Why I No Longer Feel Comfortable Wearing a Poppy

[Geckos48]

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/madeleine-fry/poppy-day_b_4169581.html

very eloquently put. Exactly how I feel about the whole debacle.

November 11th should be for those who selflessly gave their lives in the World Wars, not those who chose to fight dubious campaigns abroad.

[Geckos48]

No I just dont think people go back far enough. Yes there were people there before the war but we didnt 'own' the Falklands and we never should have acted like we did. It was part of our 'British empire' and that is something i completely disagree with.

[Geckos48]

I feel the same way about 'Northern' Ireland, if it helps.

[LtAllHallowsEve]

Skylerwhite, I was there for Bosnia and Iraq. I know why I was there. I know what I did when I was there. My reasons for going were not 'dubious', my actions were not 'dubious'

You were not there. You may feel that my reasons for being there were 'dubious', you may feel my actions whilst I was there were 'dubious' but you cannot know, because you were not there.

You are quite entitled to think that these wars were 'dubious' but you cannot say the same for me.

[Geckos48]

I don't know how ANYONE can label what happened in Iraq as a 'good job'

we destroyed a country... Wayhay for us.

[JohnnyBarthes]

What should we have done when Argentina invaded then? Left the Falklanders to it?

[trish5000]

It is a thought provoking link and thread though. If poppy donations were split into two, ie the two world wars and the Fauklands[ie defending land that we "own"] andthe other conflicts eg Iraqwould people donate to both or maybe just to the first?

[ThinkAboutItTomorrow]

Sorry but I don't think I agree that WW1 was fought to 'keep us safe and free'. My history (bit intertwined with blackadder goes forth) always led me to believe that WW1 was a clash of fading imperial powers.

This makes the millions who died in that war all the more tragic loses but I'm not comfortable that the people fighting were fighting for some greater good.

[skylerwhite]

Thanks LtEve - I agree actually, we should separate out our judgement of overall conflicts and actions/motivations of individual soldiers.

Presumably, though, your judgement of whether Bosnia and Iraq were dubious or not made no difference to you: as a soldier, you merely follow orders.

[GoshAnneGorilla]

Gecko - your feelings appear not to be based on facts.

They ignore important concepts such as the right to self-determination.

The way you've put the Northern part of Northern Ireland in commas is a big indication that if you've even heard of the Good Friday Agreement, you probably think it's a Biblical event.

I find the way people are happy to mouth off about conflicts and situations they have no idea about to be far more abhorrent then supporting a charity once a year.

[HaveToWearHeels]

I have not read this article and have no interest.
I wear my Poppy for my Granddad.
My Granddad who lied to go to France aged 15, spent many months up to his knees in mud in the trenches of the Somme, who was blinded by gas, had his hearing impaired and a piece of shrapnel embedded in his leg. Who's mental state was never quite right again.
That man suffered his whole life for this country (yet never complained or really spoke of his experience) and I wear my Poppy with pride.

[ThinkAboutItTomorrow]

And in the OPs defense I think the split of remembrance from current military support makes more sense in the context of help for heroes. There IS a charity that focusses quite successfully on the here and now military wounded.

Just to balance this off though I'm not sure what the poppy money would then go to if it is about keeping memorials clean that's not a great charitable cause is it?

[KayHarker]

I agree Thinkaboutit WW1 was a pointless, mud and blood soaked fiasco.

WW2 was a noble war, by and large, Hitler needed to be stopped (BUt even then, there were things done that were reprehensible)

[JohnnyBarthes]

OP, regardless of one's views on Northern Ireland's sovereignty - what would you suggest ought to have happened when the IRA started murdering all and sundry? Should we have left them to it?

[AuntieStella]

The point is made because the Peace Pledge Union is not the creator nor sole user of the white poppy (became involved in 1934), Nor was it introduced in 1933 by the Women's Co-operative Guild.

That is why I suggest that people look at its origins, beyond the first two Goggle hits.

[VerySmallSqueak]

I wear a red poppy.

I remember those (both members of the armed forces and civilians) who have lost their lives and have life changing injuries as a result of conflicts.

That's the bare bones of it imo,and whatever my views on wars and politics and governments,I still choose to remember the individual men and women affected by war.

[LtAllHallowsEve]

In Bosnia my job was to protect the Serbs from the Croats from the Muslims and the IFOR and the UNPROFOR and the Aid workers and so on. Everyone was in danger from everyone else. It didn't matter to me who I was protecting, just that I was. I did that in my name, in your name, in the name of every decent person on earth that was against ethnic cleansing and the rape and murder of men, women and children. It didn't bother me who they were.

In Iraq I was there as part of the force that were providing food, medicines, clothing, shelter and safety for the Displaced Persons - those displaced by SH, deserted and captured soldiers, terrorised and damaged families. I was also very proud of being able to help the Red Cross and MSF get to areas they hadn't been able to reach for the previous 10 years.

I lost one friend in Bosnia, four in Iraq and two in Afghanistan. I wear my poppy to remember them, and to donate to the charity that is supporting their families, now and forever.

[AuntieStella]

The Movement for the Abolition of War is the originator of white poppies, and the major beneficiary.

The RBL, btw, does reference it (and its work) in some of its material.

[Xoanon]

Auntie Stella The PPU distribute the white poppy now. The White Poppy that we wear today links back to the one first produced by the cooperative women's movement but nods to the proposal (which wasn't widely distributed if at all) made in 1926 by the No More War movement. That's a PROUD history, not one to be ashamed of. And please don't accuse people of jut doing a quick google - my father, a second world war veteran who served on Malta and also in Burma in the last months of the war - wore a white poppy for as long as I knew him. I don't know when he started wearing it - whether it was before the outbreak of the second world war or after. But I've been wearing a white poppy since the 70s.

[MrsGSR]

Out of interest, do you differentiate between conscripted and voluntary soliders in the world wars? IIRC conscription in the UK for WW1 didn't start until 1916, and many volunteered in WW2.

I also think some people don't understand the extent of what the armed forces do today, there is much more to it than overseas tours, and tours aren't just about fighting.

[skylerwhite]

AuntieStella if the MAW was formed in 2001 (according to its website), how can it be the originator of white poppies?

[JohnnyBarthes]

Yeah but you joined up because you fancied driving around in a tank, blowing stuff up LtEve

Actually if you did join solely for that reason I'm still bloody grateful. I imagine blowing things up on exercise is pretty good fun. We need people who are into that kind of thing.