To always feel like an outsider?

[bingisthebest]

Wasn't sure where to post this. So sorry if incorrect.
Just find the whole school playground thing such a chore and often I feel uncomfortable. There are cliques but I wish it didn't affect me.
I don't have loads of friends but enough and felt happy with my lot until I had children at school and all these insecurities come out.
My children like t play after school for a bit which is fine and I chat to a few mums. But feel like some grps just make me feel like a lose! Am sure it's prob just me. How do I get a grip!!

[CountClueless]

You will make some really good friends on the school run

Why would you tell people that? Why should they make any friends?

[KERALA1]

I think it's easier if you new in town somewhere where lots of others in same boat. Thinking about it all the friends we met through kids were new or newish in town as well. Must be very hard breaking in somewhere like sea eagle describes.

[feckitt]

You will make some really good friends on the school run. The others don't matter. Don't let them worry you.

[SeaEagleFeather]

Also, from the first school I saw a lot of the parents were born and grew up there and know each other from age 6. They are happy talking to their friends and don't want to move out of the comfort zone especially not to people from different cultures. Which is fine, but the word 'clique' does apply then. They make excuses to avoid playdates with anyone except their friends' children, no matter who asks them.

In the second school there is a mix of people who'd grown up together in the same area and people from more varied backgrounds. The people who'd grown up together still tend to stick together but somehow with a more open approach. They'll entertain the idea of playdates with different children.

I don't know why there is the difference between the two schools, but there is one. Pretending that cliques don't exist is just silly or naive. But caring too much about them - well, there's no point if it's for your own sake, look for your friends elsewhere through hobbies etc. If your children are finding it hard to get playdates though, that's a different matter. 'Then the cliques are damaging.

Only proviso: if you're new in an area it's really natural to want to make friends and the school gate is a place where you find lots of people!

[domestichiefofstaff]

It may help that I genuinely don't care what they think of me! I'm a plumpish old boot but I'm comfortable in my own skin. Take me as I am - happy to share the wine in my fridge with anyone who risks a smile, a friendly comment. The cliques miss out on sooooooo much

[domestichiefofstaff]

I find the best thing to do is just be nice to everyone- cliques are borne out of insecurity and a lack of emotional intelligence. The cliquey groups at my school prob think I'm a bit of a Pratt but they can't get me for being impolite or stuck up!

[SeaEagleFeather]

What's the difference between a friendship group and a clique?

friendship groups are open to the idea of other people joining. Cliques are just for them, and them alone

Son's first school was full of cliques who froze everyone else out. If one of the clique was alone, they'd never talk to others. If another of their clique came along, they'd instantly drop the outsider.

Second school is full of friendship groups, but if one of them is alone they'll talk to others and complete the conversation or even stay with the person they;re talking to.

I don't talk to many people in the play ground in either school but my goodness you can tell the difference by observing how the parents behave and by the atmosphere.

[gandalf456]

Sometimes is the above. Others, it's useful stuff about the school or a bit of a.joke (but not many at my school at the moment -there are some.very serious people).

I do believe you have to 'network' to a point as you can rely on one another for support eg if a sibling is sick and you or they need a lift to school. It's a bit like with neighbours really - it's nice to have someone put your bin out and keep an eye on your house while on holiday.

I'm on my 2nd and last child at primary . I no.longer have huge expectations other than the above. If I do make friends for life it's a bonus. Sometimes, though, I am not sure it works with the school dynamic. Too complicated and too claustrophobic

[KERALA1]

The weather
What you or they have done that day - which then leads on to any random topic about your own or their work or activity
The current topic of the day for school - whether older dc got into which school, book day nonsense etc

Saying anything negative about anyone else - absolutely never

[Derlei]

Genuine question - but when you're "chatting to other Mums" while you're waiting around or watching the kids play, what do you talk about?? I just can't see me making any meaningful conversation other than boring small talk, which sometimes is worse than not talking at all!

