Am I really that bad? My sister was feeling a bit rubbish this morning so I messaged her back

[HacketteofHacks]

My DS is three years younger than me. As background she's divorced has older teenage children.
When we were little - our parents divorced - I was 7/8 and she can't really remember living with our DD.
Anyway as I grew up - I was the studious quiet one, not perfect but I basically blamed myself for my parent's divorce so grew up thinking I was a bad person somehow.
I think my family latched on to that.My sister who grew taller than me, did bully me - but I just go on with my school studies (I loved school and I played the flute). I ended up spending a lot of energy studying and did A levels and went to university. I did have a lot of friends who I'm friends with now (I'm in my early 50s).
Anyway my sister dropped out of her A levels and basically didn't work for a few years, although she didn't not work entirely my parents had a pub and she earned money that way. Living in the pub.
I think she still resents me,. I have tried so hard with her. When she was pregnant with her youngest I was still single - in fact I had just split up with the BF who I later got back together and married. We were at some party and she basically screamed at me in the toilet for being irresponsible and living a free life. I say that but I was doing really well in my career and saving up to buy a home.
Fast forward today. I have two DC myself 10 and 13. Am married - bought my house (we had help from in laws but I had £50k worth of debt a few years which I paid off so we could we could get a mortgage).
I get a WhatsApp from my sister saying she's fed up of worrying about money and her health. Now she's been told a few times to lose weight by her GP, she's got a fatty liver. She also still rents (although my DH and I were thinking about taking out a loan to help her get on the property ladder - she's 49 and she has got a good job that to be honest nowadays they would insist on a degree but she's bright).
I say 'oh for goodness sake, you are always coming back to this'. I tell her 'pick one thing and try and do something today that makes you feel better'.
She did have help from the GP to lose weight and went on a liquid diet but lost some weight then gave it up.
So she starts messaging me back ' you're saying I'm bad'. I said 'no I just want to help' 'I've been there'.
I then get messages telling me I'm toxic and I don't support her. She's called her GP in tears and said the only help she gets is from our mum and that I've been mean to her...
Now surely doesn't she realise that she's projected all her own personal woes on to me - who has - maybe clumsily - only tried to help.
Surely if someone in your family goes on and on for years about the same problems but does nothing about it.. Wouldn't you feel you have to say something?
My mother then ploughed in and told me I'm judgemental and toxic too.
When I went to university every holiday I would get told by my family I was up myself and thought I was better than them.
I don't think this but how can I move my family forward.
Or am I bad?

[Rosehugger]

The OP reads that you think you are a lot better than your sister, you don't like her very much and think she is a fuck up. Whereas it sounds like she has actually done quite well in some ways and has got a good job without having a lot of qualifications. Then she bites back when you give patronising advice about her weight. She may be projecting her personal woes onto you but you are projecting your superiority by using her as a comparison.

I'd try to be kind and a listening, sympathetic ear- not a bank, a speak your weight machine or someone who gives unasked for advice. If she rejects that then fine, but I think no-one reacts well to people who look down on them, don't particularly like them and give unrequested advice. It might be too late to develop a sisterly relationship but I would at least apologise for sounding patronising about her weight.

[Undecided111]

For people who don’t seem to have much in common or much love/ respect for each other you seem far too much invested in each other’s lives. I mean this kindly but if she wants to let off steam just reply with “I’m sorry, life can be hard” and don’t dwell on it. Don’t involve yourself so much in her life. Don’t give her a loan.

[meadowbleu]

You’re different types of people. Someone once told me to stop moaning and take positive steps for change and that really did kickstart me and make me change my outlook. You have done the same. Your sister doesn’t want to hear this, she wants an easy, quick fix with no effort.

Don’t lend her money. It won’t ever be enough and when she can’t pay it back it’ll somehow become your fault.

Do a lot of listening and say very little, just murmur stuff that sounds supportive.

[DrinkFeckArseBrick]

Hi OP

You are massively minimising how nasty your family are to you.

Most families are incredibly proud of the first children to go to uni. They never tried to help you get over the trauma of the divorce, your sister bullied you for years and presumably your mum didnt stop it, they put you down, they 'other' you, and they have dismissed all your achievements as being 'up yourself' and somehow not deserved. None of this is in any way normal or healthy. You've had a lot of therapy but you are still questioning whether you're 'bad'.

I dont know whether what you said to your sister was harsh and unsupportive, it depends how much she bangs on about it, and how you normally interact.

