WHAT CAN BE DONE TO INCREASE BREAST FEEDING RATES IN THE UK.

[lissie]

we all know that postnatal care is a huge factor, but what else can be done?


i speak as a failed bf-er who will try again with every baby i have, but supports the mothers right to choose.

[Leati]

How does the general public react to mother breastfeeding in public? Here it depend a great deal on where you are. In few states a woman can go to jail for indecent exposure. Most states have laws protecting breastfeeding moms but that doesn't stop people from commenting.

[Skimty]

It was an NCT one. Basically, when I look back on it now (in the clear light of day) DS had a bad latch. He was taking up to 11/2 hours for each feed and feeding every 2-3 hours even at 4 months.

I also think the expressing thing is important. Lots of friends gave up because they wanted independence and couldn't get the hang of expressing.

For me it was a god send because I could leave! I don't think I would have made it to 6 months otherwise

[Skimty]

Also, is there a difference with first and second babies?

Just curious - couldn't have done what I did with DS with a toddler around

[Elsbells]

I have had my 2nd child and I had problems yet again bf.

Tell you what would have helped me (and I am sure others as well) to keep bf rates up:

MW support
MW to watch from birth the latch/positioning and inform of when a baby is feeding or just comfort sucking. My DD latched beautifully from birth on one breast but not the other (badly positioned led to very sore cracked bleeding nipples) and "fed" for over an hour. The MW took off straight after birth (in fact we never saw her after!) and I just assumed what I was doing was right.

I also wished I had known about the breast crawl for DD and DS. How amazing to let nature take it course. It would help overcome initial problems that women have bf. I think EVERY woman should see that video if they want to bf. So much better than than a leaflet.

Also during the stay in hospital could the MW not watch a few feeds and guide before being discharged? Even for those who think they are doing it right (just in case)

BF support groups
First of all there is not enough, and the ones out there do not allow toddlers. Once DH returned to work I couldn't keep attending the support groups as I had no one to look after DS. I did attempt to take DS to one run at the hospital and was told off for bringing him. After some tears from me they let me stay.

Extended paternity leave
DH helped enourmously when he was off so I could concentrate on BF. Once he returned to work it was so hard to bf DD properly and take care of DS too. An extra 2 weeks even would have made a world of difference.

More laction consultants that can do home visits
I was prepared to pay someone to come to my home to help but there was no one that covered my area. There is only so much the web, a telephone counsellor or reading materials can explain. Practical one on one sometimes is just the best way. And would help those who can't make a support group.

Whether any of these things will change by the time I have no 3 (well, if we do decided on one more) would be interesting to see.

[tiktok]

Skimty - something's wrong here. Either you have misremembered or misheard, or the counsellor was masquerading.

She could never have qualified with such little experience. Counsellors themselves have to have breastfed for 6 months at least, and they see other people's babies of all ages all the time during training, as well as being assessed on their knowledge and understanding of breastfeeding at all ages and stages.

It is impossible for an NCT bfc to become qualified and not see a baby beyond the age of 7 weeks.

Was she perhaps a peer supporter? Even they have seen plenty of babies at all ages.

I agree with you about expressing - a handy skill!

Wd need to know more about what went on before being sure your baby had a latch issue.

[Skimty]

Also more info on how drugs in labour can affect establishing bf. BF counsellor was really useful on that and it affected my brith plan (was very useful on everything TikTok. Had obviously been trained just hadn't seen anyone with a baby that 'old'. I think it shows what Elsbells says - that people assume once you've got it, it's fine and mother with older babies give up rather than get help)

[tiktok]

Els, I agree with you about midwife support and assessment.

May bf support groups are fine about toddlers - I know several bf support groups and they all welcome toddlers. I think you have been unlucky.

[Skimty]

Or maybe I misremembered? (very hazy time)

[tiktok]

Glad she helped, Skimty, but I repeat, she cannot have been an NCT breastfeeding counsellor and not seen a baby aged 7 weeks, truly.

She may have been trained, but not by us to be a breastfeeding counsellor.

[Skimty]

Liek I said very hazy time. I'm far more prepared to believe you than my memory

[Leati]

Nursing is a beautiful experience but it is not everyone finds it easy. My first child was lactose intolerant and had many projectile vomits. Eventually, the doctor had me put him on Prosoybee. But I nursed the others just fine. The key is practice and patients, and if you are having a hard time good support.

Now this could be coincidental but the children I was able to nurse are much healthier and do well with thier studies. My first born, struggles with his studies, has severe asthma, and allergies.

[Skimty]

I really loved BFing DS despite problems. Maybe more needs to be done to say how nice it is?

Anyway must go wash up

[Leati]

Patience not patients

[3catstoo]

My experiences with breastfeeding have been very positive. I had guidance before and during.

I do feel that, out of the people I know, those who do not breastfeed do so out of choice even before the baby is born. I can easily say that out of 20 mothers I know, 3 breastfed, 16 cose not to beforehand and 1 stopped at 3 days because of problems (she was given support but decided it was too much hassle).

I have breastfed 3 babies. The first 2 were a dream and I had no problems. They fed hourly/2 hourly most of the time but I was prepared for that. They didn't stop feeding through the night until they were over a year old. Again, I figured it was a short time in the whole sheme of things.

My third was very different but I still see it as a positive experience.

From week 1, I had bleeding sore cracked nipples and cried during every feed. I had huge support from midwives and health visitors who were all aware of my determination to continue. My positioning was fine, my baby just had a very hard suck !
I ended up with mastitus and had a bad reaction to the treatment. At the time it was hell. But I got through it and carried on feeding until she was 17 months old.

