To really hate the "JSA is a pittance" opinion

[sezamcgregor]

I'm currently reading a lot about the Working Class in Victorian times - you know, when if you had a lazy husband who didn't work, you had to live in buildings condemned as unfit for human habitation with a different family in each room, lived on a diet of black bread and weak tea and watched your children slowly die of starvation. Or you worked in the mills (or similar), and you had to choose between pulling your children out of school as soon as they were old enough to work to get the meagre income that they would bring to the household or letting them get some kind of an education.

If you are unemployed now - you get your rent paid, council tax paid plus an amount of money given to you to buy food and other luxuries.

I'm so bored of having the conversation with people about how difficult it is to manage on £70 per week - even with Tax Credits, Child Benefit etc. Yeah, try telling our grandparents that

[Nymeria01]

"food and other luxuries", how is the basic ingredient of life a luxury. You, like everyone who bashes benefits, are clearly not very intelligent.

[Nymeria01]

"Try telling our grandparents that". Well mine were the first generation to buy their house and they always had secure work (in fact my grandmother could chose not to work). They lived in a time when the economy worked for everyone and their was less need for a welfair state.

[0pheliaBalls]

Nymeria spot on.

Also please explain how winter coats/shoes for DCs is a 'luxury'? Same goes for smart interview clothes. Even charity shops are expensive these days.

[0pheliaBalls]

Also if the government see internet as an essential, and insist on having all their applications done online, then they should bloody well pay enough benefit to cover the cost.

[Darkesteyes]

Opelia she got a detention FFS! She basically got a detention for being on a low income??!!! This is exactly why I was so annoyed when this subject came up on the pensioner thread.
I don't have DC but I find it INCREDIBLY worrying that we have TEACHERS (I appreciate it wont be all teachers but ive seen more than one make those kind of comments on here) TEACHERS thinking and in your DDs case behaving in such a divisive way. I got angry on that pensioner thread. Now I am DISGUSTED as well.

Christ almighty!!

[D0oinMeCleanin]

My home PC often is the local library. Just over a year ago, I had dd1's friend on it all the time using it for homework. Now it's dd2's new friend and her brother, who were both flabberghasted that we had, not only a computer but our own printer too. They know people with old computers, but no-one who has their very own printer. They have neither at home, they have a Hudl that they share between four of them, they got it last Christmas.

That is how normal people on benefits live and it's not easy. These two children are loved and cared for, but what I class as normal life (not just having a computer, but dd2 being allowed to invite friends for dinner, having a pet, being allowed new shoes when hers have worn out without having to wait until next term etc.) often surprises them. I don't begrudge them that Hudl, I feel sad that they only have one and ashamed that my children would probably cry if that is all they got for Christmas, whereas these two were overjoyed.

Oh and our library charges for using their computers, not much mind (I think it's about 50p per 30 minutes) but when you don't have much to start with, not much can be a lot of money.

We live in an area of high unemployment and I don't know anyone like those you see on TV. No-one here has a massive TV or holidays or even birthday parties most of the time.

[SantasLittleMonkeyButler]

Yeah OK .

I don't know when your grandparents lived, but both sets of mine (born between 1901 & 1906) lived in a time where they had the security of a job for life and where they could live well on one wage.

One wage was enough to buy a house, run a small car (when cars became a routine thing to have) and pay for one week every year in Wales and one week every year in Spain (they used to go on a coach & spent most of the week in the coach from what I could make out).

And that particular GF was a Pearl man (Pearl Assurance) - not a Dr, lawyer, accountant etc. etc. Just a normal man in a normal job.

Obviously, it wasn't all easy - that generation also lived through both World Wars for example. However is was a time when life in general was more affordable and jobs were available for anyone willing to work.

If you would like us to live in a country with no welfare provision OP (like the good old days ), where will all of the extra jobs needed be coming from? Shall we reopen the workhouses for those who are too ill to work?

In the UK in 2014, £70 per week is very little to live on. Not impossible, obviously, but no-one is living the high life on it.

[SantasLittleMonkeyButler]

And on the topic of internet being seen as a luxury - DS2's school (and DS1's, but less so) sets homework which has to be completed online or on a computer (powerpoint presentation, whatever that may be!)

DS2 actually got a detention once for failing to print his homework out as our printer had broken & I was having to wait until payday to get a replacement. He had the work on one of those USB stick things but that wasn't good enough apparently.

Although, since I complained about it, that particular teacher has started asking the pupils if they have a USB stick with work on & need to use a printer - according to DS2.

[expatinscotland]

When you swear a car off the road you have to have an off-road place to store it, too. If you have a contract for Internet you must often pay a stiff lump sum to cancel the contract.

[Darkesteyes]

Like I said Santa the attitudes are very very worrying.

[Deverethemuzzler]

violet JSA isn't supposed to be a punishment for being out of work.

Of course the internet is essential. I thought that fact had at last trickled upwards to even the least aware of us.

Clearly not.

In this borough you can't apply for a school place without the internet.

[D0oinMeCleanin]

Tbf, before my children started mixing with other children in this area it would never had occurred to me that people lived without computers, printers and internet in the home

I'd been on IS when dd1 was a baby but already had everything when that happened from working before and had family to help. I just didn't understand life outside of my own little bubble. There were weeks when I couldn't afford a tin of beans, but I had a mobile phone that my GPs paid for and my mum and dad would buy me a bag of fruit and veg each week. All of my friends came from middle class families.

I can see how a teacher could assume that everyone has easy access to these things, but yes, it is worrying.

[Darkesteyes]

D00in I think its lovely that you are helping other kids like that

[0pheliaBalls]

D0o I agree, that's lovely. How kind you are

Darkesteyes that's school policy at DD's school - no homework, no excuses. So she (who was an A* student and had never, ever missed a homework in her life) got her first ever detention through no fault of her own. What made it worse is they also have a policy whereby if you have more than one detention you are excluded from certain activities eg school trips, no uniform days, etc. So basically, punishment for parents' low income. Plus one teacher had her in tears in class because she wouldn't believe DD had no family/friends who could let her use their computer (we have neither unfortunately).

We're still on a low income despite DH working and don't have 'proper' internet or a computer - DD has a tablet which she tethers to my phone. She still has to go to the library to print her homework at a cost of 15p a sheet. Getting expensive now she has lots of long essays to hand in every week.

[ConferencePear]

"I don't know when your grandparents lived, but both sets of mine (born between 1901 & 1906) lived in a time where they had the security of a job for life and where they could live well on one wage.

One wage was enough to buy a house, run a small car (when cars became a routine thing to have) and pay for one week every year in Wales and one week every year in Spain (they used to go on a coach & spent most of the week in the coach from what I could make out)."

There's something wrong with the history here. It may apply to your grandparents but not the general. Lets say a couple born on those dates would get married in the 1920/30s. There was massive unemployment in both those decades and hardly any unemployment pay (unless means tested) and no health service. Most people of that generation did not buy a house.

[D0oinMeCleanin]

It really is no bother to me. I rarely turn the PC on during the day and have random children in out until about 7:30pm most nights, so having one on my computer makes no odds to me.

My friend got a laptop and cheap internet on some kind of inclusion scheme for people on child tax credits. I'm not sure if it is still available but it might be worth looking into.