Breast vs Bottle

[elishacatt]

Hi all - I'm not sure what I'm really looking for here, advice I guess.
My baby is 6 weeks old and I'm exclusively breastfeeding her. I do enjoy it and the closeness that we have by doing it, but I wonder would things be easier if she was formula fed.
I don't have a partner so I am literally doing everything alone. I'm not struggling with any part of being a single parent, nor am I struggling breastfeeding, but for some reason a voice keeps popping in to my head telling me to go to bottle. I've tried pumping but if I'm honest, couldn't get on with it. I expressed an ounce each time. Should I just give it longer? Baby took to the bottle okay and drinks the ounce.
I'm also a little nervous about giving up breast because of the discomfort it's going to cause.
I have complete mum guilt and feel torn with what to do.
Any one else know this feeling and can offer me some advise?

It's true that mix feeding doesn't have to mean the end of breastfeeding. I bf DS until he was 2 and a bit. It's really up to you.

Give yourself a goal of another month and see how you feel. Personally when DS was little I had to do everything and I found BF helped with this as it was less work overall. Bottle feeding is only less work if you can equally share it.

The first 6-8 weeks of breastfeeding are really tough and it won't always be like that. It's not fair to use that as your benchmark as it gets easier. So I'd give yourself chance to get over the hump and see if you feel the same way.

There is nothing to stop you letting your mum/sister give a bottle feed sometimes even while you're still BF although I'd try to get to 2-3 months first for supply reasons.

OP, are you looking to go back to work, as whether she goes to nursery may also impact on your decision re: how you feed. You can also hire a hospital grade breast pump if you want to express milk; they're better than commercial ones. I know Mothercare have them for hire and NCT etc. probably do as well. You could see how well you get on expressing milk.

Now pregnant again and I really want to have another go at feeding myself. Have read more this time and will be going to hospital armed with formula so I can give myself a chance until I actually have milk to give myself

Why dows going to hospital “armed with formula” give you a better shot at bf? You have colostrum in the early days, it’s not like there’s nothing until your milk “comes in”. Babies need tiny, frequent amounts to start and colostrum is the key.

Also giving formula will reduce the time spent at the breast and decrease demand, so likely it will mean your milk will be slower to come in.

It just doesn’t make sense to me. Give formula by all means if you want but i can’t see how it will help you to bf.

The best way to establish bf is to bf. Formula and expressing interferes.

O/p mixed feeding does work for many people. I always say though if you really want to keep bf, bear in mind that for som mix feeding doesn’t work, and if it doesn’t, then you usually end up ff. you won’t know what your baby will do until it’s too late. One of mine once they got the taste for formula absolutely refused breast and i went from fully bf to fully ff in less than a week.

If you are single and do all the feeds yourself you lose the main pro of ff- that your partner can do night feeds, or you can leave the baby.

really another one

I'm so glad you weren't there in the first few days. You sound like the midwife who told me that if I stopped on day four and gave formula because I was screaming and crying in pain, then I wouldn't be able to feed at all.

More fool me for believing her, because I now know that that wouldn't have been the case had I had better information and support so that it didn't need to be an all or nothing decision.

So yes, this time I will be going equipped to give a hungry baby small amounts of formula in order to give myself a chance- even if that is only a psychological one.

Perhaps if there was a little less rigidity in attitude towards mixed feeding, more of us might manage longer than the first few days.

It it just routine to express these days? It seems to be something that every bf mother thinks she has to do. Isn’t it just something else you have to do, and if you’re doing it in the few spare moments in the early days when you haven’t got the baby latched on you won’t have any breathing space at all..,,,

Bertrand

That was how it felt to me when again ,on the advice of the midwife, I was pumping to try to get something- anything to come out at 3am on day five. The most miserable, soul destroying experience of my life. I can't imagine how mum's manage to do it at work and I am in complete awe at anyone who does manage to express enough to do bottles of breast milk on top of breastfeeding.