If I was stood with a group of mums and they're talking about current affairs, or the school, or something I could contribute to, then I think I'd be fine. If they're talking about so and so who lives round the corner, or the fun night out they had, or the cake they ate at their coffee date the other week, then I would feel exactly like the OP and I would probably be avoiding them

[gandalf456]

I'll have to look out for that

[RubyWinterstorm]

There is a new series in the making, think the pilot is on bbc i player, called motherhood/motherland or something?

Very funny and looks like it was lifted STRAIGHT of MN!

Watch it

[RubyWinterstorm]

All this coffee drinking is just killing time, I always think of a way out if someone asks me to have coffee as I need to walk the dog/get some hours work in/would rather play tennis

I meet up for dog walks, as that is sociable and useful, but sitting down with a coffee... it feels like wasting time

[yerbutnobut]

There are cliques, identifiable by their common ground of slating other kids and parents and this seems to be the glue that bonds them, done school run for over 10 years and heard enough in my time, been subject to some of the cliques nasty comments, based on hear say. There are also just parents who stand and talk to one another about nicer subjects that dont entail tearing other people down.

[RhodaBorrocks]

I drop and run because of work. I've made friends with other mums outside of school at DS social groups, mostly fellow outcasts as we all have DC with SEN.

I don't always have enough adult contact as a single mum so I sometimes get too excited and talk too much, but no one's ever frozen me out for it, though I'm probably annoying at times. I do listen well though when others are talking!

I suffer from anxiety so I don't always push for coffee and play dates, but I know if I want to make friends I have to get involved. I volunteer to help with groups and activities and I have also made a diverse group of friends through a hobby I got into to get me out of the house a few times a month. Since pushing myself to do that I couldn't give a stuff about the school mums any more.

[gandalf456]

I agree but I do also agree with others who've said there's an element of unfriendliness and exclusivity in many situations where you have a large amount of people. To say that all you have to do is smile and be nice is probably a tad optimistic. Sometimes you might end up kissing frogs The key is not to take it personally and learn who not to approach

[Desperina]

I've been an outsider all my life and although I'm not at the school stage yet I fully expect this to continue. I'm sort of a proud outsider these days though.

[RubyWinterstorm]

Countclueless, that is the million dollar question!

I think it may be be ause it transports people back to their own childhood, in their mind.

I reckon the ones who worry about cliques had the same worry as a child?

[gandalf456]

Op. You are doing better than you think. You chat and are friendly to those who reciprocate. That's all you have to do. If others want to be odd and not respond, it really is their issue and no reflection on you or your dc.

Personally, I have found play dates have worked better with the friendlier ones anyway.

Also, sometimes it pays to hang back just a little. Kids' friendships can be fickle and if you are great mates with the parents, it can be difficult when they arent friendly anymore.

I think it's a funny environment. I know it doesn't particularly suit me and I know that to be true of lots of people. I am not great where everybody's different yet the same

[CountClueless]

Oh right NotCaryl that is different, we are talking about school gate friends, and cliques

This is the exact point, HOW is it different? When you thought the poster was talking about a group of friends who happen to be at the school gate, you said people were afraid of groups like that, they are a clique, they have a playground mentality, etc etc. But if they are the same friends, doing the same thing, literally anywhere else but the school, its completely acceptable and normal behaviour.

What is it about the school gate that you think changes the whole thing so much?

[KERALA1]

Yorkshire I really wouldn't worry. Even if you work you will find yourself meeting up with other parents whether you like it not - birthday parties, activities etc. Several of a group of friends I have met through school work full time. Your friendships or not don't impact on the children they make their own friends.

It is great if you happen to get on with your DCs friends - a lucky bonus. Always good to make new friends plus its brilliant having a support network for childcare emergencies and to share lifts as they get older. I have got Brownies\Guides runs down to one way per fortnight result!

[WhooooAmI24601]

I work at DS2's school so am rarely on the playground at home time to join in the conversations. Fortunately he's in a class with lovely children so I've got to know some of the parents through parties and get-togethers. Hardly anyone is clique-y or rude.

DS1's infant school class was hard work. Definite cliques and groups who never spoke or mingled. I let it go and focussed on making friends elsewhere, but looking back I wasn't working at the school at the time so probably had a lot more time to dwell on the clique-y nature of them than I do now, and being on the playground every day meant I noticed it far more.