Paying for private school a poor investment in kids' future

[womblesofwestminster]

AIBU to wonder what all the private-school-paying parents think of this? (I know MN has a disproportionate amount of them).

"The research shows that a private-school education may help you get to university, but is of no help once you are there and of no help later once you try to enter the workforce"

www.tourismportdouglas.com.au/Paying-for-private-school-a-poor-investm.11742.0.html

Ahem.

I'm not a private school paying parent, but if I was, opinions like those in the article wouldn't make any difference to me, because I parent individual children, not the results of studies.

I might also be glad that the article says that my child is more likely to go to university, seeing as that's something I would like for my children.

A 2011 Sutton Trust report found 48% of independent school pupils were accepted into the 30 most selective universities, compared with 18% for comprehensive schools and the average for all schools being 23.8%

We chose a (very relaxed) private prep school because our DCs hated the village school and the wrap around child care meant that it was affordable. We then used mostly state secondaries because DDs chose them and have used private tutors as / when DCs wanted help. The mix has proved successful in that DCs have grown up pretty confident but non- entitled, if that makes sense. Never really thought of it as an investment, which is probably just as well as (expensively educated) DD2 does a minimum wage job that she loves.

Really womble can I share you data on mn having dispro(sp) no of them>

I would say, just have a look at the how this thread will unfold. 6% of children are privately educated; in a 'regular' cohort of the population, very few parents will send their child to private school. However, there will be vast numbers of people coming onto this thread and saying how they chose private school. And of course, how buying societal advantage for their children never entered their sweet little unworldly-wise heads.

The summer born thing is a well known thing - most teachers I've encountered are very aware of it. I have an august boy and although he is fine academically - he was definitely slower to catch up both emotionally and socially to his peers.

I'm sure I read something on here which showed that mn did have a disproportionate number of private school parents - perhaps from when they did their last survey?

cruikshank whilst many of us recognise the advanatage it gives, we didn't necessarily choose to go independent for that reason if you see what I mean.

I didn't look at my three year olds and think 'aha, how can I best ensure jobs at Goldmans for them?'

oh this has descended into presonal anecdote already.
There was a great thing on radio 4 about 15 years of academic research into what makes schools successful.
NOT
class size
extra curricular
academies
private schooling
uniform

ETC

the main thing was good passionate teachers. And not always in private schools. I do commend you to listen to it. It also says we should measure schools by progress not attainment - which many educationalists have argued for years.

I went to private school and my DH went to a very grotty inner city state school we met at University on the same course. I hated school because it was so goal orientated although I did well academically and have gone on to have a career I love. My husband didn't mind school and has also done very well academically and in his career. Both our children go to state school and are doing very well. I think my parents wasted money sending me to private school because I think I would have done just as well at state school and would have been a lot happier I believe the most important thing that gets you on in life is emotional support at home, access to as many broad life experiences as possible and good manners.

Well Kablooger, the OP asked a question and some of us answered as to why we'd chosen private schools.

I think my children's school does have excellent and passionate teachers and this is reflected in the amount of extra-curricular stuff the staff offer. And how enthused my children are by what they're learning at school.

But I should know by now that this is an area where people will never really agree on mn, a bit like any type of selective education even if its free.

The summer born thing is massive. My DS was 16 yesterday on GCSE results day. It took him years, if at all to catch up with Autumn born children, particularly the girls.

And also, what do you do if your local catchment school isn't full of wonderful and passionate teachers? If you have the funds then I think a lot of people would look to where they could get those types of teachers for their children.

My parents sent us all to fee-paying schools, eventually. I don't think they feel disappointed in how we have turned out.

The article is saying that two students who gained the same results at the end of secondary school, one from private one from state, will do just as well financially in life.

If you assume that the privately educated pupil achieved more at GCSE as a result of the private education, their outcomes for life have significantly improved. They are on a par with higher achieving state pupils than they otherwise would have been.

Cruikshank has a point re social advantage

As well as not trying to buy advantage, I don't suppose those choosing private education have any interest in selecting certain social cohorts and avoiding their child mixing with 'lower class' pupils. Or is it that these reasons remain largely unspoken?

I agree that kids of equal ability will likely get better grades in the private sector. But, purely from my own observation, I reckon kids from comprehensives get much lower university offers.

My own DS got in a good university with pretty mediocre A levels. He is now outperforming lots of privately educated kids who got in with As. He reckons some of them must've been pretty spoonfed.

oh the social thing is A HUGE factor in why kids choose private.
they want kids to mix with people like them :(

until all schools are state we will sadly still have a huge social chasm between the havs ( see Cameron and his cronies) and the have nots.
Such a huge gap between incomes is terrible for the whole country.

If you read this book, he makes the point most eloquently about the success of the Finnish education model and the impact of egalitarianism in other scandanavian countries

www.amazon.co.uk/Almost-Nearly-Perfect-People-ebook/dp/B00FZLTYPQ/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=undefined&sr=8-2&keywords=perfect+people

I think that there are many reasons to send DC to private school. DH and I have very different views based on our own educational background. He went to a fantastic grammar school which was very academic. He thinks that all/most state schools are great.

I went to two state comps and it was awful. Academics were sidelined to allow for behavioural control and the teachers were just trying their best to pull children up to gain the most basic of grades. They were fighting a losing battle against parental indifference. At uni I was on a competitive course where only 10% of us were state educated.

I would dearly love to send my DC to private school. It was one of the things I struggled most with when we were deciding whether DH should be a sahp. It's not just the educational aspect but the extra curricular activities and general ethos.

Speaking personally as a working class person with a DH, both of whom had very few qualifications on leaving school. I work in an average wage job, DH in a Min Wage job. IQ tests put DH and I over 135. DS's have not to the best of my knowledge been tested.

We have 3 DS's who were educated after primary school with a bequest from my DGM who bought a house in London in the 1960's, which was sold in 2001, with the will proviso offering private education at secondary level, offered to my DC's with the sale of the house, or we could live in the house to be sold when the DC's were over 21yo and the money distributed around various relatives. We took the first option, with agreement from the relatives. They were old at the time, and likely to have passed away if we stopped living in it.

My DS's are now an officer in the British Army, a Civil Engineer, and a Published Composer.

None of which would be possible, or was expected when they left primary school as they were labelled as being 1. Overly excited about sport, 2. Overly obsessed with maths actually a maths genius and 3. Over emotional about music and drama.

Private all the way in my opinion. They are supportive, and encouraging of the kid who doesn't fit the mold.

ChickenFajitaAndNachos ... you are my friend! My DS in Y4 and a summer birthday has still not caught up with the Sept/Oct born girls - in terms of work levels almost there, but in terms of maturity levels, not even close. I'm not sure ever will (perhaps in his 30's!). In reception he was so not ready to be there, yet the girls were on top form! It really does make a difference for some children at that age. Obviously not all. I did OK in state school, though could have done much better if pushed (or if I'd had more motivation).

Wow. As someone who could never think of affording private education (or even home ed) regardless of whether my DCs have additional needs or are bullied, I feel inadequate.