Child benefit - when it goes, do my pension credits vanish too...

[bb99]

Just curious.

I think that SAHPs who claim CB are entitled to National Insurance credits.

So, when the CB goes in 2013, will I lose any pension rights or credits too?

If so, had better revise the divorce to be a better off family plan and start being nicer to DH

[Chil1234]

Credits reflect that full-time parents and carers are doing valuable but unpaid work.. Don't think that's unreasonable.

[huddspur]

I'm not against it going to carers but I wouldn't give them to SAHPs who were doing no form of work at all.

[Chil1234]

I think you're being deliberately controversial huddspur . Many parents (usually women) were, in the past, unable to get a full state pension if they'd taken a few years off paid employment to look after their children pre-school-age and this knocked on into their retirement. Credits just balance things up fairly.

[huddspur]

No I'm not being controversial, to be honest I'd scrap National Insurance and just have a set state pension for all but if we are going to have a contribution based state pension then I don't think people who aren't in work should recieve national insurance credits with a few exceptions and being a SAHP isn't one.

[afterglow]

It could well be case that "one size fits all" pension that they're talking about will make all of this more simple and remove the need for them to be paid. Where women haven't paid enough contributions then I believe that other benefits/topups are (currently) possible to reach the basic pension level.

My simple gripe is that if these are being scrapped too, then that should be evaluated and announced as such, rather than just leaving people scrabbling around the internet trying to see if their NIC contributions are vanishing along with their child benefit.

I will check out that NI link, thank you.

[CardyMow]

OK Huddspur - what about parents who work PT to fit in around childcare, if they aren't earning enough to pay NI, and their DH is a HRT payer? Not my situation, but surely then they would lose their HRP (pension protection) if they were unable to claim CB? Fair?

I've already worked PT quite a lot in the pst, at below the NI threshold. It turns out that I already have 4 yrs worth of NI contributions to make up, and have been told that it will cost £50 a month for an entire year to make upeach of those 4 yrs I'm missing. So a total of £600 for each year I was working PT. A total (so far) of £2,400.

What worries me is that due to my disability, I will never again earn enough to go over the NI threshold. If I lost my CB (when youngest is 12?) I would end up with NO entitlement to a state pension. How is that fair?

[ISNT]

Looking after small children is being a carer.

It's what I seem to do when I'm at home anyway. And when I go to work I give them to someone else to care for them.

Since when is caring for children not a caring role?

[merrymouse]

Yes - you make a claim for child benefit from one department and they pay you, then you tick the box asking your partner's tax to be adjusted accordingly by another department.

Really it is such a straight forward, simple, simple system. There is no point ironing out any complicated anomalies that would make it less wonderfully simple!

[merrymouse]

Sorry, I meant No!

[merrymouse]

afterglow - I think you're right - if the flat rate pension scheme is in force by 2013, NI contributions won't be relevant.

[huddspur]

Loudlass I would do away with NI contribution and give everyone a set state pension when they reach retirement age.

[ISNT]

That doesn't seem to follow. On the one hand you are against giving a full state pension to people who have taken time out of work to raise children, on the other hand you advocate giving everyone a state pension irrespective of how much time they have spent in paid employment.

If you are for giving a pension to everyone, why be against accrual for people who are having time out to raise children?

[huddspur]

I just make the point that if we are going to have a contribution based state pension system then I would make people actually have to make a contribution in order to get a NI credit. A SAHM is no more contributing to the funding of her state pension than a person who is unemployed but the SAHM is given a years worth of NI credits.

As I said I don't believe in a contribution based state pension but if we are going to have one then someone should to pay a contribution in order for it to count as a years contribution.

[ISNT]

Unemployed people get credit while they sign on AFAIK. Certainly they used to.

Do on that basis would you still not pay them for women who are taking time out to look after children?

[huddspur]

I'm pretty sure that unemployed people get no NI credits. If we are going to have a contribution based system then no I wouldn't pay women NI credits who have taken time out to look after their children as they aren't paying any form of contribution.

[ISNT]

Yes they do, I know that people on JSA so as I did when I received at for a while.

I don't know the ins and outs of all the benefits but at least some unemployed people get NI credit. That is part of the point of signing on.

[ISNT]

A quick google says that you get NI credits for ESA as well (I think that's what replaced income support).

[huddspur]

I've just googled it and it seems you are right and looking at NI is an even bigger farce then I thought it was

[ISNT]

So on the basis that unemployed people get credits, you would possibly be persuaded that women who take time out to raise children, but are not on a low enough income to claim benefits, should also receive the credits.. ?

[huddspur]

No I wouldn't give anyone who isn't working and actually paying NI credits (with a few exceptions eg disabled carers), if we are going to carry on with the contribution system.

Personally I'd give everyone a set state pension at retirement age but if we're going to make people 'pay' for their state pension then they should be actually paying something.

[ISNT]

Yes but on the current system, as it stands, do you agree that women who are taking some time out to look after children should receive credits, as they do at the moment through signing up for child ben?

[wildstrawberryplace]

I don't get this - I get child benefit, but took voluntary redundancy when I was pg. Since then I've had letters saying I am going to have a contributions gap and giving me an amount I can pay to cover it while I am not working...are you saying that because I claim CB, I should have informed them of this when I got the letter and my contributions would have covered?

[wildstrawberryplace]

"would have BEEN covered" obv.

[huddspur]

No because the Government is decieving people. They peddle the line that you pay national insurance in order to get a full state pension for yourself but in fact you are paying national insurance for your state pension and other peoples who are not working or paying NI but who are given NI credits.
If we're going to carry on with the NI system, then the only way to get NI credits should be by paying NI with a few exceptions (taking time out to look after children is not one). If peoples NI contributions were linked to only their state pensions then we could lower the NI rate.

[ISNT]

It may be that the contribution level provided in credits is lower that what you pay when working - there are 4 different levels of NI conts. Something to do with that I expect.