I am massively encouraged to see such positive posts for the OP earlier in the thread about mixed feeding.

Personally, I would totally forget the whole question of expressing. The only reason to express is if you're very attached to the idea of your baby having only breastmilk, and you know you can't feed them yourself for whatever reason. If you're open to formula, then just use formula for any occasions where you want to be away from the baby. You'll probably find you need to express for your own comfort if you do miss more than one feed in a row, but you don't need to keep the milk if you don't want to.

With expressing, you've got to clean the pump, arrange a bottle or sachet to express into, then express, which can take time and uses one or both hands. Store the milk, keep track of how long it's been stored, clean and potentially sterilise the pump and bottles after collection, then warm up the milk, feed the baby, which takes two hands, wash and sterilise the bottle again, ready for next time.

Likewise with FF, you've got to get the formula powder in regularly. Make it up correctly to guidelines and calculate this correctly. Keep track of kettle water (etc), wash and sterilise the bottles. If you're going out you've got to plan in advance how many feeds the trip is likely to cover, make sure you've got enough milk to cover it and decide how you're going to make it up in order to best cover safety advice. Feed the baby, which takes two hands. Clean and sterilise bottles again. Keep track of overall formula level in order to know when to restock.

With BF you literally just have to feed the baby. You can do this with no preparation and no equipment. If you do need items like nipple shields or a feeding cushion, this normally only lasts for the first few weeks and then are no longer needed. Yes, you might need to do it more often, but this does settle down. You can even BF in your sleep if you're careful about arranging the bed - and when you're awake, it takes one hand, if that - you can use the other hand to read, mumsnet, control TV, etc.

It is totally different if you have other people to take on the load but when you're doing everything yourself, it really makes sense to minimise your workload.

Bert I think it seems to be. I suppose it depends how much exclusive bf means to you. I had this totally weird thimg whereby I would have waves of nausea when I pumped so I avoided it like the plague and would only express if for some reason I was fit to burst but didn't have a hungry baby(such as when I went out for the evening and returned to find a baby full of f)! Generally it does semi to be far more trouble than it's worth to me, but I didn't mind my dc having some f.

@bertrandRussell... it seems to be! I try and express but I’m sh*t at it tbh, I was in awe of any Mum that could express in the early days, she was constantly attached to me! No wonder people think BF is such a faff.

And yes I’ll say it again, combi feeding should be discussed more... I’ll say it a million times!!

“That was how it felt to me when again ,on the advice of the midwife, I was pumping to try to get something- anything to come out at 3am on day five. The most miserable, soul destroying experience of my life.”

That nearly made me cry....I don’t understand why anyone would think that expressing is going to encourage supply more than a rooting baby.

*I'm so glad you weren't there in the first few days. You sound like the midwife who told me that if I stopped on day four and gave formula because I was screaming and crying in pain, then I wouldn't be able to feed at all.

More fool me for believing her, because I now know that that wouldn't have been the case had I had better information and support so that it didn't need to be an all or nothing decision.*

You did not refer to any of this in your first post, you simply said you were going “armed with formula” yet intending to breastfeed.

Of course formula has it’s uses. And if someone is struggling so much some temporary respite via formula may help.

I had the opposite. Every fucking midwife that walked past my bed asked if i wanted formula so i “could have a break”. Feeding again? Do you wany formula? In the end i gave in because i thought there must be something wrong if she was feeding so much, and it did spell the end of bf for is because she rapidly decided she wanted formula now rather than wait for let down.

My point was barring any difficulties like you experienced, the best thing to establish bf is to bf. Not faff with expressing or topping up. Which seems to be the fashion these days as bertram pointed out. And if someone wants to mix feed, that should be supported, but they should be fully informed that it sometimes can lead to issues- it is certainly not a fix all.

Glad we understand each other now Really

I wish there was more of a middle ground. I actually wanted to try relactation after about three weeks, but couldn't face going back for help (that's a whole other thread).