I think you have to start off by wanting to bf.

I would also add that those of my friends who chose not to, made this decision based on how much sleep they wanted and wanted their babies to have.
Bottle feeeding does appear to make babies go for longer in the night, nothing can change how people feel about that.

As for feeding in public, it is awkward but it is such a natural thing to be doing that you have to percivere and forget what everybody else thinks.

Sorry I went on a bit but it is something I feel very strongly about.

If I get the 4th baby I am ttc I sincerely hope I get the chance to bf.

If I don't get number 4 then I am thinking of training as a bf councillor (sp?).

[3catstoo]

sorry, my typing is appalling .
chose and scheme.

[fedupwasherwoman]

terramum

Imagine this scenario.....

Say for example, my GP is very pro breastfeeding and has in mind the NHS targets for increasing breastfeeding rates in the UK. She has children herself and took a fully paid 6 months maternity leave and breastfed them throughout.

I make an appointment 2 weeks before my due date and say "I do not wish to breastfeed, I have issues with getting my very large breasts out in public and don't want to be effectively housebound for many weeks plus I need to return to work, working 3 long days a week, after 8 weeks maternity leave. I would therefore like you to prescribe formula milk for me to use for my baby".

Is it right for the GP to decide when/if I will be able to return to work, whether I feel able to leave my home with baby or without for weeks on end. Must I justify my lifestyle choices/family's financial needs to her ? Don't you think it is wrong to make me have to plead with her to prescribe for me ?
(Some people are able to express easily for bm to be used later with baby being looked after by someone else, others struggle to express tiny amounts so don't suggest I can return to work and express bm to be used later)

I have J cup breasts, large breasts are not so easy to feed from discretly in public, just having J cup breasts makes one very self-conscious about people looking at the chest region to start with. There is absolutely no way I would be comfortable feeding in public, even in a "mum and baby" room I'd flinch every time the door was opened to let another person in or out, worried that the public could see in through the door when opened.

Formula on prescription available only through a willing GP is a recipe for a dramatic rise in PND rates and a blackmarket in formula which itself could lead to substandard product being passed off as genuine formula, putting babies at great risk !

History tells us this, think about the days before abortion was legal. Prohibiting alcohol just sends the purchase and use thereof into an underground market.

Your suggestion is about forcing breastfeeding rates up, not encouraging breastfeeding. You are totally missing the point and willing to deny the needs/trample on the feelings of fellow mums to achieve your goal of increasing breastfeeding rates.

Shame on you.

[BexieID]

The support I had in hospital was good. Tom just didn't want to feed and they tried him with some formula and he didn't want that either! It was a good 36 hours before I managed to get him latched on ok. DF was very supportive. I also had one bad week where I'd been well tired and Tom had lost some weight and I was going to stop but my HV in England was really good.

This time last year we moved to Scotland (Tom was 3 months) and i'm pleased to say that they have very good BF support here. You can't even get Formula at baby clinics anymore (don't know if thats now stopped in England). All the mums I know with bubbas the same age as Tom, don't BF anymore. I still do, but I do feel the time has come to stop. Tom does have Formula when I work as I was never that good at expressing.

Feeding in public. My post natel group in England would all meet in Cafe Nero and those that were BF would do it in there. It became a regular thing on friday afternoons! St Enochs KFC in Glasgow wouldn't give us hot water to warm a bottle (but they sell you hot drinks). I had a shirt on with poppers and layed Tom on the tabe and unpopped myself! If anyone had said anything I would have told them where to go!

I know it's to do with health and safety, but it was a wee bit annoying! I now have a flask for warming a bottle. Not that Tom will always take one mind! And out come the boobs (or udders, lol).

[tiktok]

3cats, not denying your experience with your friends, and of course it helps if people want to breastfeed to start with, but wanting to is not enough. The vast majority - 9 out of 10 - women who stop before their babies are aged 6 weeks would have preferred to continue.

[3catstoo]

Why do you have to have formulae prescribed, is it not sold in every shop ? . Am I being totally dopey here?

I didn't take the title to mean getting the figures up as such but merely encouraging more mothers to breastfeed.

It sounds like nothing could be done to persuade you, and that's your choice, but there is no need to question the motive of the thread !!!

[tiktok]

Fedup is responding to an idea by terramum (and no one else ) that formula could be prescribed.

[Highlander]

Like the failure of the government to invest in an integrated transport network or standardise recycling.......... you can't simply 'tell' women to BF without putting in place an extensive support network first. We're in the situation in the UK now where more women are trying to BF, but failing thourgh lack of support. So word is getting around more than ever before that BF is difficult, putting the BF rates back to square one.

[Highlander]

eek, completely inappropriate use of the word 'fail' in that last post. Extreme apologies, typing fast before DS2 wakes up.

[meandmy]

if i had more support and encouragement i would have continued longer than 6weeks!
I felt i was encouraged to ff!

[3catstoo]

tiktok, I understand that. I'm just going by my experience and that of others I know.

To be blunt, it seems the ones I'm talking about are stopping at the slightest thing and not really putting every effort into it.

I realise that not all areas are equipped with the support groups or midwives with time to advise properly.

I believe everyone deserves to have such support. One of the reasons that I would like to get more involved.

[fedupwasherwoman]

Tiktok's right 3Catstoo, I'm only against the idea of having to be prescribed formula milk.

I'm fully in support of breastfeeding for those who want to and am 100% behind their right to feed wherever/whenever they want to and their need for adequate, timely support in achieving their goal.