Benefit Britain - the irony

[Mhoys]

Years ago there was no Housing Benefit as far as I remember - talking about growing up in the 1960s. Or even Child Tax Benefits, etc etc. Now it seems so many people get these, even people working in reasonably good jobs. The Government is meant to be anti-benefits but expenditure on all this must be significant. Some of this may be due to a small rise in living standards since then. But also have wages become so low relative to living costs, that the state is effectively subsidising private enterprise? There is nothing necessarily wrong with this I guess, but isn't the government "in denial" when few ordinary people could afford a family or rent or buy a home in the South at least , so the taxpayer/State has to stump up? I have some thoughts but am also genuinely puzzled ...

[RandomMess]

The working class (myself included, if you need to work in paid employment in order to afford your home & eat then you are working class IHO) will see a drop in living standards, it is going to go back to the 60s - multi generational living is going to become more common. Also adult children will be staying with parents, saving hard, partying less etc in order to move out with their partner.

We can never build enough homes for it to be back to the "good years" that was an economic blip and sadly we all need to accept that even though we don't like it

[user1471439240]

Why is it that 80 percent of employees in the workhouse that is the Sports Direct super warehouse are foreign nationals.
Why is that?
What is the link between that and tax credits?

[Charley50]

I agree too OP and hope you come back. The government wants the UK to be a low wage economy I suppose so we can compete with other low wage economies.
Employment rights are disappearing and more and more types of jobs are becoming part time insecure contracts, if not zero hours.

[laurzj82]

Have my very first

[ShirleyKnotReboot]

Sorry, wrong link - although that one is quite interesting as it concerns parliamentary passes And lobbying.
here is one small example of the sorts of jobs up for grabs by former fucking chancellors. I mean, it's just ridiculous really.

[smallfox2002]

User.. you've nearly got MN bingo there, go on throw in one about your gifted children and you are there.

[Lunchboxlewiswillyoumarryme]

They must be giving out more in benefits and pensions than they take in....it will go bust at some point..look at Greece for example..I expect that is our future...no I'm not being a drama larma

[clam]

Why is that, laurzj82?

Have you read the thread at all?

[BillSykesDog]

RTFT Laurz. Or at least the OP properly. You just really shown yourself up there.

[ItsJustNotRight]

Randonmess Why can't we build enough homes?

[ThisIsStartingToBoreMe]

People in the UK have always received subsidies. Before tax credits were invented, people got tax concession through their salarys for being married and having children.

No different to the tax credits people get today.

[laurzj82]

My apologies OP. Have just read the thread properly. I shouldn't have been so reactionary

[Ta1kinpeece]

itsjust
Ah, the missing homes myth,
put about by about by those clever young things on secondment to DCLG from the housebuilders

The UK has over 500,000 empty homes
THe UK has over 1,000,000 second homes which are empty much of the time
the UK pays millions of pounds in council tax subsidy to under occupying rich people (single widow in a 5 bed band H for example)

Council tax is a joke - a three bed semi in Doncaster pays more than a 22 bed mansion in Kensington
Council tax should extend to band Z
It should double for rich under occupied people

and then house building

there are 450,000 plots with full planning permission that the developers keep on hold to choke prices
abolish planning permission renewal and that would cease

in short
the UK housing crisis is political not real

a bit like the NHS funding crisis

and the Corporation tax crisis

ad infinitum

[LadyMC1]

Ok will someone please explain to me what the is all about?!

[Pisssssedofff]

I look at the actual "job" I do and it's a non job, so so many people are doing bullshit jobs just moving money from one place to the other and back again and get paid for it. We don't make anything really, don't build much, we live too long, get too fat and destroy everything around us in the name of progress.
If we took away the benefits, in what ever shape tax credits, tax allowances etc we'd be shown up for what we are in reality. Bankrupt a long time ago.

[ItsJustNotRight]

Rents in Britain were controlled by act of Parliament from1915 until that was abolished and replaced with the Housing Act 1988. This made renting property as an investment far more attractive than it had previously been and the buy to let landlord was born. So those that have the money to buy property make more and those that don't, fill the pockets of those that do.

[BillSykesDog]

I would suggest a levy on a company dependent on how many of their employees would receive tax credits if they were a member of hypothetical family x. Not on those who actually receive them, that would discourage employing parents. But they're causing this cost but making massive profits so they should contribute.

[BillSykesDog]

People accusing the OP of posting a goady trolling benefits bashing thread LadyMC. Which it isn't at all.

At least you had the decency to apologise Laurz, you're the only one who has!

[PikachuSayBoo]

Iirc correctly it was Tony Blair who introduced working family tax credit wasn't it?

[ItsJustNotRight]

I think this is a really good thread, thanks to OP. It's certainly not about benefit bashing, more exasperation with the fact that working people are so inadequately paid for their work that they need housing benefit and tax credits in addition to their wages to survive. Its good to question why this is rather than accept that's just how it is.

[EnthusiasmDisturbed]

I think you have raised some very interesting questions

How can we have got to the point where so many working people are needing tax credits or other benefits to get by it just shouldn't be that way

Who really earns from this and jow can things be changed

[rainbowunicorn]

There seem to be some people on this thread who should brush up on their reading and comprehension skills. They seem to have skimmed over the OP, picked out a few words and made up the rest themselves.

I have just shown my 15 year old the OP and he was able to comprehend what the poster was saying without any difficulty.

[user1471453629]

It's an interesting thread OP and certainly something that should be discussed.

One point I want to raise also because Tesco appears to be the criminal of choice on this thread! I worked for Tesco 20 years ago as an 18 year old. Back then I was being paid slightly more than the current minimum wage for that age group, about £5.60 per hour. All over 18s were treated the same (and under 18s only had a slightly lower wage). A decent wage, double time on Sunday and bank holidays, time and a half when you went over 35 hours a week, generous holiday, staff discount and subsidised canteen. Back then you could afford a home and a decent standard of life on a Tesco store assistant income.

They were not required by law to pay us what they did so it must have been a business decision and I highly doubt it was out of the goodness of their hearts. The current rates of pay are not significantly higher than I was being paid, they have certainly not increased in line with inflation so in real terms are much lower. But the cost of living has rocketed.

The reasons are undoubtedly myriad but it needs looking at as to how everything has become so fucked up. The majority of today's "scroungers" could have afforded a decent standard of living not far back.

[LadyMC1]

Thanks Bill

[Atenco]

Silly OP, got put off by a few authentic goady fuckers. We won't win the revolution that way.