Engineering for girl (with very high grades)

[Au79]

Dd has heart set on applying to Cambridge (I know, I know, she is doing this all wrong). But she’s going to apply there, end of discussion, she says! With her exam performance and other activities throughout school so far, she has a good shot at it. It will be her firm, as it stands atm.

My question is, where else can she apply that will be both prestigious and really interesting? I gather she needs an MENg to be properly qualified, but I don’t know. She is maybe interested in Bioengineering in the longer term, and quite keen on something like a stint abroad or at least a placement, as part of the course.

I don’t want her to end up like her sister, with three offers but all for the same (high) grades. Sis was set on a super demanding subject, or nothing (in the end she got the grades but it was super stressful waiting for results and not knowing where she was going until 2 weeks before). I want dd2 to have a proper insurance, with actual lower offer grades in the event of dropping a grade, where she won’t be too sad about getting second choice.

Not keen on London, we live there and she wants to leave home for uni.

TIA

[Dancingdreamer]

FriendorFaux - please don’t assume that having been a boarder will make the transition to university easier. My DD was a boarder but the transfer to uni was really hard for her. She found the whole change very stressful because she really missed her close school friends who were like her family and were now spread all over the world (unis, gaps years etc). She has settled now but we were all taken by surprise by how hard it was for her.

[Dancingdreamer]

Eccles - good to know about Manchester. As I said, I knew it used to have a good reputation (which is why I mentioned it) but I just haven’t heard the university mentioned much these days! I don’t know why but comments in the media etc are always dominated by universities in the SE plus Durham!

[EcclesThePeacock]

Maybe the ranking of Manchester is built on something other than the perceptions of the middle classes/ arts-type media folk?

[FriendOrFaux]

DancingDreamer
Gosh I'd never thought of it like that. I assumed she'd be fine, thinking it was going to be a continuation from school. I think one other girl from her house is going to Imp but the rest are going all over the country, USA etc.

I'm dreading her going. Schools different as it's strict whereas uni is not. I (vaguely) remember some of the drunken scrapes I ended up in.

[maryso]

Imperial which is almost as highly ranked as Cambridge
That must be like saying UCL is almost as highly ranked as Cambridge for Architecture. Not to architects or schools that know what they're doing though.
Likewise for Engineering. Parents may like the sound of Cambridge, but knowledgeable schools and engineering employers tend to prefer Imperial the UK courses.

Manchester used to be strong
hahaha
Extra points awarded for trying to eliminate potential competition is what comes to mind

[BubblesBuddy]

For Engineering, imperial is hard to beat. If you are good enough for Cambridge then you would be good enough for Imperial and vice versa! FM might be the del breaker for both though! The strength of Imperial is that it’s sciences only. I would therefore put it above Cambridge in that it has strength in depth on all engineering disciplines. I think sometimes posters do not understand the depth of engineering disciplines. Take a look at the huge breadth of study required for an MEng in a specific discipline! That’s why Imperial is a strong choice.

Manchester is still excellent for Engineering! It formerly had its own separate university. I would say Engineering is still extremely strong in the North with only Bristol, Imperial and Southampton standing out in the South. Newcastle, Leeds, Sheffield, Liverpool and Manchester plus other midlands universities are all good. As are plenty of ex Polytechnics! They often produce the best well rounded students due to the year out in industry. We have mostly great courses in this country and any young person wishing to make a career in Engineering really does not need to go to the big names! If they are competent they are employable!

FriendorFaux: my DDs boarded and they were just fine at university. DD1 went to a catered hall though and found this to be the best transition. No cooking to worry about! Friends were made at formal dining and it suited her. She went to her uni with one other girl from school but they were contacted by other alumni already there. This might happen to your DD.

London takes a bit of getting used to. DD1 shared a flat with a girl when they were doing bar pupillage in London who was continually worried about her safety. I think London living requires common sense but not apprehension, or it’s not enjoyable. Imperial students won’t live anywhere unpleasant for y1 anyway! By the time y2 comes around, she will be savvy!

[EcclesThePeacock]

The strength of Imperial is that it’s sciences only

In one way, perhaps... but going to university is more than the course itself. My DD had ruled out London anyway, but one of the many factors in her pros and cons was the non-engineering students she'd be living among. Her other options were certainly very good for engineering, but less consistently so for other disciplines. Not saying it's necessarily a major consideration, just another variable some students may want to consider.

[Dancingdreamer]

Maryso - please don’t be so cynical. I am not trying to eliminate competition. If you read some of my previous posts you will see that my DD is actually at Oxford already!

[maryso]

Dancingdreamer

• "cynical" assumes wrongly that I think your comment was informed.
  
• your DD being "actually at Oxford already" changes absolutely nothing especially if she is doing engineering!

[Bagpuss5]

I think Edinburgh is pretty high on the list of best unis, maybe more medicine than physics.

[BubblesBuddy]

Eccles: I totally agree that university is more than the course! However there is a huge preoccupation with the best course on threads such as these. I was really replying to the thrust of the thread in that posters were vying for supremacy of university they supported. There is a cigarette paper between many of them when it comes to employability based on MEng course. The differences often appear when students need to apply knowledge to real life problems in order to find a workable solution and sometimes the most academic are not the greatest at this! Therefore there is room for different universities and not everyone will go to “the best” regardless of how it’s calculated!