The major benefit I found with FF was freedom and flexibility. I could go away for the day and not worry or be uncomfortable. I'm also not sure how I would have felt about howking out a boob in front of my Dad or FIL! It worked for us in the end and now I'm sad because she's no longer really wanting bottle, so no more cuddles for Mummy!

It means a lot to me to try again and I think what's important to get across (because I feel like I've hijacked OP's thread a bit) is that this time I won't feel bad about doing it in a way that works for me and neither should OP, whatever she decides to do.

Expressing has its uses, between one problem and another DS didn't have his tongue tie snipped until he was 6 weeks so expressing kept my supply up until then. It was a means to an end.

Mixed feeding tends to cause issues when it's used as a way to "solve" BF problems - and/or when Mum is anxious about her supply to begin with. It's generally okay to use mixed feeding as a method of practicality - though it is useful to learn how to protect supply if you plan to feed formula as a very regular thing (e.g. more than once daily) alongside BF.

That's exactly what I found Bertie. With ds we had an awful start to bf, he was tongue tied and still losing weight at 11 days so I was told to top up with f u til it could be snipped, by which time he was losing the latch and I was, well losing the will to live. I managed to get to probably 60% bf but always had to take bottles out with me so nowhere near as convenient as with dd who I ebf for 2-3 weeks then gradually added a tiny bit of f once a day and the odd feed if I went out.

If I have another baby I would mix feed. I love breastfeeding and found it easy but expressing was hard and took so long. DS would take a bottle until 5 months and then just point blank refused them - have tried everything. I can't have a break longer than a few hours. I know it's not forever but it is hard. I think if I'd given him one ff a day rather than an expressed bottle every few days this might not have happened.

Seahawk, how old is your baby? You say he stopped taking bottles at 5m so not far off weaning?

I faffed with expressing and bottles so i could leave mine. For my second i decided it was more trouble than it’s worth. But it was only really for the first 6 months, i went back to work and left him for 8/9 hours at a time. He was just given dairy snacks instead of bottles, and bf when i got home.

People seem to forget once weaning starts you can subsitute solids for a millk feed and they will catch up later, giving you a much bigger time period between feeds so you get some independence back.

Seahawk, in my experience it makes no difference. Short of fully formula feeding you cannot prevent a bottle aversion if they're going to have one and it always starts at about four months. Likewise you can't give them one if theyre not going to develop one anyway. It is simply luck of the draw.

Hi OP my DD is 3.5 months (and DS is 2.5).

I’m mix feeding my DD. She is bf for all feeds except DH gives her a bottle of formula on an evening. This doesn’t seem to have had any impact on my supply, but it’s hugely helpful for my sanity. I can get some extra sleep, or leave DD with someone as I know she’ll drink formula, and at any time of day.

Normally she only has the one bottle a day, but occasionally she’s had more. I’ve had to express for my own comfort, but DD has been fine.

I’d give mix feeding a go. I find Bf more convenient now that it’s well established, but I like the freedom of knowing she’ll take a bottle and I’m not chained to the breast pump.

Why dows going to hospital “armed with formula” give you a better shot at bf?

There is some quite convincing evidence that early supplementation with formula can lead to a prolonged breastfeeding relationship. Presumably it's something to do with stress affecting supply, or maybe women who supplement (when they feel it's necessary, obviously not everyone feels that way) have a more positive start emotionally? I'm not sure as I haven't read up on it but I thought it was interesting.

if you can, then for yourself and your baby, you really should. So @assasinatedbeauty, I’m not in the market for making anyone feel guilty at all,

Those two statements are completely antithetical.

Luckily very few people are interested in your opinion of what they should or should not do with their bodies

Fartniss, I think you may be referring to a single study from the us which showed on a small sample that formula supplementation when bf proved difficult, alongside good bf support, did not reduce length of bf. It would need to be replicated in other settings to be convincing. It does not show, and was not designed to show, whether bringing formula into the maternity unit is a helpful or unhelpful thing.

If you can point me to other evidence then of course do so :)