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AIBU?

To take all my son's toys away and leave him with nothing?

81 replies

DeepSeaDiving · 12/03/2017 12:41

I don't know if this is the right thing to do Sad he's 7. We have always used a "calm down corner" and it has worked amazingly. However, he's a big boy! Very tall and I struggle to pick him up now, so we have had to get rid of it, as I can't put him back, but it has worked great for 5 years!

I've started a new technique of removing toys and putting them in a box on top of our shelves. They go there for around an hour, so he can calm down. It works great if it's the toy that's causing him to be 'naughty' (throwing it/not playing nicely, etc.) but if it's nothing to do with the toy, it really has no effect as he isn't even using the toy. He currently has no toys left, yet none of the reasons are even related to toys, so I find it isn't effective as it used to be when he had the "calm down corner" for other things and toy removal for related behaviour.

He has nothing right now, is that the right thing? He has bitten me and hurt my arm and it's just covered in scratches and bruises... It looks awful. He has never been like this, only since I have removed all toys, but he's too big to put in the "calm down corner" and that would have worked.

OP posts:
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MiscellaneousAssortment · 12/03/2017 20:14

Ok, I'm not going to shout at you or make you feel bad. I think you're probably feeling very bad already, it must be a horrible feeling for things to be this bad with your son. It will be damaging both of you and your relationship. Which is so sad and upsetting for you.

So, forget about how awful today was, and just look back on it as a learning experience... and by that slightly sanctimonious statement (!) I mean, look back to see what went wrong and how you need to change tactics, then forgive yourself, forgive your little boy and give both you & him a big dollop of love and kindness - this is what you both need.

So now the looking back bit. I am going to give my perspective on what happened and why it's never going to work, but please don't take offence, as I learnt this through my own experiences, and it's not a vague theoretical bee on my bonnet I get out to beat others with... or sting others with? Or... I've definitely got trapped in my mixed metaphors!

As I understand it, you took away one toy at a time across this one day, as some kind of rising tit for tat behaviour and ended up with your DS completely losing it. And you hurt.

Sounds rather like the Cuban missile crisis. Grin

Where each side keeps on engaging and upping the ante until we almost had nuclear war! That's still the closest we've ever got to worldwide nuclear destruction. And it didn't get resolved by all the parties carrying on the posturing and aggression. People had to step away and calm the fuck down, that's one of the hardest things to do. But it saved us from all dying a horrible death so rather glad they were big enough people to do it. Or actually, more likely, that they were surrounded by more cool headed people who persuaded them their dicks would indeed remain in tact if they stepped away from the big red button! Shock Wink

The way you keep control of the situation is that you choose to stop engaging and calm it down by refusing to play your part in escalating the tension, anger, frustration.

It's really hard to do, and it can feel like backing down, or 'letting him win' etc, But it's actually about you maintaining control over the situation, and being the bigger person. By diffusing the situation before you get locked into nuclear war, you keep the attention focused on the most important thing, rather than becoming about control and winning at all costs.

You want to manage your DS behaviour right? That's the bottom line. To teach him to behave in 'good' ways, and to stop him behaving in 'bad' ways.

So you need to give him a reason to behave positively, and less reasons to behave negatively. And a huge part of that is giving him 'an out'. A way of moving out of the fight for supremacy, without having squashed his ego and sense of self esteem/ pride etc. So, take it away from winners and losers. Move it way from you imposing more and more draconian punishments on him until he cracks.

Once you've managed to stop engaging in these types of situations, you'll realise that it's not you 'losing' the war, or giving him the power. It's you saying 'I don't need to win like this, I don't need to fight a little child to be in control, and what's more, I refuse to fight with you'.

Stop before you force the situation into one where there is a struggle for dominance and winning means the other person has to lose.

Who likes to have control forced upon them in a show of strength that leaves them feeling compelled to submit to the will of others?

And if you've got into a situation where the only way you can come out of it as a parent is to up the ante until you 'win', it's time you changed the rules of engagement.

Next time, walk away. Stop trying to make a certain punishment work over and over again. Escalate and lock you and the child until a fight to the death (!) teaches him nothing except that the biggest, strongest, most powerful person gets to win. And that biggest person just keeps on going no matter how aggressive & upsetting it gets, all to impose their will on others.

I think he's already learnt this by the way you say you can't get him to stay in the naughty corner anymore as he's too strong for you to physically force to stay there anymore.

And what else do kids learn from this type of engagement? They learn that bullying weaker children will make them feel better. And they wait, for them to get bigger and stronger so they can win.

Think of it as you stopping being one of the sides in a war. And you taking on a new role, which is you being a bomb defusal expert. And at the moment, your little boy is carrying this huge ticking time bomb around him. And he doesn't know what to do with it or how to get rid of it, except to fight.

Diffuse the bomb.
Then teach him how to manage his feelings.

Which is not just about punishing him for showing bad feelings, although a consequence is fine as part of a bigger set of tools you're using.

