India Knight "Stop breast-beating, sisters" - comment on charities' complaints re OK! article

[SueW]

In today's Times

Why can't they understand it's about underhand advertising?

[Gobbledigook]

Hmm, I don't know - don't people usually say formula feeders are young and/or working class? I'm sure I've seen that stereotype bandied around.

[TheOldestCat]

Pagwatch, hunkermunker,

I'm really interested in when and how breastfeeding switched to being really middle class. My mum fed me and my brother in the 70s when (am I right?) formula was in its heyday (she was, no doubt, brainwashed into it by the 'sanctimonious NCT').

My maternal grandmother (working class) told me her dad's response every time any baby in the family let out more than a whimper was (imagine it in a gruff welsh accent) "get it on the chest, mun".

[hunkermunker]

I'm talking about a generation ago, GDG. If not a two, now [creak]

[Gobbledigook]

Must admit, I never felt any pressure to bf or ff either, I just did what I wanted and everyone supported me in it.

It's only on MN that I've ever come across such strong views. I've got into a fair few debates in my time and I don't even know why - I must have been seriously bored at the time!

[hunkermunker]

I think I will write a book.

[researches everything]

The shift is fascinating and at the crux of the whole issue, IMO.

And it had a lot to do with the way formula was advertised, definitely.

[Gobbledigook]

Or I'm just an antagonistic cow at times. One of the two

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[hunkermunker]

I think that probably played a part too, Pruners.

We are bonkers in this country about food in general. Quite, quite barking.

[pagwatch]

Perhaps it was also post 60's - how did Harold Wilson desribe it, something about the white heat of technology.
It was the space age and all the scientific developments were hitting our homes and our kitchens. No co-incidence that mother who bf me also had no washing machine and a tiny kitchen. But we were all convinceing ourselves that science had the answer to everything. We were looking at a brave new world. All the clothes were artificial fibres and even the colours were not natural if it could be made it was better.
It was also around womens liberation with ff husband could help and woman was not tied( literally) to her child in such an obvious way.

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[expatinscotland]

GDG, speaking sense as usual 19:34:40.

[meandmyflyingmachine]

Re the liberation stuff, and a propos of nothing to do with bf/ff, Felix Dennis was on Desert Island Discs today, and said that his mother, a chartered accountant, had to get a man to sign her hire purchase agreements for her.

Hurrah for liberation stuff.

And having read in 'A History of English Food' about early bottle feeding, hurrah for formula too.

(And of course hurrah for breastfeeding support...)

[gess]

why get bothered about people who don't even try trhough canadianmum? Why find them annoying? That's the bit I find interesting. unless they're telling you what you should be doing then why does it bother you what they do? They probably make numerous parenting decisions each day that you disagree with.

I'm not completely convinced I buy the recent stuff. I've spoken to a number of women in their 70's who used various things like boiling milk or carnation. My (working class) aunt (70 this year) told me that she was having a few problems breastfeeding her eldest and her friendly neughbour said 'oh no you don't need to be bothering with all that' and showed her how to boil milk and prepare it for a bottle. Maybe it all changed post war, but I don't think using substitute milk is only related to the introduction of formula.

[meandmyflyingmachine]

It isn't. There is quite a history.

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[gess]

oh missed your message mean- tell me more (am genuinely interested- my friend couldn't belive it when her mum told her she was raised on carnation ); and I found it interesting talking to my aunt. She said boiling all the milk was a PITA but it seemed to be what everyone in her bit of London (east end) was doing.

[gess]

mamfm is perhaps better than calling you mean

[meandmyflyingmachine]

Well, I don't see that as a liberation at all .

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[gess]

I always had the sense though Pruners that they were used if people couldn't breastfeed. I was surprised that so many people were fiddling aroud boiling up cows milk through choice. I found ff a PITA (did it with ds3 in the main)- and it must have been easier than milk boiling.

[meandmyflyingmachine]

I need to dig out my book again. It's still in a box (we moved 8 months ago ).

Or perhaps I gave it to my sister. Who tried and 'failed' (Grr ) at breastfeeding. To show that this is not a new thing. And that we are lucky to live in an age of formula milk.

It showed feeding bottles from over the centuries, and what went in them. If I remember rightly, at one time horse milk (?!!!, can that possibly be right?) was considered a reasonable substitute.

Need to find the book....

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[Pruners]

Message withdrawn

[meandmyflyingmachine]

The History of English Food, or something like that.

It wasn't just about babies...