great believer in hand me downs ), our stereo's about 20 years old and I very rarely spend money on myself but we like to go on holiday every year, so it's part of our budget.

[Flumberrysauce]

I would if life was different. But I was an overseas holiday rep and now I am an accountant and a mummy. dull dull dull, except the mummy bit of course

[winnie1]

wrapmefestively, I agree demonizing 'wealthy' people is not helpful any more than demonising the less well off.

[Jimjambells]

I'm with blossomgodwill- you live once- don't care how people spend their money. We have a lot of debt- run up via a series of circumstances- mainly because we moved out of London back to Devon and dh's salary crashed (2 years later he's earning half what he would be in London). Hard to clear as I can't go out to work (although am building up a home business- so aim to be better off in 5 years)- and we've been paying about £400 + a month in therapy for ds1 over the last month. Thing is he's really benefitted from it so we're not going to stop it, even though we can't afford it. We've cut back on some therapies out of financial considerations but I'm not keen on stopping anything that will improve his chances of living independently.

We have quite a large house (one room is a therapy room though) but its a right mess- Furniture is old and crap, needs quite a lot of work done to it which we are doing slowly. Kitchen is over 20 years old and literally falling to pieces. We don't go on holidays (not with ds1- no fun anyway- we will have a week away 20 miles down the road with the other kids though this year).

Do I feel foolish for living outside of our means? Not really - Worrying about ds1's future is more likely to keep me awake at night than servicing debt. We're lucky in that dh's job is in a field that is as safe as any job can be (touch wood touch wood touch wood). And providing he desn't lose his job - then given 5 to 10 years we should be straight again. And then we'll start on the flash stuff, and we won't have to wonder whether we could have done anymore for ds1.

In the meantime I may be due to gve birth to number 3 next week, but I don't turn down work that comes my way- just been asked to do something for channel 4 by 7th January and said yes (ok I am insane- but its short!)

[spacedonkey]

I had a reasonably well-paid job and took the high risk strategy of assuming my salary would stay the same or go up and (stupidly) ran up a load of debt. Now I find myself jobless through illness and unable to meet any of my repayments. It's bloody rotten, and I applaud all of you who have stayed out of debt.

[juniperdropofbrandy]

spacedonkey but what a very honest post.

Dh and I are comfortably off but live in a small house with hardly any mortgage. We holiday well and eat out a fair amount. If we move to a larger house we'd end up with higher council tax etc... Plus I can't be bothered with the fuss and we like our neighbours. We don't have any debt and didn't when dh was on a poor wage, just live within our means. I know plenty of people who have lots of lovely things and can afford it and those who get credit. It's far too easy to get it IMO.
Dh and I both come from families who didn't have debt either but maybe that was just the norm then?

[paolosgirl]

Jimjam - I was scared to post as I thought we were the only ones with debt (although I know from speaking to friends we're not). I think as long as you can manage your debt, then there isn't a problem. We've got quite a lot of debt, as we took a conscious decision for me to take a 2 year career break. I discovered that after I'd paid 2 lots of nursery fees and dealt with the commuting and waking 2 small babies to put them in nursery all day, it was simply not worth it. We're behind financially, but I'm back to a decent salary, and I know we'll get back on our feet. I agree with the point that salaries in this country do not always reflect the value of the job to society - I wish that it was an issue more governments took seriously; that and these obscene pay-off's for failed directors. But that's for another thread...

[DelGirlsRingAreYouListening]

Brain not functioning well today and have read through this thread after Winnie's post of 2:28. I don't think that was directed at me, was it? If it was, my post wasn't meant to offend anyone and i'm sorry if it has. I've just always been quite careful with money and would sooner go without then borrow money but realise it's not always easy.

[Flumberrysauce]

Debt is a nightmare. I ran up loads when i was single, just thought my ship would come in.

It did but the pirates had already raided it.

I should know I work in Insolvency and see it everyday.

Space monkey, thats a tough tale. Do pay it off though.

[DelGirlsRingAreYouListening]

btw, that wasn't in response to your post either Spacedonkey as i've only just read that now, sorry. Think I should shut up before I dig a deeper whole for myself

[Flumberrysauce]

and learn to spell 'hole' durrrrrrr