I'd make a new 'safe space'. But use it as a real safe space, not a naughty spot for punishment. A place he can go, and you can send him to reset his emotions and help him calm down. So, get him to help make it with you. Ask him what makes him feel calm and safe? What helps him feel better? It should be a nice space, not a bare bit of floor where he can wind himself up more and more! For DS, he has a dark, quiet corner under his bed, which is his reading corner, and it used to have nice cushions & a dragon bean bag type thing to sit and rock /fidget on, which is a big part of processing anger and getting back in touch with himself. Now, he's super lucky and has a seat hammock in that space, which is perfect for regulating mood. Swinging and twisting around is great for him and you can actually see his movements go from angry and agitated, to slower and gentler. Lighting is low, there's just soft stuff and a few books (not his main bookshelves), and no toys, so he can't destroy much, or make a huge mess. And nothing to spark off more battling. I don't go in there, although I could fit, but it's his space, and I want to show him I respect that. I can fit in just next to him, to read books to him, so I can join him, but not take it away from him. so it's definitely his cosy place. And I'm very very clear that if I ask him to go in there, it's not the punishment. It's the place he can go to feel better, then we talk when he's calmer, and also, when I'm calmer. And I do ask for a sorry at the end of talking. And then it's forgotten. Maybe there's a consequence after so not literally forgotten, but no more stinging words or emotions, andnot telling him off again when that happens eg we can't go to x because xxx.

My DS has changed so much since we talk about negative feelings, instead of punishing him for acting on his negative feelings.

I've helped him work out different ways to help him manage feeling angry/ upset/ frustrated/ hurt etc. We talked about a whole load of different ways to deal with being angry, and he chose a couple to try out, and I reminded him in the moment that now would be a great time to try out those ideas he had... and it really helps. Obviously his safe space helps a lot. But also, he likes running up and down the corridor to get the angry energy out (which would turn into destructive behaviour if left to simmer - I think this might be happening with your DS?). He also likes hitting his pillow, and doing forwards rolls or spinning on the spot. I think for DS anger generates alot of physical sensations he can't cope with if made to stay still in a 'time out'.

He also finds spending time on his own helps, and this is a biggie, he felt it was rude to ask to go away when with an adult, but now he knows he can, he can take himself off for a few minutes just as he's starting to feel frustrated, rather than carrying on until explosion point 💥

He's turned back into my lovely boy again, now anger isn't controlling his every move.

Sorry this is so long but I hope some of it might help you. You sounded desperate ...

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Funnyonion17 · 12/03/2017 20:16

Justwantcookies

You are crazy and tbh sound borderline abusive. You are training your kids to be obedient out of fear of you throwing toys away. Hardly teaching them right from wrong. Who on earth bins a 5 year olds toys as a punishment, it's extreme. Your children won't act damaged now no. But mark my words they have a high chance of growing up as anxious individuals, low self esteem and plenty of self doubt.

For your information my son is early naughty, but ya know he is a child. Children can act out, it's part and parcel of growing up. I've never had to upset him by throwing away his possessions either. Just because something works to make them compliant doesn't make it healthy!

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Bizzysocks · 12/03/2017 20:44

Instead of saying an out right no to things I say no but ... so for example

Ds: Can I have another biscuit
Me: No but you can have one after tea
ds: whaaaa I want one now
me: any more of that and you won't be
having one after dinner

Ds: can we go to the park
Me: no but we can go tomorrow after school
Ds: whaaaa I want to go now
Me: carry on and you won't be going tomorrow

This tends to work for us.

I hope you find something that works for you both.

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Justwantcookies · 13/03/2017 10:20

Funnyonion

Thanks for the lesson in child rearing. Nice to know I'm borderline abusive .

For your information my son hadn't grown up damaged, anxious, full of self doubt. He has grown up into a lovely young man who is liked by all and pleasant to be around. He is now 15 and does not even remember that incident.

I remember it though as it wasn't an easy thing to do obviously. Of course it upset him at the time, that's the point of a consequence. He lied about doing something he wasn't supposed to do. Something I watched him do so I know he did it. When questioned he lied. He was 5, 5 year olds lie I'm well aware of that. But its not something we tolerate in our house in order to get yourself out of trouble.

I want my kids growing up knowing if they do something wrong they take responsibility for their mistake. He has 3 chances to tell me the truth. I warned him if he didn't own up his toy would be binned. On the 3rd time of him saying it wasn't him the toy got binned. And I felt horrible but that is what I had said would happen and so that's what would happen. I was hoping the threat would be enough but it wasn't. It wasn't a favourite toy either, I wouldn't have binned a favourite.

There has never been a repeat because he got the message loud and clear. Now, at 15, he takes responsibility for himself and his actions. Many of his friends don't, they blame anyone and anything for stuff they do wrong.

So to call me abusive is just downright goady. He did something wrong and that was the consequence. I also made it very clear he wouldn't be in trouble for the thing he did if he owned up but he chose not to.

There were certain things in our house when my kids were growing up that were not acceptable. They were lying, hitting and swearing. These were zero tolerance things. Of course kids make mistakes and get angry and annoyed but we need to teach them to admit to their mistakes and figure out how to fix them , control our anger without hurting other people and it's fine to be annoyed but sometimes you have to do things you don't want to.

My 'punishment' wasn't extreme . If I'd whipped him that would have been extreme and I have never and will never lay a hand on my children to chastise them.

All my children knew they would be in far more trouble if they did something wrong and then lied about it than if they admitted to the doing wrong in the first place.

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TittyGolightly · 13/03/2017 10:26

He has grown up into a lovely young man who is liked by all and pleasant to be around.

Has he learned to be a people pleaser though? That's not necessarily a good thing either.

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Justwantcookies · 13/03/2017 10:36

No he has grown up to be himself . All of them have and are all very different personalities . He has grown up respectful though and a pleasant human being.

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