To want everyone's earnings and tax records to be public information

[Itsgonnabeacoldone]

I think it would be very modern and progressive if the UK government changed the law to make people's income and tax public information. Would probably raise a few billions more and make people less likely to do those dodgy tax avoidance schemes.

[Rebeccaslicker]

Brio - I'm surprised at that. You normally get heads of terms which includes the names of buyers, sellers and their solicitors! Unless you're not in the uk of course.

[Itsgonnabeacoldone]

Exactly moving, there have been several people from countries with this posting here saying it works well (none saying it doesn't) and they've been ignored.

[MovingOnUpMovingOnOut]

Grilledaubergine why are you talking to me like I’m stupid and telling me things that have no relation to what I have said?

Read what I wrote, not what you would like me to be saying so you can swoop in and “correct” me, presumably to make yourself feel superior.

I worked at a senior level in financial services for over a decade. I don’t need to be told the bloody obvious thanks :)

I don’t understand why my holding an opinion that I don’t mind too much if people know I earnt £23,000 for the last tax year means I would post all those personal details you list on a public website? That is completely absurd.

[MuseumOfCurry]

Exactly moving, there have been several people from countries with this posting here saying it works well (none saying it doesn't) and they've been ignored.

You ignore everyone else's questions, don't you?

1. Can you please post your financial information?
   
2. Should benefits claimants be excluded from your diktat?
   
3. Did you read the post about how different Norway is from the UK?
   
4. Is it your place to expose people who are living either well above or below their means for public consumption?

[IamtheDevilsAvocado]

It's a good idea...

Equality

Tax dues

Discrimination

CSA

Etc etc

We need to look and learn from Scandinavia..

[Rebeccaslicker]

But we're not Scandinavia

[MuseumOfCurry]

Scandinavia, the promised land for socialists.

It's comprised of tiny, homogenous nations. It's not Britain.

[LadyinCement]

I suppose we all vaguely know how much other people earn , but that is rarely the whole picture. Some people have investments - buy to lets, shares and trust funds/ inheritances etc etc and I'm sure people wouldn't want those visible.

Dh and I are purely PAYE so nothing to hide, but some people do seem to have an awful lot of money and it is a bit intriguing where it comes from...

I agree that all benefits should be up for examination too. Ah, the whistle-blowing that would go on...

[Natsku]

Britain can still learn from other countries though. It might not work in Britain because of cultural attitudes but no need to dismiss it immediately. Look at the benefits as well as the risks (though not the ridiculous risks people are saying on this thread - we don't get burglars targeting people based on their taxes here)

[Itsgonnabeacoldone]

Oh we're not Scandinavia how could I have not known this. Scratch this plan then we should never look to other nations for successful policies implemented unless they are exactly the same as the UK, so no where.

It's not about my earnings so I don't know why you keep asking, it's about social cohesion greater equality.

[Rebeccaslicker]

Haha 100% typical socialist - it's about other people's money, not mine

[WitchesHatRim]

It's not about my earnings so I don't know why you keep asking, it's about social cohesion greater equality.

Righto

[MuseumOfCurry]

1. Can you please post your financial information? No
   
2. Should benefits claimants be excluded from your diktat? No answer
   
3. Did you read the post about how different Norway is from the UK? Non-answer
   
4. Is it your place to expose people who are living either well above or below their means for public consumption? No answer

[Ta1kinPeace]

YANBU
Salary transparency reduces sexism (eg the BBC)
Salary transparency reduces racism
Salary transparency reduces homophobia
Salary transparency reduces ageism

I suspect a lot of the people who are vehemently against it do not want people knowing how little they earn and thus working out how much unsecured debt they have

FWIW I have two salaries, one of £8500 a year and one of £3060 a year - abbreviated accounts at Companies House do not show them any more.

In the Scandinavian model, having all tax returns public, but the owner knowing who has looked at them
is an excellent approach.

Do you know why Donald Trump will not release his returns?
Simple - they will prove how bad a businessman he really is

[LadyinCement]

Good point about the embarrassment of earning too little!

[sparechange]

But you still can't explain to anyone how it would cut tax avoidance

Presumably, in your head, people would stop using tax avoidance schemes because it would be embarrassing if their friends snooped on their record, and noticed they were paying too little tax?
But that assumes that the snooping friend is a tax accountant and spots an irregularity, and then goes to the trouble of reporting them to HMRC for not paying enough tax?

Which then begs the question, why hasn't HMRC picked up that they weren't paying enough tax and adjusted their tax code/sent them a bill?
Or has HMRC been abolished in favour of citizen tax inspectors in your brave new world?

If I'm missing something, please do explain...

[glow1984]

I am not fussed. I would happily tell you all what I’m earning now :D

[MuseumOfCurry]

I suspect a lot of the people who are vehemently against it do not want people knowing how little they earn and thus working out how much unsecured debt they have

Certainly. Would it amuse you to expose them as arriviste?

[Itsgonnabeacoldone]

Do you know why Donald Trump will not release his returns?
Simple - they will prove how bad a businessman he really is

Haha yes exactly!

Why is my wage so important? What difference does it make? I was a band 4 NHS and now run a buisness that makes about minimum wage.

[MuseumOfCurry]

It's not at all exactly like Donald Trump. He's breached a long-established protocol of US presidents releasing their tax returns, and I'm sure it would not please him at all to have his business failures made public.

Crucially, he's the US president; more crucially still, it's voluntary and we're free to draw our own conclusions that he hasn't.

We're discussing civilians. Can you see the difference?

[Ta1kinPeace]

Also a lot of the frothing about tax returns clearly shows that people do not understand how they work.

(a) My business is a company : therefore my address is on the Companies House website. DH's business is a company. Our address is on his website and at Companies house
the strangest people we have coming to the door are my clients

(b) I did a clients tax return yesterday. The first page had his personal details. Then there were three numbers - Turnover, costs, taxable profit. Then there was his tax calculation
it tells you nothing at all about his lifestyle or family income

(c) Benefits should be included - well yeah, tax credits already are listed. So what.

(d) Tax returns are not "wealth returns" - they list the income in the year. Some people who are living off capital may have no income but spend loads

(d) gift income is never taxable so money given to people for whatever purpose will never show

So Tax returns are useful but not particularly intrusive.
Only those who do not deal with them think they are.

[Ta1kinPeace]

sparechange
^Which then begs the question, why hasn't HMRC picked up that they weren't paying enough tax and adjusted their tax code/sent them a bill?
Or has HMRC been abolished in favour of citizen tax inspectors in your brave new world?^
Do you deal with HMRC much?
I do on a daily basis.
HMRC are massively under resourced and have been reorganised into incompetence in many instances.

[MuseumOfCurry]

Talkin. we're all aware of the fact that a tax return is not a wealth return (but why not, really? Is that too invasive?). For the vast majority of the country, they are one and the same.

(d) gift income is never taxable so money given to people for whatever purpose will never show

You'll surely know that gifts given in the seven years preceding the giver's death are indeed taxable, which is when an awful lot of gifts are exchanged.

[Itsgonnabeacoldone]

Also a lot of the frothing about tax returns clearly shows that people do not understand how they work.

Agreed.

Espically with HMRC, they are a totally mess with all the restructuring and how under resouced they are.

[Ta1kinPeace]

Curry
You'll surely know that gifts given in the seven years preceding the giver's death are indeed taxable, which is when an awful lot of gifts are exchanged.
I know the IHT rules - I was at a budget briefing as the sun came up this morning.
But parents who fund their children
or people who collect money through online campaigns / sites
or lottery winners
or gamblers
that received money appears on no tax return.