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News

Livingstone and Chavez -- this deal stinks.

70 replies

Uwila · 21/09/2006 09:09

Livingstone strike deal with Cavez

Is anyone else outraged by this? Livingstone is providing Chavez with London knowledge/expertise and in return he is getting cheap oil with which to fuel his buses. So, his costs are going down. Do you think he'll reduce the cost of a bus ticket? Or is he going to pocket the profit elsewhere in his budgets? My guess is the latter. I heard him on BBC London last night, nd he's done this "swap" because it's illegal to actually send Venezuala aid.

For those who don't know, Chavez is an evil dictator who is as corrupt as they come. This
is a sick PR move and Londoners should be well and truly ashamed of their Mayor.

Ken's Big Brother Deal With the Death Squad President

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Report

kiskidee · 22/09/2006 21:34

throughout latin america the colour of a man's skin is of more significance than the colour in his eyes.

with the exception of say, cuba, where a little revolution changed the balance of power a great deal.

i'll go shower and put my deepest red knickers on now.

FluffyCharlotteCorday · 22/09/2006 16:55

Deepest red.

ruty · 22/09/2006 16:47

Pinko.

FluffyCharlotteCorday · 22/09/2006 16:46

Er conspirator? So the Americans have never set up puppet governments anywhere in the world then? So all the hated dictators they've financed and supported have just been conspiracy theories then?

ruty · 22/09/2006 16:01

yes i know a light skinned rich Venezualan who hates Chavez.

Piffle · 22/09/2006 15:35

In Venezuela it largely depends on your colour as to the opinion of Mr Chavez...
It is not hard to get desperate people to vote for you if you champion their cause, even modestly.

I'm more ashamed of our PM's deals with the devil than Red Kens tbh

ruty · 22/09/2006 15:22

seriously, I'm not condoning everything Chavez does, but i do think you have to see it in context, as Marina pointed out in her post 21/09 12:56:42.

Uwila · 22/09/2006 15:12

You don't need my permission.

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ruty · 22/09/2006 15:08

Yes! Can I be a pinko conspirator too!

Uwila · 22/09/2006 14:36

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

FluffyCharlotteCorday · 22/09/2006 13:52

What is the National Endowment for Democracy?

Call me cynical, but it sounds to me like one of those orgs set up to ensure that any government with policies the US doesn't like, gets overthrown and replaced by puppets.

Uwila · 22/09/2006 13:46

Freedom is not just theoretical, and I can not condone any regime that does not support the freedon of speech of all of it's citizens.

It is never justifiable to take away my freedon of speech. NEVER. (I think we remember a recent uproar on mumsnet when our freedom of speech was possibly still is threatened)

If can demonstrate that 90% of the population has a better life because you took away such liberties as freedom of speech from 10% then the cost of that improved standard for the 90$ is much too great.

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ruty · 22/09/2006 13:22

and what is his cause? And if overall venezualans have a better quality of life [and maybe even some poorer Americans] might it not be worth it? I mean in the USA the idea of freedom is great, but try asking the black people in New Orleans how free they felt during and after the hurricane debacle. Or try asking the Iraqis how free they feel. Freedom can't just be theoretical, it has to impact on your daily life.

Uwila · 22/09/2006 13:14

I think Chavez is a bad person who sometimes does nice things as a means to further his cause.

As for Bush.... well I'm looking forward to our next Republican.

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ruty · 22/09/2006 13:08

you've really got it in for him haven't you Uwila? Maybe Chavez is actually a good person who sometimes does bad things?
Or is that only George Bush?

Uwila · 22/09/2006 11:18

Meanwhile, Chavez laughs all the way to the bank. He sits atop one of the largest oil reserves in the world. Venezuela owns CITGO. And as America's fourth largest oil supplier, he believes he has the U.S. by the throat. And he just might.

Chavez calls this revolution "Bolivarian," named after the South American liberator, Simon Bolivar. But for his opponents, this revolution has been anything but liberating.

Maria-Corina Machado, opposition leader and mother of three, faces prison time for simply taking grant money from the National Endowment for Democracy, a program of the United States Congress.

"This is a country where anyone who dares to think and speak differently from the government,? said Machado, ?is seen as an enemy."

Machado's group Sumate used the money to educate citizens in democracy. But the Chavez government accused Machado of plotting with the U.S. to overthrow it.

Machado commented, "I have three kids and I tell my kids that their mom could go to jail because of conspiracy, treason to my country, rebellion. These are the kinds of charges put against us."

Opposition figure Enrique Capriles has already spent four months in jail. He told CBN News that he was only released because the street protests over his jail sentence had become an embarrassment to the government.

And at the TV channel Globovision, TV talk show host Leopoldo Castillo has had to learn to keep his acid tongue in check. There is a new censorship law against insulting President Chavez.

Castillo remarked, "David Letterman, every day, in tonight's show, he makes fun of President Bush. Nothing happens. Here, with a new law, if you make fun of the president, of the senior officer of the Supreme Court, of any minister, you can go to jail.?

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Uwila · 22/09/2006 09:53

Sometimes really bad people also do nice things. But, that doesn't make the bad stuff okay.

If Hitler paid off all my debt, I'd still think he was a bad man.

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FluffyCharlotteCorday · 22/09/2006 09:41

How very evil of him, allowing poor people to be warm.

I heard on the news this morning that Bush and Congress have reached an agreement about interrogation of prisoners in Guantanomo Bay and its ilk. Apparantly it's all been an enormous success because congress has refused to go as far as what Bush was asking for, the right to torture prisoners without being prosecuted for it. But he's not evil, no no.

ruty · 21/09/2006 22:30

wow. interesting.

kiskidee · 21/09/2006 21:18

i knew it wasn't just London that Hugo has supplied cheap oil to.

seems like the precedent has been set elsewhere.

kiskidee · 21/09/2006 15:51

says Mummy Dearest from on high.

Uwila · 21/09/2006 15:45

Think what you wish Kiskidee, but here in the real world you have not achieved much of what have claimed.

I much prefer to debate with those who can disagree with me in an organised and logical debate, yet go on to still be my friend. Like Ruty, she and I sooooo don't agree. But we can still in the end.

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kiskidee · 21/09/2006 15:36

i concede to nothing. however, i succeeded in winding you up.

ps: the points you raised were either
a) misguided
and
B) take too long and waste too much of my energy to explain.

or rather: its kinda a like trying to teach a pig to sing. i would waste my time and annoy the pig.

ruty · 21/09/2006 15:09

Uwila · 21/09/2006 15:08

I didn't call everyone a pinko. Just most of you.

But, if it wasn't bad enough. I've just had the shock of my life..... Hugo Chavez and I share the same birthday.

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