The scandal of the state of private renting in the UK

[cruikshank]

Housing benefit going to private landlords costs the country £9.3 bn a year, yet 1 in 3 private rentals are substandard. Is this a natural consequence of turning over responsibility for the provision of shelter to a largely unregulated private market?

Article here: www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/back-to-rising-damp-one-million-rented-homes-in-private-sector-are-substandard-9039201.html

[Beastofburden]

If how would you feel about a smaller council flat in the same area, designed for older people and allowing you to downsize in the same community? Many owner-occupiers do this.

I can see that building lots more Council houses seems odd when there are a lot of council houses with only one occupant in them.

[Isitmebut]

The Conservatives and then Labour in selling Council Homes were trying to help social mobility, the problems were replacing them, and on average the Tories built twice as many as Labour per year, but Labour NET left with less social homes than when they came in.

In 2009 with around 820,000 spare bedrooms in the system, this was the crisis demand.


Shelter (2009); The housing crisis in numbers – and the need for spare bedrooms, never mind homes.
england.shelter.org.uk/campaigns/why_we_campaign/the_housing_crisis/what_is_the_housing_crisis.

• Over 1.7 million households (around 5 million individuals) are currently waiting for social housing
• 7.4 million homes in England fail to meet the Government's Decent Homes Standard
1.4 million children in England live in bad housing. [3]
• In 2008/09, 654,000 households in England were overcrowded. [4]
The number of new households is increasing faster than the number of house builds

I do not think it fair people should be asked/forced to leave Council Homes due to being 'too large', but nor is it fair for 'the many' needing homes.

My father moved to a one bedroom after I left, and it was the best think he'd thought he had done (less cleaning). lol

[IfNotNowThenWhen]

Thing Is beast a lot of council tenants do this. My gp s downsized to a flat in the same area. It's the idea being forced that sticks in my craw. I
The debate always ends up focusing on the wrong end of the chain: it comes down to a little old lady still in the 3 bed she raised her kids, rather than the fact that government policy has led to the massive shortage in affordable housing, and our focus should be on that.

[Greengrow]

It is David Cameron who is protecting someone of 65 in her large 3 bed council house so she can stay there for the next 30 years blocking space for a family in need. Praise the Tories and criticise me. I would say no bed blocking protects the genuine poor and in need and that healthy adults in work need to work hard whether they are male or female to keep a roof over their heads like many of us even if for most of us at times that can be very difficult and involve a lot of hard work and 2 jobs. I don't think it's fair for those mothers who work full time to be paying a lot of tax to support families who as a lifestyle choice choose to work less.

[GratefulHead]

Personally I don't think anyone should be paying bedroom subsidy if the council have nowhere to I've them to.

In our area there is a massive shortage of two bedroom properties and as a result people have been placed in three bedroom places instead. Many would be happy to move rather than have to find a huge about a month from benefits if they need them. There is nowhere for them to go though.

Likewise I am delighted there has been a revolt in behalf of the disabled being hit with bedroom subsidy when they positively NEED more space for medical equipment etc.

[GratefulHead]

I have always believed in a home for life....but with the massive shortage of social housing I am now less certain.

There are schemes locally where the council will pay the costs of moving so done elderly from a family home to smaller housing. It's still early days in the scheme though.

My friend's Mum just used it though and is now in a lovely sheltered housing place while a local family have benefitted from the three bed house she left.

I have a home for life in my two bedroom house but as DS is autistic I might always need it if he does not manage to live independently.

[Beastofburden]

Agree withif about forcing. But if we say that a smaller home would be cheaper to run, and cheaper to rent, that only works as an incentive if we don't at the same time approve HB to pay the cost differential.

But of course there has to be suitable housing to go to. And of course disabled ppl should be able to demonstrate the need for space for equipment etc, just as if they needed a room for a carer to use.

I think the thing about home for life- should we build more houses for families to make up the housing shortage? Or should we build what the country is short of overall, which is adapted modern housing for the elderly, and then incentivise the elderly tenants to move into it? If the latter, then I'm afraid "incentivise" is a euphemism for cutting HB unless they do

[IfNotNowThenWhen]

The lettings data for my area shows an urgent need for 2 beds also. Each 3 bed gets approx 100 more bids than a 3 bed in the same area. People are wanting to downsize (adult children leaving home etc) but cant, as there are not the smaller houses available.

