4 month old and controlled crying/self soothe

[emmak8383]

I call it controlled crying but what we are just trying to do is help our daughter to self soothe. Our daughter is breastfed and has always gone to sleep on the boob. Because of this she is unable to self soothe when she wakes in the night. I am still feeding her during the night but sometimes she has woken an hour later after being fed and we have had to go in to her to get her back to sleep as she obviously doesn't know how to do so herself.
So what we have started now is to soothe her by not picking her up. We rub her belly and shush her. We leave her for a minute or two and then we go back and try again with the belly rub and shushing. Sometimes we do pick her up just in case she needs a burp (even though she has already been burped) and then put her back down to try again.
Let me make it clear that we are not just letting her cry it out till she stops. We are trying to soothe her without picking her up so she doesn't rely on it.
We are just after some thoughts about whether this is too early. A lot of information that we have read says controlled crying should not be done before 6 months or 9 months old.

[puntasticusername]

Rofl at this thread. It's supposed to be coincidence that parents report improved sleep after carrying out CC? Grasping at straws, much...? Really.

[Booboostoo]

Laughing at someone does not constitue an argument. If you think my argument is demonstrably poor feel free to demonstrate why.

Anyway I feel I have made my point, good luck OP.

[minipie]

This is ridiculous booboo.

It's like trying to argue that if you leave an ice cream in the sun, the sun will make it melt. There has never been any scientific, controlled-conditions experiment that proves this, because it's so bleeding obvious that nobody needs to do the experiment. But on your logic, it is merely a coincidence that the sun made the ice cream melt.

I give up. Believe it's a coincidence if you like. I doubt anyone else is with you on that one.

[puntasticusername]

I'm sure you've made all the points of which you are capable, yes. I've no intention of wasting my time reiterating the arguments others have made.

[HoratiaDrelincourt]

I agree that CC works for many parent-child units (ie it isn't for every family) and that the coincidence of CC and improved sleep for those families may be considered causative and not just correlated.

But.

I do not agree that it works "because baby has learned to self-soothe". We have NFI why it works; we can merely observe that it appears to when the parents commit to it.

For me, I have too many doubts about why it might work to want to consider it. And I'm lucky that I've never reached the "last resort" region where it would be the next thing to try. Don't get me wrong: I've had two bad sleepers, and DC3 is too young for us to know yet, so never say never. But either I function well on limited sleep or have a greater tolerance of exhaustion, because I've never yet needed to "cure" my children's sleep patterns.

[kitchensinkmum]

There isn't anything wrong with sleep training! It needn't be harsh , a gentle approach can work wonders over a ten day period .
Those of you who can't hear your child cry as babies may also find it impossible to say "NO" to your toddler !
I know a lot of these children (so slept or had parents up ten times a night for first five years.) and the attachment parenting children who are now late teens and early twenties. Compared to the children who had love AND firm boundaries around sleep and everything else they are hopeless. None of them are independent always needing help for everything . They just don't cope as well. Sorry but it all sound lovely in writing, attend to very need no matter how much you are hanging by a thread , just do what ever the baby or toddler demands. You just turn them into demanding people who sap you try of every bit of life.
Sleep training needing be unkind or un natural. But it might just save your sanity . You will be a mum or a dad for a very long time and it's needs to be sustainable.
Imagine if you couldn't put yourself to sleep? Who much would you cry (I know I would) if , every time you woke up you couldn't get to sleep no matter how tired you were . Teach your baby to drop off by it's self . It needed feel unloved , I fact you will be a better parent if you haven't flogged yourself half to death .
Côte , you get my vote ....

[Rooners]

WHAT a load of utter, utter codswallop. No offence.

[puntasticusername]

kitchensinkmum sorry, but that's a ridiculous argument. You are conflating no-cry sleep solutions with overall excessively permissive parenting. The two don't necessarily go together at all.

