Should Michelle Obama (and others) have worn a head scarf?

[CrazyTights]

www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2015/01/27/michelle-obama-forgoes-a-headscarf-and-sparks-a-backlash-in-saudi-arabia/

Should she (and other females from the west) have worn a head scarf in Saudi or was going without one acceptable?

[sourdrawers]

Yes it has CaffeLatteIc in 2004 they passed a law that bans the wearing of headscarves in public schools. And in 2010 a law that bans face veils in all public spaces. Veiled women have been refused entry to university classes, banks, and doctors’ offices. “the dissimulation of the face.” is what's illegal. I wonder if they would have done this if it was some poncey, haute couture, fashion thing?

I loathe and detest Burkha's veils, Nijab's or whatever the bloody things are called as much as anyone but I think it seems the French are trying to legislate religion (well Islam anyway) from the private sphere as well.

[TheSporkforeatingkyriarchy]

Caffe I agree with most of your sentiments, headscarves are part of many hundreds of cultures typically as a fashion of convenience that got woven into cultures over time (and I am nonreligious and know many other nonreligious, Christian, and Hindu women like myself who also use headcoverings), but the twisting of clothes and hair into violently enforced sexism and patriarchy to maintain control should be called as it is to help the many in those countries who are fighting these fights know they have support.

BreakingDad A lot of places were saying that she was censored, but it was disproven that she or any of the other women were blurring on Saudi state TV.

morethanpotatoprints River's misogynoir was well known it is not surprising that she would often continue the long common US trope of defeminizing and denying womanness to black women. I would wish such sentiments would have gone with her, I do not get how misgendering her is meant to be funny.

[CaffeLatteIceCream]

Sourdrawers In public schools...jobs in the public arena. I said that. A woman is quite entitled to go shopping in a head scarf.

And, I agree with France that veiled faces should be banned in the places you mention. Same with people wearing motorcycle helmets and balaclavas.

Spork Well, obviously. My gran used to wear a head scarf over her curlers.
All head scarfs are not equal and are not worn for the same reasons. Clearly there's a distinction and I think we all know what it is, to be honest.

[TheWomanTheyCallJayne]

Laura Bush didn't wear one either when she went to SA

[SconeRhymesWithGone]

Indeed. And the Saudi royals didn't look like they were feeling disrespected at all.

[aroomofonesown]

Have spent the last 3 years visiting and also living in Saudi and can confirm that it is absolutely the norm for non-Muslim women to have uncovered heads; just as Saudi men cover their heads and Western men don't. This news story is just a storm in a tea-cup.

[whitecandles]

Just to confirm what aroomofonesown said - western/non-Muslim women do not have to cover their heads in Saudi. Occasionally (very occasionally), you'll be asked/told to by the religious police, but you don't have to.

So on this matter, she absolutely did not break any taboo/tradition or show any disrespect.

I really wish people who don't know anything about a particular culture would not comment. Or that they would look for appropriate information before commenting. What's the point in wading in with your opinion when you don't even know what you're talking about? It just creates more misinformation and division.

You are required to wear an abaya, which she wasn't, but let's face it, I doubt she was pounding the streets of Riyadh in her suit. Driven to a location, meeting a few high level officials, driven back again. Presumably if the Sauds were so offended, they would have refused to meet her.

Even though you are required to wear an abaya, in many malls (the main hang-out place since cinemas etc are banned), you see women walking about with their abaya open, skinny jeans and tight-fitting tops very much visible. Besides which, everyone has TV, no-one is going to be shocked by seeing a non-Muslim woman without an abaya.

I'd imagine the reason they extend the abaya law to non-Muslim women is to make the whole issue easier to police. Since everyone knows Michelle Obama doesn't live in Saudi, it's a total non-issue. Random foreigners walking the streets uncovered is a bit different.

Doesn't mean I agree or disagree with women covering, by the way, I wish they had the choice rather than have it dictated to them.

[Nokidsnoproblem]

I live in Saudi and I rarely cover my hair.

However, if I was at a funeral I almost certainly would out of respect.

[HesterShaw]

For whom?

[Butterflymacqueen]

Never mind her not covering up. Michelle looked like she'd rather not be there- why the hell did she go?
I've gone off the woman completely.

[SconeRhymesWithGone]

Well, she wasn't at a funeral despite news references to the contrary.

[Butterflymacqueen]

It's not the funeral I'm talking about. It's her attitude (body language). Laura Bush, Hillary Clinton, Condoleeza Rice and even the Queen have visited and shown some kind of interest- the woman looked like she was 'repulsed' at having had to go!

[SconeRhymesWithGone]

Her attitude? Where do you get this? Because she wasn't smiling all the time? It was a somber occasion.

[desertmum]

so agree with you whitecandles - this is all over fb and people are commenting not knowing anything about the country and what is actually required. Women in Saudi don't wear burkas either - it is a hijab or niqab. This really is a non-story put out there to get people all riled up again about Muslim women covering up.

[LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett]

Moslem women don't attend funerals and while non-Moslem women can attend funerals, MO didn't.

I'm not surprised she was repulsed at having to go #freeraifbadawi

[LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett]

Muslim! Not Moslem Sorry, don't know wtf happened to my spelling there

[PedantMarina]

This apparently caused an uproar in Conservative America. But then this was posted. I got it from a friend's FB timeline.

[Canyouforgiveher]

This really is a non-story put out there to get people all riled up again about Muslim women covering up.

Actually I think it is a non-story put out there to get people all riled up again about that "uppity black woman". Read any of the stuff written about Michelle Obama (and her daughters) by the right wing in the US - this is just more of the same. The sub-text is "how dare she be the first lady, and given that she is, how dare she not be apologetic and grateful and looking for rich white male approval - she should know her place"

[IPityThePontipines]

Canyouforgiveher - I think you are exactly right. It's US right-wingers making a fuss about MO doing this, not anyone else.

[desertmum]

canyou - didn't get that slant on the story probably because I'm not American and so don't see as much about MO in the news. Such a shame that there is that kind of feeling about her - very sad that in 2015 people have racist views. Harbouring such hatred must be very tiring.

[Woodifer]

Sorry haven't quite plowed though all the thread - but I was trying to think of a cultural parallel. And in this country (and US) women aren't allowed to be topless. We are shocked by the indecency of women's breasts - could we consider that being shocked by the indecency of a woman's hair/ears is only and extension of this?

[cleanmachine]

This is a media created storm. I have really gone off her in recent years. She's disrespectful and pulls faces during visits. Why go if you're going to wear your disdain on your face?

And what was she wearing? It was hideous and far more offensive than not having a head scarf.

[Marmiteandjamislush]

ihatethecold:
Marmite:
I am not Muslim, but I think that adults know the law and if they choose to break it, they should suffer the consequences, whatever those maybe.

REALLY???

Answer: Yes, and I don't understand your indignation at all. Law is Law in all countries.

[ihatethecold]

marmite
So you agree with people getting their hands cut off for theft?
Women being stoned to death for adultery?
I could go on

[Marmiteandjamislush]

Yes. If those are the known consequences, why wouldn't I? Do you not agree with people going to jail in this country, then?