[Beastofburden]

Exactly, if. We should be building more of those smaller homes for social housing, so that we can try to match the population to the housing stock. Also, the population is ageing so we should be building more homes adapted to older ppls needs.

W absolutely do have to start with building the social housing first before we expect ppl to move. Leaving it to market forces simply doesn't provide a good quality outcome.

[Greengrow]

Surely the answer to the shortage of 2 beds is keep people in 3 beds but put a separate mother and baby into the 3rd bed room. Plenty of adults with and without children who rely on no state benefits at all house share so I don't see what is so special about housing benefit people that they get privileges the rest of us don't have and are feather bedded in this way.

[IfNotNowThenWhen]

???????
You do realise that not everyone in LA houses is on Housing benefit?
In fact something like 60% of private tenants get some help with housing, due to private rents being so astronomical.

You do also realise, as I have pointed out already, that in the course of a lifetime a council tenant will pay hundreds of thousands of pounds in rent, which goes to the council, before dying and freeing up their home for a new family?
What are you actually talking about? Bringing random strangers with babies to share tenants homes? Like refugee camps or something?
Please, somebody help me here-am I misunderstanding what Greengrow is on about due to the absence of punctuation, or should I just walk away nodding and smiling?

[Applefallingfromthetree2]

We need to look at other European countries where private renting is the norm. Places like Germany or Sweden where the standards of housing are also high and tenants tend to respect the property they live in. How do these countries achieve this?

Actually I am not convinced by the argument that HA/Council housing in this country is of higher quality than private rented. Council housing was often cheaply built and is often not well maintained either by the HA or the council. Some of the big estates are dire!

I also think that because of our 'home owner' mentality, many people in rented housing take little pride in their home, relying on the landlord for everything.

[cruikshank]

I actually think it's pretty fucking shocking that adults - working adults, adults with families - are finding themselves pretty much forced into sharing homes - yet another way in which the private sector has failed dismally in terms of provision of housing. That £9.3 bn is looking like less and less of a good deal the more you examine it.

[rainbowinmyroom]

Things will never change. The economy is a house of cards with property as a linchpin.

There is also this mentality of, if for any reason you cannot afford to or do not own a property, you are a lazy less than who deserves whatever shithole you can hovel under.

[minifingers]

"Surely the answer to the shortage of 2 beds is keep people in 3 beds but put a separate mother and baby into the 3rd bed room."

Are you mad?


"Plenty of adults with and without children who rely on no state benefits at all house share"

I don't know any families or people with children who share a home with another family. House sharing is workable for so singles and couples (sometimes) but rarely for families.

"so I don't see what is so special about housing benefit people that they get privileges the rest of us don't have and are feather bedded in this way."

What do you suggest? Workhouses?

[Beastofburden]

Well, a lot of young mothers with children live in hostels and B&B, mini so that ought to cheer greengrow up.

[WhistlingPot]

I agree Apple. HA/council housing is very hit or miss. We're exceptionally lucky to have been placed in a purpose built small block of flats, not sure when built, probably 70s. It is superbly designed with maximum use of space, large rooms and loads of built in storage, concrete floors etc.

On the other side of town, different story, huge mould problems, thin walls etc.

The new builds going up locally, some of which are social and/or affordable, are tiny, and poor quality. Once you have a bed in you can barely turn round.

[CantUnderstandNewtonsTheory]

Housing benefit people?! Fuck me Greengrow you're charming I would love to give you some statistics and show you that we're not scum but I think I would be wasting my time.

[Greengrow]

I don't think anyone is scum. That would be awful. People should all be treated well by others. However most people in the country support benefit reductions to aid people into work. Both Labour and Tory voters are huge supporters for this. I am in the majority, not the minority.