But your mum and sisters reactions are way over the top. You had a minor text spat. She is telling official services that you're 'mean', calling you unsupportive and toxic, and your mum instead of staying out of it or staying neutral and trying to get you to reconcile has also weighed in and called you names. Again none of this is normal or healthy and I think you really need to look at why you're letting them treat you like this and why you're not getting angry and creating some distance to protect yourself. They are ganging up on you and calling you names because of one text and it doesn't sound a one off.

When one of the first posters said they are a nightmare, they were right, I'm sorry.

[MRex]

Short version: a sister you aren't particularly close with called to try to guilt you into giving her money with a long sob story, you suggested she work it out by herself.

You're fine, she's just pissed off that you wouldn't give her money. Next time keep your OP simpler, most of it isn't relevant. You don't owe other adults money unless you borrowed it or agreed to pay for some product or service.

[DrinkFeckArseBrick]

And agree DO NOT get her a loan. Why would you want to tie yourself financially to someone who calls you judgemental, mean, unsupportive and toxic and bullied you? It's a recipe for disaster and seems like you're trying to prove that their accusations of being up yourself are not true. You cant do anything to make them treat you better OP, the more you give, the more they will take and expect and they will still talk to you like shit

[Motnight]

Op I am surprised that having gone through therapy you are still minimsing the unpleasantnessness of how your sister and mother act towards you.

Take a step back. Stop thinking that it's your job to make things better for your sister. Smile and nod when she moans /complains about her life.

And as others have said do not give your sister any money. It will go wrong.

[Sswhinesthebest]

Often people don’t want you to solve their problems, they just want a sounding board. I suspect that you offer solutions, then show your frustrations when they are then ignored.
As op’s have said. Agree that things are shit and make soothing noises. Perhaps offer “Have you thought about…” but expect that you won’t be listened to so you won’t get frustrated when you aren’t.

[OldFan]

me - who has - maybe clumsily - only tried to help.

'oh for goodness sake, you are always coming back to this'

This isn't really a statement designed to help. She was upset- it could maybe be said in different words, but another time.

[Eatingchips]

I think it is rare that children from emotionally dysfunctional backgrounds go on to be emotionally safe for each other. Most likely your sister thinks you bully her just like you think she bullies you. I think it might be best for you to focus on your boundaries with her and as best as you can not reacting to any communication when you are feeling impatient/frustrated with her and try to keep interactions positive and light, a more positive version of grey rocking. It is a mile above your station to sort out your family issues at this stage.

[erikbloodaxe]

Why hasn't anyone mentioned the flute?

You seem to have put yourself above your family.

You are not.
Going to university doesn't make you better than your sister.
Having a mortgage doesn't make you better than your sister.
50k of debt doesn't mean you have had your shit together in the past.

Work on your empathy and kindness. I'd say carry on with the therapy and the pair of you should grow up.

[VioletInsolence]

I’m the same age as your sister and I’ve made a bit of a mess of my life too. It’s very difficult to get out of a bad financial situation when you’re not feeling well. I’m not sure whether your sister tries but I try really hard for a few days and then hit a wall energy-wise and then my mental health suffers because I feel so stuck. I feel rubbish for a few days and then I start trying again. It’s an endless cycle and it’s difficult to not feel resentful. It can feel like no one understands. It’s also so difficult to catch up once you’ve got ‘behind’ in life. I use inverted commas because none knows what fate has in store for them. I could tell you my life story in two different ways…one a tale of woe and one focusing on all the good things, of which there have been many. I’m autistic by the way and happy about it but it brought difficulties until recently.

That said, I wouldn’t dream or taking it out on my brother, who’s done very well for himself but has a lot of family problems. Is your sister self reflective at all? If she’s able to see her own flaws and endlessly moans and criticises you then I’d think twice about loaning her money. Your sister had a sister (you) who does seem to understand to a degree and is willing to lend her money. That’s such a blessing. I’d want to see a change in attitude before I lent her the money.

[Lonelygal22]

Why would you consider giving a loan to someone so toxic? Get some more therapy with the money, it sounds like it would be worthwhile.

[Hadalifeonce]

You need to step back from offering advice or solutions, some people don't really want that. A relative of mine used to call all the time asking for advice, she never acted upon it, to a few years but I stopped offering the asked for advice and turned it around, asking her what my her happy, what might work for her. She still calls, but I don't get frustrated offering advice.