[maryso]

Wise words, Bubbles.

The number of times I see alumni of shall we say more "modest" places wipe out their competition in jobs that require application over schmoozing is increasing markedly. Our DC have to follow what suits them, and isn't it great that so many MEng courses on our doorstep will do the job for real engineers? No need for eg to go to Beijing for a really good engineering course.

[EcclesThePeacock]

isn't it great that so many MEng courses on our doorstep will do the job for real engineers?

Yes, absolutely. When DD was making her choices, we were happy she'd be fine going to any of them in terms of becoming employable as an engineer (despite opting for Cambridge she has absolutely no interest in banking etc!) so some of the other factors - city or campus etc came more into play.

I guess this is what the OPs DD needs to know (

[EcclesThePeacock]

Sorry, premature post! ... that while she may have her heart set on Cambridge, (a) she may not get a place, given the applicants to offers ratio and (b) the very high grade requirements - but that there's loads of other good options.

[BubblesBuddy]

When my DH was at university doing engineering, the Chinese were here in large numbers doing undergrad and getting qualifying work post degree! We have been world leading for years!

[PaulHollywoodsSexGut]

Honestly look at Strathclyde. Two absolute A** students I know who were being encouraged (pushed) to apply to Oxbridge chose not to as (at the time, 2000) Strathclyde was the superior institution for engineering (chemical and mechanical IIRC).

Basically if she ended up at Strathclyde she’d live in Glasgow and that’s a FUN place to be in your twenties x

[Dancingdreamer]

Maryso - your exact words were:

“Manchester used to be strong
hahaha
Extra points awarded for trying to eliminate potential competition is what comes to mind”

Maybe you have a different interpretation but that clearly read to me that you felt I was trying to dissuade people from going to Manchester in order to secure some advantage for my DC. I therefore think your response was cynical and the fact that my DD is not therefore looking for a place at Manchester does change absolutely everything. I posted my opinions based on my DD’s experience purely to try and help another parent in a similar position.

[EcclesThePeacock]

I thought Maryso was implying some sort of competitiveness based on where we or our DCs had studied... but somewhat confusing since I'd already cleared up your misapprehension re Manchester (despite my DD being elsewhere)

[JocelynBell1]

We have been world leading for years!

No, we haven't been leading the world for years in Engineering. In fact, it is the area where our universities are generally weakest.

[hellsbells99]

This is interesting - Leeds Uni have funding for an extra 150 PhD places. The article also mentions collaborations with Bristol, Durham and Manchester.
engineering.leeds.ac.uk/news/article/527/government-confirms-150-plus-leeds-phd-places

[hellsbells99]

www.sheffield.ac.uk/news/nr/steel-industry-hub-1.829956
Sheffield Uni, along with Warwick and Swansea Unis have a new £35milliion research network / project.
There does seem to be a lot of investment going on with engineering in universities at the moment.
For anyone looking at engineering at universities at the moment, the Diamond Building at Sheffield is very impressive.

[EmmaGrundyForPM]

My son had offers for engineering from Bristol, Sheffield and Birmingham but he made Nottingham his first choice and hasn't regretted it. He loves the fact that it's a campus uni but also very close to the city. He is going abroad for his 3rd year.

My ds knows that Bristol is "better" in terms of prestige but chose Norringham because he felt he would prefer to live there. And the course is still very good.

If your dd really doesn't want to be in London then, however good Imperial is, it may not be the best fit for her.

[BubblesBuddy]

You are wrong, Jocelyn. Very many Engineering grads employed on major projects around the world are Chartered Enguneers from the UK system. That isn’t to say there are not other great Engineering universities around the world. Of course there are! However our undergrad and post grad training is world class and respected around the world allowing our Chartered Engineer qualification to be recognised anywhere. Language is the only barrier in some countries, of course. There is no reason why other countries, such as China, are not just as good but our students don’t study there, any more than they do in Japan, USA, France or Germany, all world leaders too. Therefore there is no concern that our universities cannot produce top class engineers, they can.

[EcclesThePeacock]

No, we haven't been leading the world for years in Engineering

There may be some truth in that outside of universities, perhaps, because engineers aren't accorded the same status as they are in eg Germany. The linguistic confusion between 'engineer' versus 'mechanic' or 'technician', for one thing, has had unfortunate consequences.

In fact, it is the area where our universities are generally weakest.

How do you assess that? I doubt it's true in terms of attracting foreign students. It's certainly not true in terms of grades required for the best courses. Of course, if you look at the proportion of highly placed U.K. universities in eg the QS rankings you'll see fewer for engineering than for - frankly - less valuable skills such as geography, or culturally western ones such as English or classics.

[maryso]

I posted my opinions based on my DD’s experience purely to try and help

Dancingdreamer, we all post to try to help, and cannot be expected to hold the same opinions. Whether your DD is looking for a place in Manchester absolutely changes nothing about how good their courses are; it just shows that you're personalising the discussion. Likewise your allegation about my cynicism wrongly assumes that opinions have to be ranked or reconciled in a comparable way. Your DD's experience will have been based on the resources available to her, as my opinions are. I am not at all concerned as to whether your resources are comparable to mine because this is not a personal discussion.