Many of these other EU countries give you ebnefits for a limited period say a year only and they also don't give any benefits to those under age 25 and private renting is something where tenants often pay for repairs and look after properties rather than expecting the state or landlord to do everything. We could certainly move to a model of longer term renting - it is available now. It is quite common for tenants to want a year only though. My daughter for example has tenants whose jobs may move them around the UK so they sign up for a year. The flat above has apparently just been let to a family for I think a year as the tenants again wanted a break piont after a year and in their case it is working father and mother at home with 2 under 5s (no benefits as he has high paid London job and they want the mobility as they are international)

[rainbowinmyroom]

You do realise 80% of those who claim housing benefit are in work, yeah?

[IfNotNowThenWhen]

In EU ountries "private renting is something where tenants often pay for repairs and look after properties rather than expecting the state or landlord to do everything."

Hahahaha!

Bless you greengrow for assuming that private tenants don't pay for repairs and maintain their landlords properties.
The amount of re-decorating, gardening, plumbing and even plastering I have done for landlords over the years. In the 20 years I have been privately renting, I have had a place I have been living re decorated by the landlord...once. One flat, and that was the only place I ever lived where the landlord ever fixed anything when asked, and didn't skim at least a hundred smackers off my deposit every time I moved out just for the Hell of it. I was so pathetically grateful for that landlord, who incidentally rented me the flat as a pregnant single woman. I was grateful because he did what he was supposed to do, unlike most landlords.
My last landlord evicted us because I complained about various essential repairs that the flat needed, including severe damp which caused mould to cover one wall, and dodgy electrics. He owned the house for 40 years, but didn't fancy paying a single penny towards its upkeep.
This is not at all an unusual situation. Every renter I know decorates their own house, gardens, and makes small repairs. I would welcome decent long term tenancies, but I don't think it would change much about what tenants already do.

[Beastofburden]

if when I read those stories I think even more that LLs should be regulated.

As I said before, I live in jobrelated accommodation so we rent out the house that we will retire to. In 17 years I have witheld 100 for a badly stained mattress. The house has been fully redecorated twice, new carpets and all. There has been one complete new kitchen and several dishwashers, cookers, boilers, etc. We refenced the garden front and back this year as well. The agents are authorised to carry out small repairs immediately (ie, same day if possible, same week without fail) and only come to me if it costs over 500. Obviously we do our annual gas safety check, check the smoke and CO2 alarms, check the electrics annually, etc. I have never had a dispute, never asked anyone to leave. I allowed a dog once and when the tenants left they got their full deposit back as they had cleaned things up immaculately. The current tenants- a family- are in the their fourth year.

I feel so strongly that they are paying me for a professional service and they deserve the best. I want to be able to look them in the eye (if I should meet them) and not be ashamed of myself. I dont want to feel that I am de facto scum because we own one house that we cant currently live in, so we let it out to a family that wants to live there and couldn't otherwise afford it. It's in catchment for a great state comprehensive- that's why it lets well.

Maybe because it's not a business- I am quite happy with the fact that I am able to own somewhere to retire to, I don't expect to make a profit in year. But I believe that ethical private renting can exist.

LLs should be regulated, though. The bad ones are evading tax, ignoring health and safety checks, and ripping folk off. At the same time as building more social housing, let's elimiate them. A register will force them to pay tax- that should deal with quite a few before we start.

[Applefallingfromthetree2]

If not-my points about renting property was not meant to be personal. You are clearly an exceptional tenant and your landlord is lucky to have you.

For evidence of poor tenant involvement walk around any area in the UK with a high percentage of rental properties and you will see what I mean.
Rubbish dumped in overgrown gardens , smelly overflowing bins, dirty windows........ Awful for decent tenants!

Incidentally I was brought up on a pretty dire council estate.

[wafflyversatile]

I don't think anyone is scum. That would be awful. People should all be treated well by others. However most people in the country support benefit reductions to aid people into work. Both Labour and Tory voters are huge supporters for this. I am in the majority, not the minority.

If you don't think they are scum why do you want them to suffer?

How would that help people into work? How would that magic jobs out of thin air?

At any one time there are approx. 500k jobs being advertised and somewhere around 9million people looking for work, or more work.

The solution is to build more council housing and policies that don't encourage people to become LLs or foreign investors to invest in UK property.

[wafflyversatile]

In other European countries tenants are given secure tenancies and more rights. That's why they spend money on maintaining their homes.