[ifIwerenotanandroid]

'... she's 49 and she has got a good job... She's called her GP in tears and said the only help she gets is from our mum and that I've been mean to her...'

Seriously? A 49 yr old woman phones her GP to say her sister's being mean to her? She needs to grow up.

[mammamiafrozenpizza]

You can love your family but still be aware that they aren't good for you. I'd take a break from them, distance myself for a while, and give things time to cool off. People who like to moan about how bad things are rarely want someone to find a solution for them. On some level, they usually know what they need to do, but it's too hard or just not what they want to hear. It's best to just sympathise, redirect the conversation, and find a way to minimise contact on days when all they want to do is complain. The relationship with your sister and mother will never be perfect, no matter what you do.

Definitely do not put yourself into any financial strain for your sister's sake. Whatever you do, don't take out a loan for her. It will only end up making the relationship even worse.

[Youdoyoutoday]

Your family are mean to you because you went off to uni, you were mean to your sister because you're sick of hearing the same old shit, understandably, it would annoy me too!

You need to put some distance between you, just because they are family doesn't mean they're your best friends.

And do not under any circumstances get a loan out to get your sister a house!! It will cause no end of arguments... "you're showing off, it's not enough, why aren't you doing the same for someone else who is in need..... blah, blah, blah".
They won't thank you for it and then you're left left with a massive debt and feeling more shit and annoyed with her.

[Youdoyoutoday]

And yes, why is a 49 year old woman phoning her doctor over a petty argument with you??

Very strange!

[Pinkdelight3]

And yes, why is a 49 year old woman phoning her doctor over a petty argument with you??

Hard to know from OP's angle, but maybe sister's having a breakdown, or had a catch-up appointment about her weight problem, or needs anti-depressants, who knows? Given the GP situation right now, I think it's unlikely she rang just to turn on the tears and slag her sister off. So much of this is how it's framed (inevitably) by the OP. But generally good advice to take a step back.

[BuanoKubiamVej]

You can't fix people, and even if you could it's not your responsibility to fix your sister or your parents.

Take a step back. You don't need to be involved in every drama and you certainly shouldn't be financially supporting any grown adult capable of supporting themselves.

Stop trying to give advice. The things you learned about yourself via therapy can't be simply passed on by word of mouth.

Your response to her latest moan was certainly inappropriate. You can be emotionally supportive at no cost at all to you so why not be a little kinder?

You could have responded: "sorry to hear you're feeling low hug" and left it at that. She didn't ask for your guidance about what to do, did she? And she didn't ask you to do anything. And if she does ask, you are free to decline.

[girlfriend44]

@adorablecat

how can I move my family forward

I don't think you can, but you can stop letting them make their problems yours.

Exactly this. Why are you having such heavy independence convos. Keep it light send her a joke or something. Far too heavy.

[zingally]

Whatever you do, DO NOT TAKE A LOAN OUT FOR HER.

She's been nothing but mean to you most of your life. Why do you feel like you owe her such a massive favour? She's a 49 year old woman. She's been a fully-formed adult for well over 25 years now. If she wants to get on the housing ladder, that's for her to sort out. Getting involved in her finances just ties you even closer to a woman you SHOULD be distancing yourself from - at least a bit.

As for the message about the weight loss. It probably wasn't the nicest thing you've ever said, but you can't take it back now. I think it gives you the excuse to do something necessary. Distance yourself from her, and perhaps your mum as well.

[Cadot]

I would try to disengage a little. Don't try to solve her problems for her. Only she can do that.

Just be there to listen, and show that you are listening by eg
-restating things she has said about what's happened or how she feels in a different way

• making noises hmmm, wow, oh goodness

-ask questions about how she feels /what she plans to do
-without offering any comment or advice of your own
eg
Sister: The doctor says I have a fatty liver and I have to lose weight
You: oh, he's saying it's quite serious, oh dear
Sister: I've tried so many times and I just can't seem to do it!
You : it seems so hard
Sister: it's so unfair!
You: what else did he say?

Etc you get the picture . It has to be a genuine reaction, but just try to reflect back to her rather than solve.

[Longdistance]

Taking out a loan for your sister is a bad idea. The worst I’ve ever heard.

Your sister is hideous and so is your mum. Your df had a lucky escape when he divorced her. Your sister is bitter and projecting. I wouldn’t offer her any help whatsoever.