[kitchensinkmum]

Because ? You think parents should be slaves to their children hahahahahah

[kitchensinkmum]

I'm not putting names and labels on parents or parenting just saying you need to teach baby to sleep ASAP without relying on sucking. I speak from experience and have almost 40 years of it .
Co sleeping isn't wrong and I wasn't suggesting it to be so. Even with co sleeping baby needs to learn to settle without sucking .
Previous post to rooners

[puntasticusername]

Sure. But as I say, doing gentle sleep solutions doesn't necessarily equate to "being a slave to your children" in general.

[Rooners]

'Because ? You think parents should be slaves to their children hahahahahah'

I think you are digging yourself a hole here. That comment really doesn't deserve a response. No one will take you seriously if you write in the very ignorant and dogmatic manner of your first post.

It's just not worth engaging with, I don't know where to START in correcting all the nonsense you have written.

[kitchensinkmum]

I always advocate the gentler solution , by taking a holistic approach and looking at the whole child not just the sleep.
The end result is still the same though. A baby who sleeps well and a parent who can rest and recharge too.
Parents who want to sleep train their child shouldn't be judged because they want to get their own sleep back. The gentlest way will work extremely well. I know parents of three year olds who get up five times a night to give a bottle of milk to a super screamer . These poor exhausted people simply exist they don't live because they are too tired .

Fulfilling a child's needs isn't always giving everything they want when they want it .

[kitchensinkmum]

But you responded rooners and you were arrogant . Calm down and feel your inner peace . Be happy not filled with anger for me ..

[Rooners]

[Rooners]

You're a health visitor aren't you?

[kitchensinkmum]

Oh dear Rooners . Why would you want to correct me? Isn't debate about listening to other opinions and experiences not correcting them and telling what they think. Maybe if you had more sleep you would be a calmer and happier person. Happy days I'm sending you a hug to help .

[puntasticusername]

rooners

Perhaps the troll hunting guidelines should be expanded to include health visitors

[TheresLotsOfFarmyardAnimals]

roundandroundandroundandroundwego

[bigkidsdidit]

Well, this has got very strange!

[atthestrokeoftwelve]

I am bowing out.

Whether Cc works or not or works for a short time I am not qualified to say.

I do know that it feels too harsh a method for me- and that's the crux of it for me. My babies cry and I comfort them.

[kitchensinkmum]

You don't like health visitors ??

[atthestrokeoftwelve]

HVs are not known for their good understanding of many issues. Often their training is out of date, their knowledge inadequate and give advice based on personal views rather than medical knowledge.

Good HVs do exist but they are rare.

[catslikefelix]

I find it hard to believe that people defend or even show off about the fact they let their babies cry or refuse nutrition in order to teach them who's boss and then ridicule mothers who instinctively respond to their babies needs! Like they're the freaks!! Babies are born with an un myelinated nervous system and are incapable of knowing or learning but can only BE which is why they have fully developed parents to care for them and respond to them ffs! The nervous system doesn't fully develop until we're about 18 which we all know is when we should expect our young to start needing less physical and emotional care...and yet some parents expect their babies to need less care when they are 4 months!! Minipie 'a baby who has learnt that they need to be fed/cuddled/rocked in order to go to sleep...' They haven't learnt to need that, they just simply need that!!Why question it? To Cote.. where did you get the idea that babies of 4 months are perfectly able to go all night without nutrition? That's not true! A breast fed baby should be expected to feed on a few occasions during the night..breast milk is easily absorbed. As a breast feeding mother you must know that! To withhold nutrition isn't being a canny mother! It's cruel! And kitchen 'babies should learn asap to sleep without sucking!! Where did you hear that crap? Babies suck! It's what they do! It's pretty much all they do at 4 months! Why expect them not to? Surely the fact that virtually every baby has sleep 'issues' must inform the intelligent, instinctive parent that it's actually the normal and physiological way for a baby to behave rather than a defect that needs to be corrected!

[atthestrokeoftwelve]

cats- I totally agree. It's madness trying to get babies to need less comfort and nutrition.
If we can't do that as mothers then there isn't much hope.