To think the government should do more about alcohol?

[GiraffeTastic]

Smoking cigarettes has been targeted by successive governments to improve public health, now you can't even see packs on display in shops, massive warnings on packets etc.

However, alcohol, which is another drug linked to cancer, heart disease etc is freely viewable in supermarkets, comes in pretty bottles and the manufacturers advertise it and seem to have made wine a regular product for many people. I know that cigarettes carry passive smoking risks, but what about all the lives destroyed by alcohol problems?

Aibu to think both should be treated in a similar way by the government? I'm not suggesting banning them, but if cigarettes are in plain packets shouldn't wine and spirits be also?

[Skiptonlass]

buckin that's a very interesting point. I'd like to think they base it on 'how much you can drink without reaction times being affected' but I have a strong feeling that it's as a pp above says and it's been capped at 'roughly a couple of drinks' because that 'sounds reasonable' and less might spark a revolt.
I've dealt with government departments and science/medicine in the past and there are very, very few politicians who understand basic science, medicine or statistics. Plus add in the political side and you rarely get the result that's scientifically recommended. The actual units per week recommendations were pretty much pulled out of thin air - they vary hugely around the world.

The inability of politicians to understand (and unwillingness to implement even if they do unless politically expedient) is something I learned the hard way.

I don't think alcohol should be banned. I do think it should be regulated a bit more and I definitely think there needs to be much better help for those who need it. Sitting in a beer garden with a nice glass of something is a real pleasure and most of us can imbibe without issue.

Humans have always sought out mind altering drugs. Caffeine, coca, alcohol, hallucinogens... I think it's something that runs very deep within us.

[Marynary]

It was reduced in Scotland a couple of years ago. I think that they are probably waiting to see if it reduces accidents. Societys attitudes to drink driving has changed a lot over the years so I doubt there will be much resistance.

[treaclesoda]

Or her constituency, of course

[treaclesoda]

I didn't mean that the public would be voting directly I meant that am MP would be looking at the population of his constituency and thinking 'am I representing their interests by voting to lower the drink drive limit? Would they vote for me at the next election if I do? '

[Andrewofgg]

What's the point in a government that won't govern and leaves everything to endless referenda?

I would like to establish how much alcohol you can have in your body without drinking by e.g. natural fermentation and fix the limit a bit higher than that.

[Buckinbronco]

No one has even been given the chance to vote to change the drink driving limit- I don't think for a second the government would allow the general public to make a decision like that

[Andrewofgg]

RiverTam You want the portrayal of alcohol in the media "monitored".

If you don't mean censored what do you mean?

If you mean censored - who is to censor which media and on what criteria?

What else do you want censored?

[treaclesoda]

Very true that small rural restaurants won't have much lobbying power! I suppose what I was thinking (although didn't type!) was along the lines of MPs whose constituency areas are largely rural probably won't vote for a lowering of the limit because both the business owners and the people who want to use the business are likely to be potential voters.

[Buckinbronco]

It's absolutely a political decision treacle but very, very heavily based on Science and the political side is more about what people can be expected to reasonably follow than the affect on business. Small rural restaurants don't tend to have much lobbying power, lol

[TrueBlueYorkshire]

I think we should ban it, it means all the lower and middle class can work harder and anyone with any real wealth will still be able to buy whatever they like and consume it in private venues, as is the case now for things like cocaine. We could then convert all of the pubs in town into coffee shops that only sell decaff, lactose and sugar free coffee as we all want to optimise our lifespans..

Things such as education and adjustments to the drink driving limit are sensible. Anything else you can go jump in a lake as far as i'm concerned.

[treaclesoda]

Sorry, posted too soon. I mean that I'm guessing that is how they have to approach it, I'm not making a statement of facy, because I don't know for sure.

[treaclesoda]

I think it's naïve to think that the drink drive limit is set in isolation and is based solely on safety. I'd guess it's more of a 'what can we get away with whilst still keeping people as safe as possible'?

There are rural restaurants and pubs that will lose business if people can't come and have a long leisurely lunch and a small drink alongside it. People will just opt to stay at home instead, or to go to a city venue where they can take public transport. The government are balancing the economy with safety when they set the limit.

[Marynary]

One drink certainly didn't effect my reaction times in the tests I did a few years ago whilst it hugely effected a couple of people (both were small and not used to alcohol). I think it is safer not to drink just in case, but it is important to realise that not everyone is the same.

[madein1995]

I completely agree with banning any drinking alcohol then driving at all. Not because one drink affects me, but it could affect others and besides one drink when I've had a paracetamol, have a cold, not thinking right, could be dangerous behind a wheel. Ond drink is too much to drive and I think drink driving is one of the worst things a Hyman can so, and its a crime where I have no sympathy for the perpetrators

[Buckinbronco]

Skipton I think it's interesting that you say 1 drink affects reaction times and you think the drink drive limit is too high- do you think the government just make it up? They have a whole research organisation just for transport evaluating this sort of thing.

[Buckinbronco]

IMO the problems with cannabis crack or heroin aren't actually the behaviour of users. There are so many things that make it a poor comparison. I'm going to leave out cannabis but in terms of the other drugs you mention they are not regulated or controlled. So crack for example, can have an extremely unpredictable reaction as a one off. Bad heroin obviously frequently kills.

A heroin user isn't particularly likely to act Strangely in public whilst high but they will be committing a crime when they buy their drugs- drug dealing destroys communities and corrupts generations. It takes up police resource, it exploits people. The addiction is hard and fast.

You may not like the alcohol industry but it's not a fair comparison

[Skiptonlass]

Even one drink affects me, I know that for sure. I'd never, ever even have one and drive.

An absolute zero level for drink driving isn't practical because many common foods do contain small quantities of ethanol. Yoghurt and fruit juice for example, can easily have about 0.7% in.
I do think the limit should be lowered though - currently you can have a couple of drinks and drive and I think that is far too much. It does affect reaction times, even if you're one of those who can have a few before you feel the effects.
There was an interesting experiment done on divers once. As they go deeper breathing air the nitrogen causes a narcotic effect. You don't tend to feel this until 25+ m down.
They took them down to 10m and gave them simple sums to do. ALL were significantly impaired, regardless of how they felt. Something similar happens with alcohol- you may not feel at all pissed but you are impaired.

I think of your friends are tedious fools after one you may need new friends! Mine would have one, or two, or none over food and a BBQ and be pretty much the same. I've not had a drink now for a couple of years (pregnant/breastfeeding/gone off it somewhat) but maybe I just don't hang out with crashing bores/heavy drinkers...

[EveryoneElsie]

Prohibition doesnt work. Saudi Arabia is a perfect example of that.
So was the USA during prohibition there.

For all the people complaining about it, I doubt it has any real impact on their lives at all.

[TheWitchesofIzalith]

I hate alcohol.

I hate what it does to people, how they act, that they drink drive, that it releases inhibitions and makes abuse more likely.

I'd totally ban it if I thought it was entirely possible.

This is exactly how I feel, though I know it's totally unrealistic. It just pisses me right off that despite the fact alcohol is a DRUG which is just as harmful, if not more so than some of the illegal drugs, we as a society (and pay for) have to put up with the constant problems it creates...addiction, violence, criminal behaviour etc.

Oh, but that's ok because alcohol isn't 'really' a drug, right? It's socially acceptable to be under the influence to a certain degree, so who cares?
I'd be interested to see what people who say things like that would say if every Friday and Saturday night scores of people were milling about town centres stoked up on cannabis, or crack or heroin.
Because alcohol is just as much a mind-altering drug as those.

[Buckinbronco]

Mitzy I think you're right. It's probably growing up in an atmosphere where people lie about how much they've drunk. people don't change after 1 drink

[Buckinbronco]

I think people care get a bit over excited about alcohol to be honest. Alcoholism is very, very serious and usually takes a very large amount of alcohol over a very long period to affect health, yet society doesn't seem to adquetely acknowledge that, lest it's seen as condoning getting pissed occasionally.


an alcoholic is addicted to alcohol. It isn't someone who goes out once or twice a month and gets so pissed they fall over and smash their face in, or vomits. That person may be a problem drinker but that is not the same thing.

And then the label of dependency. The poster above states that more people are dependant than they think.

I know you'd put me under that umbrella. I love drinking, especially wine. Booze features in all my celebrations and many of my social engagements. I have friends who I only ever see to catch up over a bottle of wine. I love pubs and bars and restaurants and wine tasting and pub gardens in the sun.
I don't have as much fun when there is no booze as its such a big part of my culture. I don't cause anyone any harm as far as I know, and apart from the off beer fear for stupid dancing etc and awful hangovers a few times a year it doesn't affect my life negatively.

DH and our family and friends are very similar. Our children are probably affected in a way as they come to pubs and restaurants with us and see booze being drank frequently. They are very young but I suppose we'll rein it in a bit as they get old enough to recognise drunkness and just do it after they go to bed.

It's part of our life. How is that negative? It just is what it is. People who don't like alcohol see it as negtive but it's not clear why

[treaclesoda]

LadyAntonella I think the poster was referring to illnesses which might cause loss of balance or slurred speech. People often see someone behaving that way and assume they are drunk, and judge accordingly, when actually it is something totally unrelated to alcohol.

[MitzyLeFrouf]

I think all drugs should be legalised. The current system isn't doing a whole lot of good for anyone is it? Except the drug dealers of course. The business of misery that they deal in is going just fabulously.

[EveryoneElsie]

LadyAntonella Yes of course.
When judgemental people see a drunk person on the street and pass comment, what they dont realise is that the person may not be drunk. They may have a medical condition. Or be pregnant.

The comments made along the lines of 'I can always tell when someone has had a drink' are not factual. They are an opinion.
You may be able to tell if a persons behaviour is different. But you dont always know the reason for that change.

[MitzyLeFrouf]

It's always obvious when a person has had one drink? No it really isn't.

In my experience the people who say things like that are the people who've grown up in a home where alcohol was a problem.